Should anime be dubbed?

[Gold_Roger]

Thanks to all the new people who posted, especially you, NovaStar (your second post, not your first one; it was rude). I didn't think this topic would catch on. (Maybe I should put it on another forum and see what I get.)

I guess after hearing so much negative attention about dubs, I started to wonder if liking subs more was better because I like dubs, too. I was afraid to admit it.

The only dub and dubbing company I do dislike is...well...you know!

As for the Naruto dub, I don't see the problem here. Besides Ino's voice (it's not working for me personally). And it's Cartoon Network who has been playing with the opening and closing songs (my biggest pet peeve), isn't it?

As for the purists, they really can be very demanding. Some of the stuff they complain about is unfair. In fact, I've rethought the quotes up there.

As for dubbing in general, it's much better in 2007 than it ever was in 1996. Fans, or soon-to-be fans like I was, are much smarter than we used to be. Companies know to pay us otaku some attention.

Almost done, I confess. I watch a lot more dubs than subs. I only watch one real sub regularly which I will not say because I shouldn't repeat myself.

In conclusion, Gold_Roger will be...a subbie and a dubbie!

[NovaStar]

Thanks to all the new people who posted, especially you, NovaStar (your second post, not your first one; it was rude). I din't think this topic would catch on. (Maybe I should put it on another forum and see what I get.)

I guess after hearing so much negative attention about dubs, I started to wonder if liking subs more was better because I like dubs, too. I was afraid to admit it.

The only dub and dubbing company I do dislike is...well...you know!

As for the Naruto dub, I don't see the problem here. Besides Ino's voice (it's not working for me personally). And it's Cartoon Network who has been playing with the opening and closing songs (my biggest pet peeve), isn't it?

As for the purists, they really can be very demanding. Some of the stuff they complain about is unfair. In fact, I've rethought the quotes up there.

As for dubbing in general, it's much better in 2007 than it ever was in 1996. Fans, or soon-to-be fans like I was, are much smarter than we used to be. Companies know to pay us otaku some attention.

Almost done, I confess. I watch a lot more dubs than subs. I only watch on real sub regularly that I will not say because I shouldn't repeat myself.

In conclusion, Gold_Roger will be...a subbie and a dubbie!

^_^;; I didn't mean to be rude so I apologize if I was - though I'm very glad you found my post informitave, if there's anything else you wanna chat about or have an opinion on Post it, I'd love to see more from you - Or just PM Me

Whatever you prefer

^_^

[Quik]

"The dub voices are horrible!" - Usually those who watch the subs will say this about every show(if they're of the "Purist" type who only watch one type of language

I dont think this is true. I believe most people are capable of forming unbiased opinions about voice work.

"Thye changed the music to crap!" - If you're speaking about the opening themes of some shows Yeah they do that(most notably Funimation) other than that I don't really recall seeing anything edited.

You may not have caught any music changes in the anime you've watched, but it does happen. In todays world of anime dubs, it hardly happens at all. It happened more in the past.

"The dialogue is full bad puns and lame jokes!" - Wrong again: They're full of the same Jokes which have been either changed to make sense, or replaced by another joke because that joke would not make sense

And this is just not true at all. There are times when jokes or puns are added into dubs that werent there in the original Japanese. It may or may not happen as often as it did in the past, but it still happens.

"They won't release uncut DVDs!" - Unless I've seen something that says "As Seen on TV" I usually assume it's uncut(at least I think so anyway)

Take here for example. This boxset may appear as uncut to you because of lack of "As seen on TV", but its the dub, with edits, cuts and all. Its not uncut, and the Japanese version is not added. It does happen.

"They edit every little thing out!" - Also Not True: That's the TV Station's doing

No, not all of time it isnt. The dubbing companies also make cuts.

[Gold_Roger]

^_^;; I didn't mean to be rude so I apologize if I was - though I'm very glad you found my post informitave, if there's anything else you wanna chat about or have an opinion on Post it, I'd love to see more from you - Or just PM Me

Whatever you prefer

^_^

Don't worry about it. I was just a teensy bit irritated. But I'm glad someone actually researches this sort of thing. If the purists of any anime were to read your editorial then maybe they would see the work it takes to make dubs (I certainly learned a thing or two). If we can agree on at least one point, then there might be some equality in this fandom.

It's easy to criticize dubbed anime when all you have to do is buy it and watch it.

I might do another thread but it probably won't be that interesting. Oh well, back to the drawing board.

[NovaStar]

I dont think this is true. I believe most people are capable of forming unbiased opinions about voice work.

You may not have caught any music changes in the anime you've watched, but it does happen. In todays world of anime dubs, it hardly happens at all. It happened more in the past.

And this is just not true at all. There are times when jokes or puns are added into dubs that werent there in the original Japanese. It may or may not happen as often as it did in the past, but it still happens.

Take here for example. This boxset may appear as uncut to you because of lack of "As seen on TV", but its the dub, with edits, cuts and all. Its not uncut, and the Japanese version is not added. It does happen.

No, not all of time it isnt. The dubbing companies also make cuts.

It seems that you found flaws in my article: it wasn't meant to be perfect by any means at all, I do have points on what I say, as do you, however It is my belief that there are far more sub fans(whom are not willing to give a dub a chance) because of the excuse of "It's not spot on to the Japanese"

My whole argument behind that article is: Of course it isn't, it's an adaptation."

I notice you say a few things I want to bring up

Number One: I was refering to Purists when I said "those whom do not take into consideration the english dub"

Two: I am fully aware of music changes in the past. I'm not discounting them: I acknowladge it, Funimation constantly changes the Op/Ed Themes into English.

Three: Again I quote "Spot onto the Japanese" - and this is where things urked me abit: Of course there are jokes that are not in the Japanese - Those jokes would Not make sense to a casual anime fan, - They probably would to you or I but they do not to most people whom are just starting out in anime - thus, they are either changed slightly, OR are completely traded off for another joke which is American Standard.

Four: I HEAVILY Spoke on 4Kids in my article: Pokemon is your example here when you gave me that link The Master Quest DVD Collection: Pokemon was produced by 4Kids: 4Kids will slice ANYTHING. a Pokemon Box Set IMO Hardly Qualifiy's as uncut: I challange you to find an Uncut Pokemon box set

Five: You Are Correct: however they make "For TV Edit Episodes" - For Example: Take Tenchi Muyo! The Original OAV, Aired on Cartoon Network in 1993 where Night Before the Carnival(Due To It's Length) is was Edited into a Two-Part episode.

DVD's (UNLESS SPECIFIED) (Or By 4Kids because 4Kids does it anyway with EVERYTHING) Hence The Name "4 Kids") Are usually full length episodes which haven't been cut.

I agree with The Music Part and The Cut's part: But I believe you misinterpited what I was trying to say.

[Prince Darien]

I think dubbing when done properly can make a really nice series. America is getting better at dubbing anime everywhere. Look how far we have gone since Speed Racer!

I would really like to a lot of the older series redubbed with more care than they were given at the time.( For example Sailor Moon), but it costs money for companies to do that.

I prefer English subtitles in general.

[Jin the windmaster]

Sumtimes animes should have just never been dubbed at all like the yu yu hakusho movie the golden seal, great movie HORRIBLE voice acting

[ParaParaJMo]

4Kids will slice ANYTHING. a Pokemon Box Set IMO Hardly Qualifiy's as uncut: I challange you to find an Uncut Pokemon box set

Does having region 2 sets count?

Five: You Are Correct: however they make "For TV Edit Episodes" - For Example: Take Tenchi Muyo! The Original OAV, Aired on Cartoon Network in 1993 where Night Before the Carnival(Due To It's Length) is was Edited into a Two-Part episode.

Tenchi was aired on cartoon network back in 1993? Wow, I did not know that. I know it originally came out in Japan back in 1993 but didn't know it came out to America soon after. The farthest I remember ever finding a Tenchi video was way back in 1995 or 1996. Kind of interesting CN would bring back Tenchi seven years later.

Did the Tenchi that air on CN back in 1993 still have the same dubbed voice actors? I haven't watched Tenchi ever since I graduated from high school.

[NovaStar]

Does having region 2 sets count?



Tenchi was aired on cartoon network back in 1993? Wow, I did not know that. I know it originally came out in Japan back in 1993 but didn't know it came out to America soon after. The farthest I remember ever finding a Tenchi video was way back in 1995 or 1996. Kind of interesting CN would bring back Tenchi seven years later.

Did the Tenchi that air on CN back in 1993 still have the same dubbed voice actors? I haven't watched Tenchi ever since I graduated from high school.

To Answer Your Questions: Yes Tenchi Muyo's OAV Aired in 1993 for a very short time on Cartoon Network, The Japanese release of the OAV happened in 1992 not 1993, so they had some time to dub it.

As for the Voiceovers? Yep, Same Voiceovers, there was only one problem with the Tenchi Muyo OAV - The Nudity(Ryoko and all them): They had to edit in Bathing Suits electronicly for it due to censorship laws on TV.

As For a Region 2 Set? I doubt Region would matter: Pokemon was nabbed by 4Kids: Regardless of Region 4Kids dubs anything to be for children only, so it wouldn't really matter.

[Quik]

however It is my belief that there are far more sub fans(whom are not willing to give a dub a chance) because of the excuse of "It's not spot on to the Japanese"

I agree with this too for the most part, I just dont think most anime fans, even purists, will put down dub voice work just because its the dub. As I said before, I think most anime fans would form opinions on voice work without bias against the dub.

Two: I am fully aware of music changes in the past. I'm not discounting them: I acknowladge it, Funimation constantly changes the Op/Ed Themes into English.

I was getting at the music edits outside of the opening and ending themes. Such as music remixing in the actual episode.

Three: Again I quote "Spot onto the Japanese" - and this is where things urked me abit: Of course there are jokes that are not in the Japanese - Those jokes would Not make sense to a casual anime fan, - They probably would to you or I but they do not to most people whom are just starting out in anime - thus, they are either changed slightly, OR are completely traded off for another joke which is American Standard.

I was saying that there are times when jokes are added in dubs that were not there at all in the original Japanese production. Maybe not very often, but it does happen.

Four: I HEAVILY Spoke on 4Kids in my article: Pokemon is your example here when you gave me that link The Master Quest DVD Collection: Pokemon was produced by 4Kids: 4Kids will slice ANYTHING. a Pokemon Box Set IMO Hardly Qualifiy's as uncut: I challange you to find an Uncut Pokemon box set

You challenge me? o_O Of course I wont be able to find an uncut Pokemon boxset. That was my whole point, as you said yourself: "DVD's (UNLESS SPECIFIED) Are usually full length episodes which haven't been cut." Usually.

Also, I didnt read your essay. Only your first post.

[NovaStar]

I didn't mean to come across as rude there so I hope I didn't

Read the Essay xD - some good stuff in there.

[Grim Scythe]

sorry if this is already here but im not reading all of that
if an anime is to be dubbed it needs to be done well
like Trigun and Cowboy Bebop< GOOD dub
not Onepiece or Naruto < BAD ,(so bad) horrible,So horrible)
^(makes me want to tear off my ears and beat the one(s) responsible for making me tear off my own ears with my own ears)

[deaddingo]

I hate dubs. I love subs. I still don't think that we should get rid of dubs though, they help younger kids and people who don't really like anime to get into it, and lots of huge anime fans love dubs. I also speak a little japanese so subs are a lot easier to handle without interupting my viewing experience.

In other words, all of you guys should learn japanese.

[chob]

i despise anime dubbing cos you dont quite get the feel the the anime. japanese are good at expressing things on one word with their voice, i.e. one word has many meanings. so Subs all the way for me.

[ParaParaJMo]

Hey NovaStar thanks for answering my question. I did not have Cartoon Network on my TV until like 1998 or so. Mostly my local cable company did not offer it.

Well sometimes some shows may not work in English. Ever seen our movies and cartoons dubbed in another language? Ever seen that Ninja Turtles anime? Most people would probably think the Japanese voice acting in that show is beyond terrible! Krang sounds like the English Meowth but just in Japanese but abusing booze.

The Turtles sound god awful. So Japanese voice acting is not that perfect all the time. I thought the Garou Densetsu/Fatal Fury dub far surpassed the original Japanese version. Joe in the Japanese version sounds like an old man while in the dub, it captures his childish carefree character.

[chob]

maybe they japanese version of ninja turtles like they done with the power puff girls

[Archangel Apollo]

Saban has made the most politically correct works of Japanese TV. Look at what he did to super sentai with Power Rangers. But I guess the fun action out does the ultra terrible acting and all that stuff.

But did you know that Mighty Morphin Power Rangers is exported and dubbed in Japan for broadcast?
I haven't looked for others but I'm sure they get dubbed too.



The only issues I have with dubs is if:
~they get people that can only read the lines off the page and can't put any emotion into what they are doing.
~lines are changed for the sake of changing it, like calling a carrot a potato when the character is holding a carrot.
~adding in jokes when serious dialogue had been used.
~scenes are cut just cause one character smacks another.
~the animation is censored through airbrushing or recoloring.

[ParaParaJMo]

But did you know that Mighty Morphin Power Rangers is exported and dubbed in Japan for broadcast?
I haven't looked for others but I'm sure they get dubbed too.

I have lived in Japan on 3 different occassions but never knew that. I must have missed it or something. I knew it was aired in the Philippines and other parts of southeast Asia whenever I was ever in those countries. I know the creator of Kamen Rider was OUTRAGED over the American version though.

[Oodzuchi]

Go ahead and make some dubs IF you'll make good ones.

[Luzifer]

Dubs are perfectly valid, admittedly though some do have problems, especially when a particular joke in the anime makes perfect sense in japanese but none in english (the imfamous homophone jokes). However, those are rarely of import to the overall worth of the anime and can be ignored. On the comment that the dub brings bad voice actors, well, there is always a chance that an actor brought in will be bad whether it is in english or japanese. This argument was more valid back in the beginning when anime's had to take Z-level voice actors since they weren't given much thought in America but now that they are a valid industry it will begin to improve. This can actually be used to fight many of the criticisms brought against dubs. The dubs will improve as anime's become more a part of american culture since putting down the money to get a better voice actor will seem more and more like a good investment. So you who spurn dubs might want to buy them for no other reason then it will convince people that there is enough money in them to warrant the investment. This can also be used for jokes to. More return on investment, more investment into decent joke writers. So in general dubs are good and in general i personally prefer the dubs becomes i'm more able to interpret mood and subtlties of thought when i hear it in english because my japanese isn't good enough yet. I can get a course understanding of the idea from the japanese version but still the fullest grasp eludes me unless its in english.

However, i do hear the censorship argument but thats not a valid reason to dislike dubs since thats not the fault of the dubs so much as the rules of censorship they must be released under. If an anime wants to be on toonami or whatever they have to censored according to american television laws set up by, among others, the FCC (who have earned my everlasting scorn), which are as we should all know FAR more restrictive then those in japan. So don't blame the dubs for being censored, even if they were merely subbed they would be censored, blame the television regulations and if you want to change those send a letter to your local congressman. I know I will.

Thats my two cents

[Lil~Shawty~Gurl]

Dubbing sucks period! How can you enjoy dubbed anime that is made str8 JAPANESE? It's not the same...I personally gotta feel the vibe, the climate of the situation and when I see some samurai talking in english that sounds pretty fake...

[NovaStar]

Dubbing sucks period! How can you enjoy dubbed anime that is made str8 JAPANESE? It's not the same...I personally gotta feel the vibe, the climate of the situation and when I see some samurai talking in english that sounds pretty fake...

You act as if your opinion is Gospel, not to flame but when I see "Dubbing Sucks Period" It's quite obvious that you haven't any good reasoning behind it. - Feeling the Vibe? yeah I can understand that, but you have to realize too That a Dub is an ADAPTATION Of Course it won't be straight on to the Japanese.

Everyone is intitled to their opoinions I just don't like seeing someone blasting something in which people put such hard work into.

Read my Article. It's posted in this thread. I know it won't change your mind, but I think you should read it, it may give you a new respect for what goes into Dubbing.

[Lil~Shawty~Gurl]

Ok my bad ~IN MY OPINION~

Anyways they don't have to put ''such hard work'' into it they chose it on their own and I didn't ask these people to dub it so I don't have to be thankful. Personally I see no reason for dubbing but if there is a lot of people who are too lazy to read the subs then I guess dubbing is quite important :-] How can you say that japanese voices are annoying? That's the greatest thing about anime it's different. You can't express the same emotions using english that's impossible. Japanese people talk like that and that's very unique, it makes anime unique in general.

I just hate dubbing in general. It's the same when I see f.e George Clooney talking in german (cuz i have a lot of german channels and they dub everything I swear EVERYTHING) and that sounds so fake that I'm loosing my will to watch it.

I respect everybodys opinion but I just can't understand it that's all...No offence to anybody but I gotta speak my mind that's how I am.

[NovaStar]

Ok my bad ~IN MY OPINION~

Anyways they don't have to put ''such hard work'' into it they chose it on their own and I didn't ask these people to dub it so I don't have to be thankful. Personally I see no reason for dubbing but if there is a lot of people who are too lazy to read the subs then I guess dubbing is quite important :-] How can you say that japanese voices are annoying? That's the greatest thing about anime it's different. You can't express the same emotions using english that's impossible. Japanese people talk like that and that's very unique, it makes anime unique in general.

I just hate dubbing in general. It's the same when I see f.e George Clooney talking in german (cuz i have a lot of german channels and they dub everything I swear EVERYTHING) and that sounds so fake that I'm loosing my will to watch it.

I respect everybodys opinion but I just can't understand it that's all...No offence to anybody but I gotta speak my mind that's how I am.

Again you have an opinion: Don't ever call me too lazy again, You'll make an enemy out of me very quickly, I watch BOTH when it comes to my anime, I just have a preference. you are exactly the type of person that I speak of when it comes to purists.

I'm not going to attack you at all any further, but I don't agree at all with your reasoning and let me break down some things for you.

Number One: You don't have to be thankful for it? That is absolutely false: You do: I hope you don't forget, that not only do these companies do dubs(which I could care less if you watch or not) but they also liscence a series for North American Distribution

NEVER Did I say "The Japanese Voices are Annoying" don't put words in my mouth, or if I did, I certainly didn't mean to come across as godly - I have great Respect for people like Orikasa Ai, Hashiyabara Megumi, Sakamoto Maaya or Any other Voice over you want to throw at me.

Personal Example is NOIR: Which is one of my favorite series: The Chloe character being my favorite character, I find that Hillary Hagg can not match up at all to the Job Aya Hisakawa did.

What you are trying to do is make me out to be a Purist of the Dub Variaty: Which I am not: I watch both, and take great pride in the fact that I do and that I'm able to do so without taking things so seriously.

The whole REASON I wrote that article was to explain that Dubs were not on equal par with subs: So mission accomplished, Thank you for proving me right in every sense of the word.

You have an Opinion: and I completely respect that: but don't crap all over mine, I refuse to turn this thread into a Flame war, so I will ask you nicely, if you want to respond and talk about it (Civily) in any mannor

Feel Free to PM Me. - I just really don't like the way you came across here, I have NOTHING against you at all.

Nova

Edit: I'm very sorry if I came across as a jerk.

[Lil~Shawty~Gurl]

lol you take things too serious you gotta chill ;-)

Now...

First off I never called you lazy...

2nd off I never said that japanese voices are annoying TO YOU so you are the one who should stop putting words in MY mouth ;-)

...cause I said it all IN GENERAL...I directed that to everybody who said that japanese voices are annoying so you didn't have to write that essey cause like I said NO OFFENCE but obviously you got offended for something I didn’t direct at you lol

You also failed to notice that I said it's MY OPINION and I also said that I don’t understand why people would hate japanese voices which means I wanted them to explain so we could discuss this topic but you had to get all defensive...you misred things so next time read again and try to see my point and discuss it with me instead of gettin an attitude for no reason boy...

and 3rd off what's up with ''Don't ever call me too lazy again, You'll make an enemy out of me very quickly'' <<< lol it's just internet I could careless if you're my friend or enemy...next time ask me if I called you names and stop assuming. We are here to discuss not threaten each other....