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Thread: Having a lot of Trouble!

  1. #1
    Jumonji Baka Kawaii IV
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    Default Having a lot of Trouble!

    I'm translating this song, and for some reason it's causing me a lot of grief. I'm not used to translating songs and now I see why they can be so difficult. These may be some newbie questions, but I need to get this right!

    絡み付く 闇を切り裂いて
    燃え上がる 鼓動の様に
    鎮せない痛み 幾千の悲しみが
    今君を 焦がしてく
    Here's what I got from this:

    I twist myself around it (?)
    Darkness splits apart
    The way you burst into flames
    (Kesenai) Thousands of pains in sadness
    Now you burn

    Okay, here are my issues with this (and I know this is probably all wrong):
    - I honestly can't tell what person this is in.
    - What the heck is "kesenai"?
    - And why is it "kogashiteku" instead of "kogashite"?

    抱き合う度 震える指先が 夜を欺いて
    滲む景色 伝わる吐息だけがまだ
    交われる場所 探してる

    Every time we embrace each other
    Our fingertips tremble
    The night has deceived us


    This just sounds straight-up wrong.
    Is it "the times we embrace each other", or what?

    天上天下轟く FLOW
    不退転で独損 ROCK ON
    諸行無常 空蝉の終世で
    I SHOW THE 万象
    Descend from the heavens and roar FLOW
    (Determination? Germany? Loss?) ROCK ON
    Everything isn't permanent
    The real world's (tsuiyo)
    I show the whole universe


    Okay, I didn't get this one. What is "tsuiyo"? I ignored most of the particles, because I can barely comprehend half of the words.

    Sorry for these silly questions, but it's just important that I know this. I'm simply getting frustrated.

    深く根ざした||傷は消えない
    Hide it, Hide it, Hide me









  2. #2
    Senior Member
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    My my, this one is a killer. Out of all the songs in the world you just had to have to pick the one that is almost impossible to translate, eh ^_^;;;

    >絡み付く 闇を切り裂いて
    >燃え上がる 鼓動の様に
    >鎮せない痛み 幾千の悲しみが
    >今君を 焦がしてく


    >I twist myself around it (?)
    >Darkness splits apart
    >The way you burst into flames
    >(Kesenai) Thousands of pains in sadness
    >Now you burn



    It makes more sense if we divide the phrase in two.

    Let's take this step by step.

    絡み付く 闇を切り裂いて 燃え上がる 鼓動の様に
    絡み付く 闇 -> "entangling darkness" (絡み付く means "to entangle, ensnare" )
    を切り裂いて -> cut open, slash open
    燃え上がる -> burst into flame
    鼓動 -> heartbeat
    ~の様に -> "like a ~"

    >絡み付く 闇を切り裂いて 燃え上がる 鼓動の様に
    -> Like a heartbeat bursting into flame, slashing open the entangling darkness

    鎮せない痛み 幾千の悲しみが 今君を 焦がしてく


    鎮せない -> This part is very tricky. It's basically a play on words. The writer purposefully used the wrong kanji (「鎮」) for the word 「消(け)す」(= erase). 「鎮」 means "to calm/soothe" or "to extinguish" something. Hence the line has a double-meaning: "unable to erase" and "unable to soothe/extinguish".
    痛み -> pain
    幾千の -> thousands of
    悲しみが -> sadnesses
    今君を
    焦がしてく -> ~してく is a shortened form of ~してく, which signifies a gradual change. Hence, "Now gradually burns you".

    >鎮せない痛み 幾千の悲しみが今君を 焦がしてく
    -> This unerasable/unsoothable pain, these thousands of sadnesses, now gradually burn you

    抱き合う度 震える指先が 夜を欺いて
    滲む景色 伝わる吐息だけがまだ
    交われる場所 探してる

    Every time we embrace each other
    Our fingertips tremble
    The night has deceived us
    抱き合う度 -> every time we embrace
    震える指先が -> our trembling fingertips
    夜を欺いて -> deceive the night

    抱き合う度 震える指先が 夜を欺いて
    -> Every time we embrace, our trembling fingertips deceive the night

    滲む景色 -> (a) blurred view
    伝わる -> conveyed, transmitted
    吐息 -> breath
    ~だけが -> only~
    まだ -> still
    交われる場所 -> (a) place where (we) can meet
    探してる -> (is) looking/searching

    滲む景色 伝わる吐息だけがまだ 交われる場所 探してる
    -> The view blurs, and only our transmitted breath still remains to search for a place where (the two/we) can meet

    天上天下轟く FLOW
    不退転で独損 ROCK ON
    諸行無常 空蝉の終世で
    I SHOW THE 万象

    Descend from the heavens and roar FLOW
    (Determination? Germany? Loss?) ROCK ON
    Everything isn't permanent
    The real world's (tsuiyo)
    I show the whole universe

    Now here comes the really hard part. I know it's very confusing at first glance, but what this song is doing is making heavy use of old Japanese proverbs. What makes it so hard to translate is that it throws in a few puns in the process.

    First of all, pay attention to the words 「天上天下」and 「独損」 -> This is probably a word-play on the phrase 「天上天下、唯我独尊(てんじょうてんげ、ゆいがどくそん)」, which means "In the whole universe, I am alone, honored". The latter half of the phrase (唯我独尊, "I alone am honored") is commonly used in modern Japanese to refer to an arrogant, self-centered person.

    The line is making a pun on this 唯我独尊, 「独(=alone)」 and 「損 (read そん like the kanjo 尊, which means "honor" but with a different meaning, "disadvantage")」.

    Hence, the phrases comes out as something like:
    天上天下 -> "(In) the whole universe" [literally "above and below the heavens"]
    独損 -> I alone am at an disadvantage/ at odds

    To make matters more confusing, the song situates the two phrases apart from each other but in a way that they correspond with each other. (i.e. 天上天下~/~独損.

    不退転 is another Japanese phrase that means "indomitable resolve".

    諸行無常 is a Japanese phrase that means "all is vanity" or "nothing is forever".

    空蝉 literally means "hollow cicada", but it's a special phrase that is commonly used in Japanese poems as a sort of symbol (the correct term is 枕詞 まくらことば) for the "futility of life".

    轟く -> boom, thunder
    終世 -> lifetime
    万象-> literally, "all phenomenon", which is basically the same as "the universe".

    So if we use all of what I listed above, we get:

    >天上天下轟く FLOW
    >不退転で独損 ROCK ON
    >諸行無常 空蝉の終世で
    >I SHOW THE 万象

    From above and below the heavens, FLOW
    With my indomitable resolve, I alone am at odds ROCK ON
    Nothing is forever, in (this) futile lifetime
    I SHOW THE universe

    --------------------

    Whew. I know that was terribly confusing, but it's a terribly confusing song. I'll edit this post later if I find a better way to explain some of the points.

    Last edited by Datenshi; 08-02-2008 at 05:29 PM.
    "If a person who indulges in gluttony is a glutton, and a person who commits a felony is a felon, then God is an iron."

    -Spider Robinson, God Is an Iron

  3. #3
    Jumonji Baka Kawaii IV
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    Thank the gods, Datenshi, you're my hero. -Bow down-

    I might be over-reacting, but now I see how complicated that really was. I don't think I could have ever figured that out about 消せない, simply because I learned that as "not erasable". Ugh, Japanese and their play on words.

    Like I said, I'm so not used to translating songs. I seem to always translate it all so literally. I think I'll get better as I progress. Thank you soo much, again. That really made plenty of sense, by the way.

    深く根ざした||傷は消えない
    Hide it, Hide it, Hide me









  4. #4
    Junior Member raintree_leaf is a splendid one to behold raintree_leaf is a splendid one to behold raintree_leaf is a splendid one to behold raintree_leaf is a splendid one to behold raintree_leaf is a splendid one to behold raintree_leaf is a splendid one to behold raintree_leaf is a splendid one to behold raintree_leaf's Avatar
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    Thanks Pengin-San for the lyrics and Datenshi for the transation, it is very informative and helpful for me as well.

    I would never have know that 鎮せない is 消す. I think it is almost impossible to know if it is presented solely as a reading material. Since this word is vocalize in the song you might able to guess from the way it is pronounced.

    I wonder if you can translate 滲む景色 伝わる吐息だけがまだ 交われる場所 探してる
    into " to search for the place where only the breath, which is blurring the view , is still mingling"

  5. #5
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    I wonder if you can translate 滲む景色 伝わる吐息だけがまだ 交われる場所 探してる
    into " to search for the place where only the breath, which is blurring the view , is still mingling"
    Personally, I think that is a liberty that is safe to take. I opted to leave the expression ambigous ("the view blurs") because it's practically impossible to be sure judging from the original Japanese, since there is a slight chance the 滲む is referring to something else (like tears), only that the song does not directly allude to it.
    "If a person who indulges in gluttony is a glutton, and a person who commits a felony is a felon, then God is an iron."

    -Spider Robinson, God Is an Iron

  6. #6
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    Thank you Datenshi for the comment! I understand a little bit better now.

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