AnimeGalleries [dot] NetAnimeWallpapers [dot] ComAnimeLyrics [dot] ComAnimePedia [dot] ComAnimeGlobe [dot] Com


User Tag List

+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 9 of 9

Thread: Question about translations

  1. #1
    Moderator
    AnimeLyrics Admin
    Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou's Avatar
    Gil
    0.59
    Gender
    Gifts Mic Piano
    Mentioned
    20 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    07-18-2019 09:21 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    This is why we can't have nice things.
    Threads
    59
    Posts
    230
    AL Lyrics
    120
    Rep Power
    24

    Question Question about translations

    Hi all, I've got some questions about how translations are done.

    1: What are the logistics behind a translation?
    Everyone has their own way of translating and I think it would help me if I knew how everyone else did their translations. I mean, do you find the lyrics on the booklet provided with a disc, and then romanise it, or do you listen to the song and then transcribe the romanised form from there before rewriting as Japanese? Perhaps even some of you are native Japanese readers and will write it in Japanese from the song by ear before romanising.

    2: Where do you find missing information and what is acceptable to borrow from others?
    As the question implies, where do you find information like lyricist and arrangement for a song, if you don't have the CD?
    In addition, is it OK if you were to hypothetically use Kanji transcribed on another site, like Kasi-Time? Is that exactly as it's written in the booklet, or did someone else have to transcribe it by ear? If it's written as in the booklet, then is it acceptable to just use that? It helps with smaller things, like whether a word was written in katakana, or punctuation in the lyrics, which you can't tell from just listening to the song, but sorta helps in translation (which is why I'm asking).

    3: How do you format your translation when doing it?
    Afterwards when you have your Japanese and romanised form, what sort of program do you put it into when you are actually doing the translating? Word? Excel? I've tried using Notepad and just having it:

    JAPANESE
    ROMANISED
    TRANSLATION

    *next line*

    and I've also tried it in Excel so A column is Japanese, B column is romanised, C column is translation so I can see more of the song at once (helps with consistency). They both have their ups and downs, but I'm wondering if anyone has found a better solution in their time translating.



    Thanks, I hope someone can answer any of these questions.

    APPEND: Also, is there any regulation for spelling and grammar when uploading? I write British English (colour/romanisation) instead of American English (color/romanization) due to habit, but is there consistency in the rest of the site using American English to a point such that I should use that instead?
    Last edited by Fuukanou; 01-10-2017 at 07:50 PM.

  2. Likes bambooXZX liked this post
  3. #2
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei's Avatar
    Gil
    19,973.25
    Gender
    My Mood
    Psychadelic
    Gifts Favorite Bioshock Syringe Bioshock Eve
    Mentioned
    274 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    02-27-2019 06:35 AM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Singapore.
    Age
    26
    Threads
    121
    Posts
    2,881
    Blog Entries
    122
    AL Lyrics
    3316
    Rep Power
    1739
    Gamer IDs

    Steam ID: aozorapen

    Default Re: Question about translations

    Hello!

    1. For more mainstream stuff like anime music and some game stuff, I usually get it off the net (if I haven't been interested enough to get the CD). Sites such as kas-time and uta.net are usually the most accurate. For more indie bands like Lamp I'd just order their albums off the web directly, since lyrics are not available online / are not accurate. I think the site is pretty against lyric sources that have been transcribed by ear (or 耳コピ), and with some songs it's impossible to do that anyway. We've only had a few instances of native Japanese speakers/readers, I think? But I'm quite sure they don't actually rely on those.

    2. Kasi-time usually post the full credits (Lyricist/Composer/Arranger) so it's pretty detailed. Uta-net and j-lyric.net do the same thing, if minus the arranger. If not I'd try the actual artists' sites- most of them list down details under their releases. If I was really desperate for the full credits, I'd either look for scans online or just buy the album to get them. It's really up to you.

    I'm pretty sure kasi-time gets their lyrics from the actual booklet release, since I've never seen any mistakes from them in my experience- so I'd say that it's fairly safe to use stuff from them. Uta-net and j-lyric.net sometimes make minor mistakes.

    3. I mostly use the site's template, 'cause it's easier for me to line up the romaji and translation that way, and make sure it'll turn out looking okay. For transcription of kanji to romaji I mostly use notepad, and when translating on the go I use Google docs- even that's not ideal.

    Using excel is interesting! I haven't tried that out. How's it working out for you? I'd think that it should be similar to what's on-site, yeah?

    Uh I don't really think there's that sort of regulation, since many translators come from different backgrounds. I prefer British English myself.


    Hope this helped a little!

    できねぇ時?
    そん時ゃ諸共心中だよ





  4. Thanks Fuukanou thanked for this post
  5. #3
    Moderator
    AnimeLyrics Admin
    Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou's Avatar
    Gil
    0.59
    Gender
    Gifts Mic Piano
    Mentioned
    20 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    07-18-2019 09:21 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    This is why we can't have nice things.
    Threads
    59
    Posts
    230
    AL Lyrics
    120
    Rep Power
    24

    Default Re: Question about translations

    Thank you for your response!

    Excel is OK, but to be honest I make a lot of corrections, very fast, and the problem with excel is that after you hit the right cell you have to fiddle with the mouse to get to the right bit of the translation that you want to change. If you've half written a line, I tend to just start writing into the cell without selecting the position and it ends up blanking and rewriting the cell so it's annoying. For the idea though, it does work well as you can see a large amount of the song together, so it helps with making sure you use the same sort of language for the translation, and also the cells help you to manage lines easily.

    I think that the tables in Word work differently, so I might try using MS Word.

  6. #4
    Moderator
    AnimeLyrics Admin
    bluepenguin has a reputation beyond repute bluepenguin has a reputation beyond repute bluepenguin has a reputation beyond repute bluepenguin has a reputation beyond repute bluepenguin has a reputation beyond repute bluepenguin has a reputation beyond repute bluepenguin has a reputation beyond repute bluepenguin has a reputation beyond repute bluepenguin has a reputation beyond repute bluepenguin has a reputation beyond repute bluepenguin has a reputation beyond repute bluepenguin's Avatar
    Gil
    32,297.40
    Gender
    Gifts Mic Mic Portal Companion Cube
    Mentioned
    45 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    07-11-2019 10:32 AM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Mars
    Threads
    121
    Posts
    1,114
    AL Lyrics
    709
    Rep Power
    53
    Gamer IDs

    PSN ID: xenographer Steam ID: xen0glossy

    Default Re: Question about translations

    1. I always look for the official lyrics before trying to transcribe by ear. Some songs don't have official lyrics published anywhere, in which case I feel a 耳コピ is justified, but that's pretty rare. (And then there's Sound Horizon, which has published lyrics but frequently leaves a bunch of stuff out of them or has things written differently from how they're sung, but they're... unique.) It's really not reliable to try to translate songs just based on listening to them--how many times have you misheard song lyrics in your own native language? It's a phenomenon so common that both English and Japanese have a word for it. And then if you're trying to transcribe songs in a language you're not fluent in, the chance of errors increases.

    Edit: The high incidence of homophones in Japanese also makes this risky; even with access to the Japanese lyrics, sometimes while listening to a song I assume one meaning of a word and then fail to notice that the kanji used is something different.

    If I have the physical CD with lyric booklet included, I'll look at that first, of course, but because I'm lazy, if I don't have that I usually go first to sites like Kasi-Time, Uta-Net, or j-lyric--if it says "licensed by JASRAC," it's probably okay. If the song isn't there or if there's something in those lyrics that looks fishy, I look for scans.

    2. As Rei says, the more reliable lyrics sites usually include that information, as does the lyrics booklet. I don't think I've ever had to look further afield for it than that. I used to be really lazy about including it when I submitted lyrics to the site, though, and these days I might still leave it off if it's unclear how to read the name of the composer, lyricist, or arranger--that information can be hard to find online since they're generally out of the spotlight.

    3. I use Notepad so that no weird characters/formatting will be introduced, and as the admin I highly recommend it so that you don't copy-paste in smart quotes or the ellipsis character or whatever and make me spend an extra fifteen minutes or whatever trying to purge it from your submission (inevitably, I will miss some instances on the first try). I format it with the Japanese, romaji, and English alternating by stanza for the purposes of posting it on my Wordpress blog--when I set it up I took a quick straw-poll of some of my friends and that was the format they liked best, and it's also the format that's easiest for me to use while translating because I don't have to be constantly scrolling up to see the kanji--but it does make it kind of a pain to post it here, because I have to copy&paste each stanza individually into the correct field.

    Append: No, there's no official stance on that. It's really not worth it to try to adhere to some kind of consistent style guide sitewide. I'm pretty sure everyone just writes in whatever form of English they are most familiar/comfortable with, which is fine by me.
    Last edited by bluepenguin; 01-11-2017 at 01:46 PM.

  7. Thanks Fuukanou thanked for this post
  8. #5
    Moderator
    AnimeLyrics Admin
    Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou's Avatar
    Gil
    0.59
    Gender
    Gifts Mic Piano
    Mentioned
    20 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    07-18-2019 09:21 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    This is why we can't have nice things.
    Threads
    59
    Posts
    230
    AL Lyrics
    120
    Rep Power
    24

    Default Re: Question about translations

    Thanks for the reply.

    Will ensure I check for special characters before pasting into submission from now on to avoid the smart quote issue. Even though I as well started on Notepad, I'm sure there must be a better way out there.

    Another question: when writing Japanese names (like in the credits fields), should you write them English order or Japanese order? Are there names in Japanese that could be confused by changing the order (i.e. forename and surname could be flipped and would still make a viable name)?

  9. #6
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei has a reputation beyond repute Rei's Avatar
    Gil
    19,973.25
    Gender
    My Mood
    Psychadelic
    Gifts Favorite Bioshock Syringe Bioshock Eve
    Mentioned
    274 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    02-27-2019 06:35 AM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Singapore.
    Age
    26
    Threads
    121
    Posts
    2,881
    Blog Entries
    122
    AL Lyrics
    3316
    Rep Power
    1739
    Gamer IDs

    Steam ID: aozorapen

    Default Re: Question about translations

    I think it depends on how you'd prefer to write it. With Japanese names both English and Japanese orders and alternate names are listed on the performer's page anyway. As for those names you mentioned, I...have not encountered any names like those before, so I really can't say.

    できねぇ時?
    そん時ゃ諸共心中だよ





  10. Thanks Fuukanou thanked for this post
  11. #7
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    bambooXZX is on a distinguished road bambooXZX's Avatar
    Gil
    2,776.07
    Gender
    Mentioned
    18 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    06-01-2019 07:56 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Threads
    19
    Posts
    136
    AL Lyrics
    129
    Rep Power
    9

    Default Re: Question about translations

    Hm, I've actually always been pretty interested in hearing about other people's approaches, though I've never gotten around to starting a discussion like this. :V

    ---

    1: I always start with an official text source if it exists. If your priority is to accurately convey the lyricist's intent, ignoring it is really not an option. I basically only go by ear if I have to, or if for some reason I intentionally test myself (not something I do much).

    My process is typically to start with romanization, reading along with the booklet or other reliable sources if available. This helps me confirm that I'm not misreading any new words or kanji abuse, as it forces me to slow down and look things up if I'm not sure. I type out the Japanese after that, though sometimes I just copy/paste when the only reliable source is online, if I'm feeling lazy (not recommended if there are words you need to review in the song, because any revisiting is helpful for reinforcement). Finally, for the translation, I copy/paste the Japanese text I now have and start replacing lines with English.

    ---

    2: Regarding reliability of internet sources, I find that Uta-Net and Kasi-Time are usually good, as Rei and bluepenguin said above; j-lyric is probably fine, though I don't use it personally. A bit of caution, though: I've found that the JASRAC seal on a site doesn't mean quite as much as one might expect. I've seen sites with the seal that allow user-submitted content, and even sites with the seal that copy/paste by-ear transcriptions from fansites (pretty bad ones at that).

    Again reiterating posts further up, Kasi-Time's and Uta-Net's credits work for me (though Uta-Net doesn't list arrangers). JASRAC's J-WID is also helpful, though again that doesn't seem to list arrangement. Sometimes the official websites for artists / record labels / anime will have information, and on rare occasions, I've also found it in store listings.

    In general I would avoid most user-generated data (i.e. anyone-can-edit type sites), but if it feels necessary, I try to know who the editors are, and how much I can trust them on the basis of background and motives - for example, for credits, I'm cautiously okay with taking VGMdb's data at face value because their staff seem to have a well-established culture of thoroughness and commitment to accuracy.

    ---

    3: I've tried a few layouts over time, but I currently keep .txt files, with English, romaji, and Japanese versions of the whole song in separate blocks (in that order). Additionally, I keep title translations and the credits in the same file, which I imagine might be easy to overlook, as well as any supplemental information (links to interviews, reminders to find a more reliable source, etc).

    For a very long time, I did all of my work in Notepad. The format would allow me to start with romaji, continue with Japanese while reading the romaji from top to bottom, and then have English at the top so it's the first thing I see when I open the file again.

    Now, I've moved to Notepad++ with two side-by-side panes, so I can see my in-progress TL and the full original Japanese at the same time. It's pretty good.

    ---

    Names: reversible names are definitely possible. Looking through my own translations, I see Ayano Mashiro, Azuma Hitomi, and Hajime Chitose. For a fictional example, the names of Puella Magi Madoka Magica's entire main cast can be flipped.

    As for which order to use, I personally just default to last-name-first, but I don't think it's that important, honestly. Most of the arguments you'll usually hear for either side don't feel particularly strong to me. Consistency might not even be that important, either; I vaguely recall hearing a Japanese literature professor mention that people just go by whichever order is more recognizable for that particular person, even in academia.

  12. Thanks Fuukanou thanked for this post
  13. #8
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    Haze~ has a reputation beyond repute Haze~ has a reputation beyond repute Haze~ has a reputation beyond repute Haze~ has a reputation beyond repute Haze~ has a reputation beyond repute Haze~ has a reputation beyond repute Haze~ has a reputation beyond repute Haze~ has a reputation beyond repute Haze~ has a reputation beyond repute Haze~ has a reputation beyond repute Haze~ has a reputation beyond repute Haze~'s Avatar
    Gil
    2,110.82
    Gender
    My Mood
    Asleep
    Mentioned
    10 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    08-21-2017 09:09 AM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Threads
    27
    Posts
    157
    AL Lyrics
    106
    Rep Power
    42

    Default Re: Question about translations

    1. Hmm... I start by listening to the song with the lyrics in front of me, to make sure there aren't any irregular readings, etc.
    If it's a song I'm already familiar with, though, I usually skip that step.
    Then, I start working on the translation, leaving the translit for last (mostly because I don't enjoy it as much).

    2. As I'd just be repeating what everyone else had already mentioned, I'll just leave this one blank.

    3. I use Notepad - Word and I have never gotten along that well.
    Also, as for "seeing a large amount of the song together", it's possible to view your translation, translit, and the original Japanese at the same time with Notepad without having to constantly scroll up and down: Click image for larger version

Name:	Notepad Random.png
Views:	20
Size:	88.5 KB
ID:	86172

    That's the way I have it, anyway. :p
    Last edited by Haze~; 01-13-2017 at 09:36 AM.

  14. Thanks Fuukanou thanked for this post
  15. #9
    Moderator
    AnimeLyrics Admin
    Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou has a reputation beyond repute Fuukanou's Avatar
    Gil
    0.59
    Gender
    Gifts Mic Piano
    Mentioned
    20 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    07-18-2019 09:21 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    This is why we can't have nice things.
    Threads
    59
    Posts
    230
    AL Lyrics
    120
    Rep Power
    24

    Default Re: Question about translations

    Hmm, it's very interesting to see how everyone has come to a rather similar strategy (and program ahahaha) for their translations. The only reason I used Notepad for my initial translations was because of the nice minimal interface and monospacing.

+ Reply to Thread

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

     

Similar Threads

  1. Translations, if you please
    By Sebine in forum Japanese Language
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 12-28-2011, 12:03 PM
  2. Need help with translations
    By Spartacus in forum Japanese Language
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 07-01-2009, 09:39 PM
  3. Translations
    By SoraPiroB in forum Lyric Requests
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 10-20-2008, 05:11 PM
  4. [REQ]erm i would like to have the eng translations..pls help!
    By MglnSeries_lover95 in forum Lyric Requests
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 04-27-2008, 06:38 PM
  5. I need help in translations!
    By Nienna07 in forum Music Discussions
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 10-16-2007, 09:09 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts