Quality of anime decreasing?

[Anime Forum]

I don't think there's really an exact year where it just dopped off a cliff but more like it's been steadily getting worse over the years and because of that it's been more noticable as of late when compared to the golden years. I don't really think any of the newer anime mentioned in this thread match up well against the 'classics' of old at all, they're definitely on a lower level imo, not to say that they're bad necessarily (well there are some bad ones imo but that's not the point) just that I don't think they're at or close to the same level of quality. That isn't to say that there aren't some great gems as of recent, hell my favorite anime is from 2010, just that I think that the amount of quality older works outclass and outnumber the recent ones. There's also a lot more anime being made now than back then and the majority of the extra is garbage so the ratio of good to bad is horrendously skewed.

How come people who seem to enjoy bashing new anime love to forget there were plenty of bad older anime, some infact worse than some of bad ones nowadays. I don't disagree with everything you say on this forum, but it has been proven time and time again you suffer from elitist disease. Calling Madoka Magica Rebellion "bad"? If by standards Rebellion is considered bad, then anime is in a great place right now. Sure, old anime can be great and "some" were made really well, but honestly the quality of those good ones and recent good ones aren't really all that different. For example, Cowboy Bebop is amazing without a doubt. Though, don't forget that the anime has been out for fifteen or so years and has had time to carve a legacy beyond anime like Madoka Magica has been able to in three years. Give it twelve years, Madoka Magica or any other huge title out nowadays will be remembered as a huge gem in the ongoing career of anime. The quality as said actually hasn't got really any worse, it is still booming with plenty of great titles and will for years to come.

[Ominous Flare]

Give it twelve years, Madoka Magica or any other huge title out nowadays will be remembered as a huge gem in the ongoing career of anime.

Erm, as much as I LOVE Madoka Magica, let's not jinx it. I heard they're making a new season for it, and considering how people just love to make a sequel out of everything these days for the sheer sake of profit (as opposed to artistic values), I don't have a very good vibe about that.

[Anime Forum]

Erm, as much as I LOVE Madoka Magica, let's not jinx it. I heard they're making a new season for it, and considering how people just love to make a sequel out of everything these days for the sheer sake of profit (as opposed to artistic values), I don't have a very good vibe about that.

A second season has yet to be confirmed, but I'm sure it will get some sort of sequel down the line.

Lets hope whatever happens is good for the franchise!

[Inactive_Account]

How come people who seem to enjoy bashing new anime love to forget there were plenty of bad older anime, some infact worse than some of bad ones nowadays. I don't disagree with everything you say on this forum, but it has been proven time and time again you suffer from elitist disease. Calling Madoka Magica Rebellion "bad"? If by standards Rebellion is considered bad, then anime is in a great place right now. Sure, old anime can be great and "some" were made really well, but honestly the quality of those good ones and recent good ones aren't really all that different. For example, Cowboy Bebop is amazing without a doubt. Though, don't forget that the anime has been out for fifteen or so years and has had time to carve a legacy beyond anime like Madoka Magica has been able to in three years. Give it twelve years, Madoka Magica or any other huge title out nowadays will be remembered as a huge gem in the ongoing career of anime. The quality as said actually hasn't got really any worse, it is still booming with plenty of great titles and will for years to come.

I know there were plenty of bad anime back then too but not as much as there are nowadays (because there's a lot more in production now). I just think that the greats (not necessarily just big-named though the good ones among those 'classics' are included) from back then are better than the recent ones and that the good to bad ratio was better then, it has nothing to do with lasting the test of time or people knowing their names or anything like that but rather my own opinion.

Im not so sure im an elitist, I don't look down on people for liking what I consider bad. I just have opinions that differ greatly from most, I do think most anime is terrible but that's not what an elitist is. When I adamantly say I think something is bad im not stating it like it's fact, my opinion is my opinion of course and I don't think it's any more, I just have conviction in my own opinions and it's not like im going to say "in my opinion" every time and tip-toe around other peoples opinions just because mine is negative or different.

[Anime Forum]

I know there were plenty of bad anime back then too but not as much as there are nowadays (because there's a lot more in production now). I just think that the greats (not necessarily just big-named though the good ones among those 'classics' are included) from back then are better than the recent ones and that the good to bad ratio was better then, it has nothing to do with lasting the test of time or people knowing their names or anything like that but rather my own opinion.

Im not so sure im an elitist, I don't look down on people for liking what I consider bad. I just have opinions that differ greatly from most, I do think most anime is terrible but that's not what an elitist is. When I adamantly say I think something is bad im not stating it like it's fact, my opinion is my opinion of course and I don't think it's any more, I just have conviction in my own opinions and it's not like im going to say "in my opinion" every time and tip-toe around other peoples opinions just because mine is negative or different.

Let's agree to disagree. Probably easier (doesn't seem like any of us are going to budge, lol). By the way, don't think I dislike you or anything. Your posts are just an easy target.

[Ominous Flare]

Im not so sure im an elitist, I don't look down on people for liking what I consider bad. I just have opinions that differ greatly from most, I do think most anime is terrible but that's not what an elitist is. When I adamantly say I think something is bad im not stating it like it's fact, my opinion is my opinion of course and I don't think it's any more, I just have conviction in my own opinions and it's not like im going to say "in my opinion" every time and tip-toe around other peoples opinions just because mine is negative or different.

Understandable. It's tough to share your personal opinions on the net without being attacked or criticised. It's nice to keep things friendly.

And hey, I feel you. I know where you're coming from, that thick atmosphere of mediocrity creeping about modern day anime. I'd say your statement is a bit of nostalgia and a bit of truth combined. I wouldn't dismiss it as complete nostalgia. I mean, like I said before, artistic works today are treated less seriously than back then. You'd hardly see any artwork being labeled a 'masterpiece' on a global scale nowadays.

[Anime Forum]

Understandable. It's tough to share your personal opinions on the net without being attacked or criticised. It's nice to keep things friendly.

And hey, I feel you. I know where you're coming from, that thick atmosphere of mediocrity creeping about modern day anime. I'd say your statement is a bit of nostalgia and a bit of truth combined. I wouldn't dismiss it as complete nostalgia. I mean, like I said before, artistic works today are treated less seriously than back then. You'd hardly see any artwork being labeled a 'masterpiece' on a global scale nowadays.

To be fair. Its a forum so debates and defending your opinions should be expected.

[Inactive_Account]

Let's agree to disagree. Probably easier (doesn't seem like any of us are going to budge, lol). By the way, don't think I dislike you or anything. Your posts are just an easy target.

Well it's not like im annoyed or put-off by it or anything, im just not sure I fit the bill for an 'elitist'. I mean I obviously have pretty high standards and probably evaluate anime in a different way than most people, but it makes it that much better when I find anime that I actually do consider good. I always try to analyze everything in a show, which is why I continue a lot of 'bad' shows because I enjoy analyzing and scoring them/writing reviews on them from time to time. It's like a side-bit to watching anime and helps me get the most out of even shows that I think are bad.

Understandable. It's tough to share your personal opinions on the net without being attacked or criticised. It's nice to keep things friendly.

And hey, I feel you. I know where you're coming from, that thick atmosphere of mediocrity creeping about modern day anime. I'd say your statement is a bit of nostalgia and a bit of truth combined. I wouldn't dismiss it as complete nostalgia. I mean, like I said before, artistic works today are treated less seriously than back then. You'd hardly see any artwork being labeled a 'masterpiece' on a global scale nowadays.

Im not so sure it's nostalgia because I wasn't really into anime way back then and don't really have a nostalgic feel for them. I think it's more that nowadays the tropes and cliches are far more abundant and overused to the point where we get a ton of shows every season that's nothing but those tropes and cliches. I feel like anime nowadays take less risks and mainly go for what sells instead of trying to be artistic and expressive. There's some exceptions of course but I just mean the vast majority. All kinds of media are like that though so it's not like I think anime specifically is the only one getting worse or something.

[Ominous Flare]

All kinds of media are like that though so it's not like I think anime specifically is the only one getting worse or something.

Yeah, I hear you. It's the same with movies, comic books; basically stories of any form. Being original is hardly possible in the technological age.

[SGI]

The overall quality of anime has definitely declined in recent years. If you look at all the new anime released per season, and how many contain one or more of the following words you can see a trend.

“Harem, moe, comedy or slice of life”.

There is actually a simple, yet dull explanation. Japan has been in the grasp or a recession for years, but recently has been much, much worse. Animation companies are, after all businesses and need to make money. Sadly, such an environment means there is much less of a chance for more experimental, complex or challenging projects to get the green light an get produced. To pay the bills, many of the studios have fallen back on more the kind of projects targeted at the die-hard Japanese otaku market. Sadly, this usually means harem perv-fests or moe slice of life titles. These tend to at least allow these companies to break even.

So yeah, so long as the economy in Japan is rubbish, it means that it’s less likely we’ll see any chances be taken at studios, and thus less likely we’ll see anything truly great come from Japan.

[Anime Forum]

The overall quality of anime has definitely declined in recent years. If you look at all the new anime released per season, and how many contain one or more of the following words you can see a trend.

“Harem, moe, comedy or slice of life”.

There is actually a simple, yet dull explanation. Japan has been in the grasp or a recession for years, but recently has been much, much worse. Animation companies are, after all businesses and need to make money. Sadly, such an environment means there is much less of a chance for more experimental, complex or challenging projects to get the green light an get produced. To pay the bills, many of the studios have fallen back on more the kind of projects targeted at the die-hard Japanese otaku market. Sadly, this usually means harem perv-fests or moe slice of life titles. These tend to at least allow these companies to break even.

So yeah, so long as the economy in Japan is rubbish, it means that it’s less likely we’ll see any chances be taken at studios, and thus less likely we’ll see anything truly great come from Japan.

I don't need think quality = complex works. Not sure if you meant that, but in case you did I felt the need to say that. Something can be less complex and still be made really well.

And....

 

Moe is awesome yo

[Ceris]

I'll leave this here for anyone who thinks popularity has gone down.


Sorry for just posting on a tangent instead of the direct topic.

Edit to fix link, greedy people not wanting to share information? Might as well link the page this come from: http://www.projectharuhi.net/?p=5053

[Ominous Flare]

It says "Don't steal our content!!! www.projectharuhi.net"

So... pirating is bad? But it's popular nonetheless...?

[Anime Forum]

It says "Don't steal our content!!! www.projectharuhi.net"

So... pirating is bad? But it's popular nonetheless...?

I saw the image yesterday and it showed evidence anime is more popular now than it was before or something, lol.

[Ceris]

It says "Don't steal our content!!! www.projectharuhi.net"

So... pirating is bad? But it's popular nonetheless...?

Yeah, the image had anti-embed code on it. Maybe I shouldn't have, but I took a screenshot of the image and posted that instead.


As for my opinion on the original topic: I haven't been watching anime for very long, and I admit I have never watched an anime from before 2002, but to say anime's quality is decreasing is like saying all related forms of media in Japan are decreasing as well, light novels, visual novels, and manga, since that's where anime comes from. I think it's too farfetched to say an entire section of Japanese culture has "decreased in quality" and would have to say "it's changed" for a better phrase. People should stop letting nostalgia talk for them.

[Ominous Flare]

I think it's too farfetched to say an entire section of Japanese culture has "decreased in quality"

Which reminds me - quality is subjective for each culture. What we might have felt as a decline in quality might just be due to our dissatisfaction with other non-Japanese mainstream media (American media, for example).

[Anime Forum]

Yeah, the image had anti-embed code on it. Maybe I shouldn't have, but I took a screenshot of the image and posted that instead.


As for my opinion on the original topic: I haven't been watching anime for very long, and I admit I have never watched an anime from before 2002, but to say anime's quality is decreasing is like saying all related forms of media in Japan are decreasing as well, light novels, visual novels, and manga, since that's where anime comes from. I think it's too farfetched to say an entire section of Japanese culture has "decreased in quality" and would have to say "it's changed" for a better phrase. People should stop letting nostalgia talk for them.

I can't speak for the people in this thread, but I completely agree. The anime fans living off nostalgia are becoming more and more laughable every year that passes. Funny thing is, in about five years from now people will be saying anime like Naruto were the good days of anime.

What does that sound like?

 

Nostalgia

So, yeah. My opinion of anime NOT going down in quality still holds firm. I'm sure there are a few people here who will love to disagree, but honestly people need to stop thinking anime was so much better in the 90s- than it is now.

[Ominous Flare]

Funny thing is, in about five years from now people will be saying anime like Naruto were the good days of anime.

Haha, no way. Lupin III was quite a popular classic anime back in the day and even I could recognize that it was flawed. The only really big-time anime I could name off are the ones I truly feel to be well-written (and preferably philosophical) series like the ones I mentioned earlier.

Oh, and just to balance off the old vs. new debate - Legend of the Galactic Heroes. 'Nuff said.

[Anime Forum]

Haha, no way. Lupin III was quite a popular classic anime back in the day and even I could recognize that it was flawed. The only really big-time anime I could name off are the ones I truly feel to be well-written (and preferably philosophical) series like the ones I mentioned earlier.

Oh, and just to balance off the old vs. new debate - Legend of the Galactic Heroes. 'Nuff said.

You'll see. I obviously realize Naruto is garbage, but delusional fans will be saying that.. (just like they do with 90s anime now). Old anime are great, but new ones are also great. Honestly, people who hate new anime and only go on forums / other sites to diss them and never attempt to talk good about anime need a new hobby.

Plus, nobody takes them seriously anyways. Not even my friends with 2000+ completions.

[Ominous Flare]

Honestly, people who hate new anime and only go on forums / other sites to diss them and never attempt to talk good about anime need a new hobby.

Well, as much as I want to agree with your... more than passionate resentment towards such people, I think it's still better to just treat both old and new anime with equal respect. I mean, you can't deny that a number of the old anime broke boundaries in terms of anime storytelling. Evangelion, for example, for all its flaws and plot-holes, brought quite a few new stuff to the mecha genre. Yes, I know other mecha anime probably did those 'new stuff' much better than Evangelion, but you gotta give the anime its due credits.

[SGI]

I don't need think quality = complex works. Not sure if you meant that, but in case you did I felt the need to say that. Something can be less complex and still be made really well.

And....

 

Moe is awesome yo

I agree that something can be less complex and be well written.
I should follow up my point a bit more though. What I mean to say is that the truly memorable titles that last for years in the memory of those who watch it tend to break new ground in terms of writing, plot and characters.

What I am saying is that it is much less likely for chances to be taken insofar as writing, plot, and character direction to be taken. Rather, the current Japanese economy and creative direction insofar as anime goes seems to be to churn out something that appeals to the otaku market and move on. Heck, the last new anime I saw, and stuck with to the end was Shiki, and that came out in 2010.

[Anime Forum]

Well, as much as I want to agree with your... more than passionate resentment towards such people, I think it's still better to just treat both old and new anime with equal respect. I mean, you can't deny that a number of the old anime broke boundaries in terms of anime storytelling. Evangelion, for example, for all its flaws and plot-holes, brought quite a few new stuff to the mecha genre. Yes, I know other mecha anime probably did those 'new stuff' much better than Evangelion, but you gotta give the anime its due credits.

I do give and treat old anime with equal respect with new anime.

The problem lies in the reverse. There aren't that many (at least with all the anime fans I've met) that feel anime really hasn't gotten any worse. I do respect old anime. Wish certain people would respect the reverse. If you don't, that statement is void.

---------- Post added at 03:06 AM ---------- Previous post was at 03:02 AM ----------

I agree that something can be less complex and be well written.
I should follow up my point a bit more though. What I mean to say is that the truly memorable titles that last for years in the memory of those who watch it tend to break new ground in terms of writing, plot and characters.

What I am saying is that it is much less likely for chances to be taken insofar as writing, plot, and character direction to be taken. Rather, the current Japanese economy and creative direction insofar as anime goes seems to be to churn out something that appeals to the otaku market and move on. Heck, the last new anime I saw, and stuck with to the end was Shiki, and that came out in 2010.

I can agree with a couple of your points in a sense, but you haven't watched anime in four years. How can you say the quality is decreasing if you haven't seen anything past Shiki?

[BronyBradyBuddyKiller]

All this talk of bad anime is making me feel depressed...