君影草 (Kimikagesou)

[Raichu]

I always struggle with hazu after past tense. Does anyone have a way to understand it?

In particular, 君影草 has the lines

二人は同じ夢を見てた
そう信じてたはずなのに
小さな意地が　距離を作る
あの時もっと　素直になれたなら

We had the same dream
???
Yet, a small stubbornness became a distance between us.
If only I could have been more open …

Does it mean I should have believed we had the same dream, or I assumed we had the same dream, or ...?


Another verse I'm struggling with is

想い出は美しいまま
二重にパスワードを掛けて
大切に　奥のほうに　しまっておくよ
もしパスワードごと
君のことを奇麗に忘れられたなら
どんなに　幸せだろう


while you're still beautiful,
I'll lock my memories [of you] with a double password

and treasure them safely deep inside
if, passwords and all,

you were forgotten prettily, ???

how happy would it be

I'm not sure how 奇麗に忘れられた is meant to be taken.



Any ideas or suggestions welcome!


Oh, song can be heard .

[Fuukanou]

http://ejje.weblio.jp/sentence/conte...9A%E3%81%A0%22

It appears that it it meant to be the former translation "I should have believed that we had the same dream" according to these model sentences. That being said, the latter translation makes more sense in context...

奇麗に忘れられた I believe the 'kirei ni' means like a clean cut, completely, gone as if it were never there. As in "It had been wiped completely from my mind" c.f. さっぱり
reference definition 3: http://jisho.org/search/%E7%B6%BA%E9%BA%97

[Raichu]

thanks for the comments.

to me, future + hazu suggests that you think that something is likely to will happen even if it's not guaranteed, while past + hazu suggests that something could have had a good chance of happening but didn't for some reason. so そう信じてたはず would mean "it would have been possible to believe that [we had the same dream] but I didn't believe it".

like you say, it would make more sense to say "I assumed that [we had the same dream]" but not sure how you can get that meaning from the sentence. unless it means "I would have thought that you believed it [but you didn't]"? now i'm really confused.

about kirei ni, that interpretation did cross my mind, but then it would mean, "how happy I would be if I clean forgot all about you". that seems a strange. why would he save his memories of her and then be happy if he forgot them? perhaps its his memory of her that's troubling him and he wants to forget all about her and get on with his life, but i don't get that tone from the rest of the lyrics.

[Raichu]

FYI I ended up asking the songwriter and it's like I suggested in my last message, he would be happy to forget so as to avoid the internal conflict between loving her and not getting on with her.

[Fuukanou]

That's a novel solution method if anything...