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Thread: Re_birthday kanji discrepancy

  1. #1
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    Default Re_birthday kanji discrepancy

    http://www.animelyrics.com/doujin/vo...rebirthday.htm

    In mothy's original video of Re_birthday and the lyrics he posted on piapro, about 3/4 of the way in, there's a line
    「罪が消して許されることはない」
    "tsumi ga keshite yurusareru koto wa nai"
    "your sins will never be forgiven"
    However, in Tetoteto's remake and other references such as Nicopedia and Hatsune Miku Wiki, the word 消して keshite is replaced by the homophone 決して keshite. The kanji listing here uses the original kanji but everywhere else I've looked uses the second one.

    The later version seems better semantically and grammatically, but the earlier version comes from original rather than secondary sources, so it's difficult to work out which one is right.

    Does anyone know anything about this discrepancy? Does anyone have an album with published lyrics?


    A separate point, but Hikarin's translation is "It is not that you aren't being forgiven for your sins". I'm a nigate with double negatives, but this doesn't seem right.

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    Default Re: Re_birthday kanji discrepancy

    (nope never mind I was wrong)
    keshite...nai is single negative so I think you're right in saying it's "your sins will never be forgiven"
    Last edited by Fuukanou; 09-24-2017 at 11:06 AM.
    [Notice: the preceding post was written by someone with a poor grasp of the Japanese language. If you could correct me when I make mistakes, it'd be much appreciated.]

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    Default Re: Re_birthday kanji discrepancy

    決して (kesshite or keshite) literally means "decidedly", hence "definitely". I can't remember if I've seen it used with an affirmative verb, but with a negative verb it means "definitely it will not", or more colloquially, "there's no way".

    But I'm still concerned that primary sources (those published directly by mothy) use 消して while only secondary sources (copies of primary sources) use 決して. That could be because people copying the lyrics realized it was an error and corrected it, but it would be nice if there was a primary source with the same amendment ...

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    Default Re: Re_birthday kanji discrepancy

    Yeah, the second version makes more sense, but any source that isn't mothy can't be considered official, so I'm not going to change it on the site unless there's a primary source that uses the changed lyrics or he's said somewhere that it's a typo.

    You're quite right that @Hikarin 's translation implies that the sins are being forgiven whereas the original states the opposite; I'll PM her about this thread.

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    Default Re: Re_birthday kanji discrepancy

    Shoo thang. I'll get to this and fix it up shortly.
    I intend to rework all of my mothy translations, soon (amongst others).

    Aside from having more insight since the release of the final chapter "master of the heavenly yard", I am much wiser than the teenage years when I first worked these translations, haha. I'm not afraid to say that my work back then was abysmal! xD

    To note, I do actually now own all of mothy's albums.
    I will go over all of the kanji lyrics with a fine-tooth comb, and fix any discrepancies, or even just formatting differences.
    Last edited by Hikarin; 10-20-2017 at 03:10 AM.

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    Default Re: Re_birthday kanji discrepancy

    Okay, I just transcribed the Re_birthday lyrics directly from the album.
    As far as I am aware, there are two times that that song is published.

    The first is of course with mothy's first album, "EVILS THEATER". The lyrics in that booklet note "消して".

    The second time that Re_birthday appears, is in the EXIT TUNES release, "悪ノ王国".
    The lyric sheet with this album features lyrics with an identical text formatting, save that this time "消して" is now written "決して".

    You can argue that the second is a more recent form and therefore the correct version.
    Incidentally though, the text formatting for the lyrics is also the same as posted by mothy on Piapro, which again uses "消して". ( http://piapro.jp/t/CgKr )
    Now, it could just be that the lyrics in "EVILS THEATER" are a copy/paste of what was previously posted on Piapro. At the same time, this is coming straight from the horse's mouth, so to speak.
    Rather frustratingly, a user on Piapro actually asks in the comments about this very issue. A question that has gone unanswered.

    I don't know what the right thing to do here is. =x I thought I knew, but I don't. Still, I have to concede that "決して" does sound better fitting, though that does not mean that it is right.

    Halp. orz

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