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Zycolette
03-11-2009, 09:50 PM
Why in the world do people choose Japanese sub over English dub?

So far from what I've seen all the dubbed anime has been satisfactory for me. (That may be because I don't read or watch as much anime/manga as some of the other "otaku"s.

So why? Other than the fact that there's prolly only one voice actor that does a lot of roles. @__@

Anyone care to answer?

tsujigiri15
03-11-2009, 09:57 PM
It varies drastically from Anime to anime. I dunno what anime you watch but you could well be right- in those the dub may be just as good, (and a damn sight more convenient I guess. I found the dub was actually better on Cowboy bebop, and just as good on fullmetal alchemist, bleach (for the most part) and a couple of others

But some wont have been dubbed over yet, and some are better dubbed. I particularly find the voices they often give to schoolgirls in us dubs annoying for some reason. Also occasionally humour may be lost, or wordplays. Subs (especially fan subs) are often good for that - making sure you dont miss anything.

Sometimes too, dubs have shocking lip synching, cos its hard to fit even a loose translation to the right number of sylables, for some sentences.

Which animes have you found the dubs to be good for?

Astarot
03-11-2009, 10:30 PM
They make it sound childish... once a series is English dubbed, it just becomes a 'cartoon', and they take out all the foul language and really tone down the gore. I personally can't stand English dubbed anime.

Celestial Mika
03-11-2009, 10:40 PM
They make it sound childish... once a series is English dubbed, it just becomes a 'cartoon', and they take out all the foul language and really tone down the gore. I personally can't stand English dubbed anime.

A lot of english dub animes I see still have a lot of bad language and gore. Perhaps its different watching them online rather than on TV? I'm not sure, dont think I've seen enough sub animes to be apart of this argument:closedeye

Gjallarhorn
03-11-2009, 10:40 PM
Why in the world do people choose Japanese sub over English dub?

So far from what I've seen all the dubbed anime has been satisfactory for me. (That may be because I don't read or watch as much anime/manga as some of the other "otaku"s.

So why? Other than the fact that there's prolly only one voice actor that does a lot of roles. @__@

Anyone care to answer?

Do you know what a japanophile is? There's your answer.

Most dubs are damn good.
Most dubs are not changed from their original format (with the exception of the occasional joke that would only make sense if you heard it in Japanese).

I honestly don't know where the hell they pull this crap out from, but them seem persistant in doing so.

Haoie
03-12-2009, 03:53 AM
Dubs are awesome.

At least then you can actually tell the men from the women.

overwatch
03-12-2009, 07:25 AM
meh some people consider it to be "pure" when subbed over dubbed - for some this is just the anime banta (like a large amount of the PC vs Mac or Canon vs Nikon) however some take it way too seriously.

I have seen dubs which were horrific and made no (or little) sense because they were done badly (Ghost in the Shell Innocence is a good example of this). And I have seen cases where the subs are horrific.
In each case if one is bad I switch to the other - I have no problem reading

Datenshi
03-12-2009, 08:01 AM
Interestingly enough, the exact same controversy over dubs exists in Japan, concerning English movies/dramas translated into Japanese, with pretty much the same arguments ("against: the lips don't fit the words, you can't 'get' the jokes, etc." v.s. "for: the only people who are bothered by stuff like that are people with a complex for all things Western, and should grow the hell up").

I understand both languages so it's never been much of a concern for me, but one thing I've felt time and again is that the people who are translating and voicing these dubs are professionals; these people pay very close attention to timing and tone, as well as find innovative ways to get through tricky translations that I would never have thought of. It's their job and most of them do it well.

Anyhow, a Japanese voice actor for the original anime and the voice actor for the English version are essentially doing the same thing; so what's the difference?

Moreover, many of the same Japanese anime voice actors also work for Japanese dubs of Hollywood movies and popular television shows (like 24 or Prison Break). So the argument that there is a difference in terms of quality of voice-acting in an "offical" Japanes anime and the voice-acting of a dub is really off the mark, unless you think the Japanese are inherently better at voice-acting in general than other nationalities, which is obviously false.

In fact, there are a lot of really bad Japanese voice actors around *cough*Shikabanehime*cough*. Some of these people are amateurs with no formal training who are picked out because of no other reason than they're photogenic or already famous *cough*HiranoAya*cough*. It's just part of what's screwed with the anime industry in Japan today.

That said, I prefer watching the work in the original language, either English or Japanese, because there are a lot of things that are inevitably lost in translation (imagine trying to dub the opening dialogue of, say, Quentin Tarantino's Reservoir Dogs in Japanese. It's just not possible). But that's an argument for another time.

wolfgirl90
03-12-2009, 11:55 AM
They make it sound childish... once a series is English dubbed, it just becomes a 'cartoon', and they take out all the foul language and really tone down the gore. I personally can't stand English dubbed anime.

*sigh*

The Japanese language does not have any curse words in it, therefore, none of their words can be (or rather should be) translated as such. Fansubbers like to exaggerate the language used. For example, the word "damn" is a word that is said in frustration. It has no one single translation for the word but fansubbers like to translate it as the s-word. There are words that are more inappropriate to use in general conversation but these words would not be considered "foul language". You are also making the assumption that the fansub translation is correct (which not always the case).

When it comes to gore, it only toned down when the anime comes on television and only if it comes on during primetime hours (usually 7-10pm). Since only a very, very small amount of anime make it to television, barely any if them are edited.

Now, some people have brought up how some jokes are changed because they would not make sence to anyone not fluent in Japanese and/or very knowledgeable about Japanese culture. There are some fansubbers that do explain the jokes but not all of them do and those that do may or may not be explaining it right.

loveyourfate
03-12-2009, 12:24 PM
If it would be British, I might think about watching a dub. But, no offence to all you americans ;) , I can't stand some of the american accents.
I guess that's my main problem, but since I also love everything Japanese (and I'm studying Japanese as well, so ==> ) I, probably, still wouldn't watch the dubs.

Magical Soul
03-12-2009, 12:30 PM
It all depends on the voice actors.

drm0ney
03-12-2009, 01:12 PM
I don't mind dub but if i had the choice i'll watch it subbed. It's fun to try and understand what's being said (i've had 3 years of japanese so i try and see what i actually learned :p ) Plus the japanese voices are how it was intended to be watched, kind of like reading manga right to left.

But people saying i will not watched dub, well its their loss. Don't be so picky. O.o unless there's a voice actor in it you just can't stand what does it hurt.

Orta Honehone
03-12-2009, 06:31 PM
Most of the more "mainstream" and popular animes actually have very good dubs IMO (I personally cant stand listening to the Japanese voices in DBZ.) And as far as them cutting out the violence and whatnot, yes they do drastically change shows for TV (just look at One Piece), but 99% of the time if you buy the DVD you get the original, uncut show, just as it was aired in Japan.

Diocletian
03-12-2009, 06:31 PM
The studio really takes the cake for everything. I don't expect anything great from (the few) that Media Blasters or Nozomi Ent. make. I expect near perfection when FUNI does it.

Japanese dubbers suck just as much. Bee Train has some of the worst VA's around. Madhouse having old men with hoarse voices.

BTW, anything from before 1999 really is kinda terrible. I still like it from the "EAT SCAT!" lines from Angel Cop.

1987
03-12-2009, 10:24 PM
Generally, I find that there's just something about dubs that displeases me. This is not to say that I wouldn't watch a dubbed anime, though, and I have seen a few good ones, but I just prefer to watch anime subtitled. I like to try and listen to what the characters are saying and how they say things (like Satoko and Rika's speech patterns in Higurashi no Naku Koro ni, for example), and to think how I might have translated things had I been doing the subtitles. (So watching anime becomes like a fun little translation exercise for me - haha!)


If it would be British, I might think about watching a dub.

Sadly enough, the worst dub I have ever come across was actually a British dub of KO Beast. It was so terrible, I had to turn it off after about five minutes for my sanity. @_@

So saying that, I've just found a British dub of Urusei Yatsura (called 'Lum the Invader Girl') on YouTube, and it's great :laugh:

ichimoku_fanboy
03-12-2009, 10:27 PM
i cant speak for everyone else, but i do personally enjoy subbed better because america cant screw it up with crap like "Believe it!"

dattebayo is so much better....

Gjallarhorn
03-12-2009, 10:34 PM
i cant speak for everyone else, but i do personally enjoy subbed better because america cant screw it up with crap like "Believe it!"

dattebayo is so much better....

You do realize that "Dattebayo" is supposed to be childish and annoying, right? That's why they threw in "Believe it", because it works as a decent english counterpart, even though it isn't a translation.

Manhattan_Project_2000
03-12-2009, 10:55 PM
You do realize that "Dattebayo" is supposed to be childish and annoying, right? That's why they threw in "Believe it", because it works as a decent english counterpart, even though it isn't a translation.
Oh Xero, Xero, Xero. You must have missed the memo. "Dattebayo" is cooler the "Habeeb it" because it's Japanese. Now lets all eat Pocky and drink our Pocari Sweat and forget this conversation ever happened, desu.

Gjallarhorn
03-12-2009, 10:57 PM
Oh Xero, Xero, Xero. You must have missed the memo. "Dattebayo" is cooler the "Habeeb it" because it's Japanese. Now lets all eat Pocky and drink our Pocari Sweat and forget this conversation ever happened, desu.

Desu desu kawaii ja nai dir en grey desu, dattebayo.

CrystalAce
03-14-2009, 03:38 AM
Why in the world do people choose Japanese sub over English dub?
Anyone care to answer?

Just love:love: for the language...in general speaking that is ...

Datenshi25
03-14-2009, 08:04 AM
Personally, I will watch either. It really depends wether I can find them at the store or not, if not, then I watch them online. Normally they are subbed.
Sometimes I watch the subs to skip ahead and watch more then currently being shown in the english, but often when the english does come out I go out and buy it. If I have the money of course.

jtdlives
03-14-2009, 08:19 AM
I myself prefer dubbed over subbed. I would rather hear english. I usally find the japanesee a littly annoying. Since I watch all my anime on DVD or the internet I get to keep all the gore that was in the orginal, but lately a lot of anime has been coming out on DVD not dubbed probably due to cost. So I'm forced to watch subbed versions. What are you going to do.

Niro
03-14-2009, 06:48 PM
I prefer everything subbed, because otherwise it just feels unnatural...there's also the fact when companies dub they sometimes tend to stray away from the original dialogue and westernize too much.

wolfgirl90
03-15-2009, 01:36 AM
I prefer everything subbed, because otherwise it just feels unnatural...there's also the fact when companies dub they sometimes tend to stray away from the original dialogue and westernize too much.

That depends on what you are comparing it to. Are you talking about anime on television or all anime in general? The westernization of dialogue (depending on what you mean by that) is usually only done on anime that is expected to appear on television.

Are you comparing the dialogue from a fansub (a translation most likely done by an amateur) to the dub? Because the dialogue is going to be different no matter what (they are not going to be exactly the same) and you are assuming that (unless you can fluently understand Japanese) that the sub is correct or is some definitive translation of the anime that you are watching:rolleyes:.

suzumi
03-15-2009, 02:55 AM
Desu desu kawaii ja nai dir en grey desu, dattebayo.

*dies*

I personally prefer the original Japanese (but that may just be because I'm Japanese, therefore, biased). I think that they match the characters more.

I haven't seen many English dubs (Black Lagoon, Naruto, Bleach, Gundam SEED, Chrno Crusade, Code Geass, Death Note...off the top of my head) but each one of them has made me want to bash my head against something.

Code Geass expecially ticked me off. None of the VC's seemed to be able to pronounce anything right. Which I found very odd, because most of the names are English names. But no!! They must pronounce it; "Lance-a-lot"!!

Anyway, this might only be because I am a big seiyuu (voice actor) fan, and I will watch a series specifically just to hear that one seiyuu's voice. But still... *shrug* Maybe I'm just picky...

And I can't stand most of the girl voices in the dubs!! I really don't know what it is, but it drives me nuts!! You should hear my Euphy impression. >_>

Inuyashalover23
03-15-2009, 04:35 AM
Well,the first anime I watched was Inuyasha and it was dubbed,it was not untill later that I've found some episodes subbed and I HATED them,I couldn't stand Japanese voice actors...
Later on I started to watch some anime subbed and I thoughtthat it actually sounds better(atleast to me) and now I even prefer watching Inuyasha and other anime subbed...
It's true, there are many good dubs but I just like to hear Japanese =)

*Tsuki*
03-15-2009, 04:42 AM
I perfer the dubbed versions because I can't stand reading subtitles, but I like the sound of the originals better. Sometimes when they choose the voice actors for the dubbed versions, they do a really crappy job, and it just doesn't seem like that's the right voice for the character . . . But, I don't really mind, I just deal with it best i can

BestFly
03-15-2009, 05:50 PM
A lot of shows lately that have gotten US television releases (especially on adult swim or something) have normally gotten very good voice acting. I'd go as far to say that Pokemon even has decent voice acting for the show. They basically have bigger budgets or whatever..... i dont know the reasons...

but when you look at shows that have had english dvd only releases you can see a huge drop off in quality for the most part. There might be some shows that have had good voice dubs, but it's not a normal things.

That being said, people often overexagerate how bad english dubs are, but nonetheless most of the the time someone watching a new show will watch subs simply because it's the only thing they can.

Doom85
03-15-2009, 06:27 PM
I think dubs and subs are about even for me. I rank dubs from what I've seen so far:

The excellent: Cowboy Bebop, FLCL, Fullmetal Alchemist, Beck, Baccano, Samurai Champloo, Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya, most movies especially Miyazaki's and Tekkonkinkreet
The great: Death Note, Gurren Lagann, Darker than Black, Black Lagoon, One Piece (Funimation dub), Noein: To Your Other Self, School Rumble, Eureka Seven, Ghost Hunt, Shakugan no Shana
The good: Naruto, Bleach, Azumanga Daioh, Case Closed, Ah! My Goddess, Dragonball/DBZ, Fruits Basket, Full Metal Panic, Neon Genesis Evangelion, Outlaw Star, Gundam Seed, Code Geass, Yu Yu Hakusho, Slayers, Shin Chan, Tweeny Witches, Shuffle
The so-so: Inuyasha, Final Fantasy Unlimited, Betterman, Hunter x Hunter, Tenchi Universe, Gundam 00, Tsubasa: Reservoir Chronicle
The awful: Fantastic Children, Love Hina, most 4Kids dubs (Pokemon was pretty good)

As for the idea that it destroys the original vision, until I hear the creator's word for it, I'm hardly going to take the word of somebody over the Internet, especially when two directors have said they prefer the dub of their work (Bebop and FLCL), Oda (the mangaka of One Piece) picked out the One Piece Funi actors himself.

Also, subs are hardly perfect themselves. They've made some bad choices: making Sasuke (Naruto) sound like he's 30-40, making Edward Elric sound like a girl, and making Goku sound like he hasn't hit puberty yet. And the Black Lagoon sub leaves a lot to be desired.

Also, why do people STILL mention "believe it"? There have been 210 episodes dubbed so far, and only 1-25 used "Believe it!" (after that, I think it showed up like once or twice during the fillerthon).

suzumi
03-15-2009, 08:19 PM
Also, subs are hardly perfect themselves. They've made some bad choices: making Sasuke (Naruto) sound like he's 30-40, making Edward Elric sound like a girl, and making Goku sound like he hasn't hit puberty yet. And the Black Lagoon sub leaves a lot to be desired.

Excuse me, but Sugiyama Noriaki does NOT sound like a 30-40 year old (even though his is 33 =P). And Ed Elric IS voiced by a girl. Besides, I personally think Park Romi did a better job than the guy that did Ed's voice in the dub.

And what exactly was wrong with the voice acting in Black Lagoon? Sure, Duch's voice annoyed the hell out of me. And yes, I do think that the sub was very good. But I personally couldn't stand Balalaika's dub after hearing Koyama Mami voicing her. And IMO Revy sounded too girly. The only time I liked her voice was when it went a bit deeper in the fight scenes.

Memento Mori
03-15-2009, 08:28 PM
There are animefanbrats who like to be "pure" and have everything Japanese because they can't even fathom how terrible it would be to have something Western put into their anime.

They'd be so shocked, they'd probably choke on their pocky sticks.

I hate how people use the whole Naruto's Believe It thing as if it improves the quality of their sub/dub argument.

Dattebayo was more annoying than Believe it, to me. O_o

Doom85
03-16-2009, 09:51 AM
Excuse me, but Sugiyama Noriaki does NOT sound like a 30-40 year old (even though his is 33 =P). And Ed Elric IS voiced by a girl. Besides, I personally think Park Romi did a better job than the guy that did Ed's voice in the dub.

And what exactly was wrong with the voice acting in Black Lagoon? Sure, Duch's voice annoyed the hell out of me.

Oh come on, Sasuke does sound WAY too old in the sub. Another problem with the sub: Naruto's "SASUKE!!!" scream makes the ears bleed, the dub thankfully toned it down some. Also, after hearing the dub Gaara, sub Gaara sounds tame in comparison.

And I'm sorry, I prefer Ed sounding like a guy (it's excusable in his flashback scenes, but by the time he's 15......yeah). Ironically, they've changed pretty much all the seiyus in the upcoming new FMA series EXCEPT Ed's, which for me is a moronic decision (everyone else was mostly great, just Ed could've been better).

Well, Dutch is a main character, you mess up his voice and it's pretty noticeable. Also, when they weren't actually speaking Japanese, the sub became amusing (and not in a good way). Then again, a lot of subs can be dreadful when English lines are required (though not always, Ghost Hunt's last episode featured one of the most well-spoken English lines in a sub I've ever heard).

"they can't even fathom how terrible it would be to have something Western put into their anime"

Considering how many anime have Western characters/references not to mention Japan's obsession with America (funny quote I heard: "America wants to be Japan, Japan wants to be America"), that's a very silly stance to take. So I guess series like Fullmetal Alchemist, D. Gray-man, Cowboy Bebop, etc. are taboo to them since the shows have pretty much nothing to do with Japan.

suzumi
03-16-2009, 10:18 AM
Oh come on, Sasuke does sound WAY too old in the sub. Another problem with the sub: Naruto's "SASUKE!!!" scream makes the ears bleed, the dub thankfully toned it down some. Also, after hearing the dub Gaara, sub Gaara sounds tame in comparison.

And I'm sorry, I prefer Ed sounding like a guy (it's excusable in his flashback scenes, but by the time he's 15......yeah). Ironically, they've changed pretty much all the seiyus in the upcoming new FMA series EXCEPT Ed's, which for me is a moronic decision (everyone else was mostly great, just Ed could've been better).

It's all just preference in the end, I suppose. And Ishida Akira (Gaara's CV) has no fault in my eyes (or should I say ears?). I thought his voice was perfect for Gaara.


Well, Dutch is a main character, you mess up his voice and it's pretty noticeable. Also, when they weren't actually speaking Japanese, the sub became amusing (and not in a good way). Then again, a lot of subs can be dreadful when English lines are required (though not always, Ghost Hunt's last episode featured one of the most well-spoken English lines in a sub I've ever heard).Well, you can't really expect all Japanese CVs to be fluent in English. Just like I don't expect all Americans CVs to be fluent in Japanese. And that is the main reason I don't cringe every time someone says (or tries to say) a Japanese name or term in the dubs. >_>

OtakuInu!!!
05-11-2009, 06:16 AM
Because they cut some of the scenes, dub wrong sometimes, and some of the voices are suckish like Naruto's and Sasuke's!!! But most are okay. Plus in my country there are two dubs!!! :banghead::mad:

Plus it's good to learn how to speak in Japanese while you're watching!!!

Ayt!!!

[Spoiler]
05-11-2009, 09:03 AM
Why in the world do people choose Japanese sub over English dub?

So far from what I've seen all the dubbed anime has been satisfactory for me. (That may be because I don't read or watch as much anime/manga as some of the other "otaku"s.

So why? Other than the fact that there's prolly only one voice actor that does a lot of roles. @__@

Anyone care to answer?

Because they are Japanophiles. They will love anything that originally comes from Japan no matter how much better it is in English.

AF SUCKS
05-11-2009, 09:09 AM
Plus it's good to learn how to speak in Japanese while you're watching!!!

OK!!!

Show me one person that's actually done this.

SeraphimAriaRhapsody
05-11-2009, 11:21 AM
BECAUSE THEY CUT SOME SCENES, DUB WRONG AND THE VOICES SUCK!!!:banghead::mad:

Plus it's good to learn how to speak in Japanese while you're watching!!!

OK!!!


Lulz. To be young, foolish, and naive.


Show me one person that's actually done this.

Burn of epic laughs.

*tips hat to you*



Nobody can learn any language from watching television without understand the basic from a native or a college level class.

AF SUCKS
05-11-2009, 11:27 AM
Not totally, but it's a good tool to understand the jist of the language or it's flow.

My sister was a literacy volunteer teaching English to Mexicans in California and she suggested they leave a TV on during the day to hear it speak. It was an aid for getting used to the casual flow of English speech, but was not a substitute for actual teaching.

In Japan she applied the same method to her college taught Japanese when she encountered regional dialect as well as casual euphemisms and slang.

_-Anonymous-_
05-11-2009, 12:13 PM
I love dubs !!

i remember when i started watching bleach, the first 3 seasones wore dub .... then came ths subz ... i really liked the dubz better ~_~

wolfgirl90
05-11-2009, 12:55 PM
BECAUSE THEY CUT SOME SCENES, DUB WRONG AND THE VOICES SUCK!!!:banghead::mad:

Plus it's good to learn how to speak in Japanese while you're watching!!!

OK!!!


While it is your own opinion that the dub voices "suck", cutting scenes is something that happens to a very, very small amount of anime. Of the small amount of anime the appear on television (and would therefore be subject to the rules of the network), an even smaller amount of anime have to be edited due to the time and/or the target audience. If you are basing this off of anime from 4KidsTV and Cartoon Network, then DUH, of course they are edited.

The dubbing...again, unless you are fluent in Japanese, you have no idea if the dub is right or wrong. If you are comparing the dub (whose script was compiled by professional translaters) to a sub (most likey done by an amature), then you have a moot argument.

If you think you can learn conversational Japanese by watching Naruto, go ahead and try it.:laugh:

Miss Moonlight
05-11-2009, 12:59 PM
Because they are Japanophiles. They will love anything that originally comes from Japan no matter how much better it is in English.
Well, that's not always true. While I like some dubs (for an example, DIC's sailormoon dub, as flawed as it was), the only real reason i'd choose the original over the dub is because it's the original, it's uncut and as it's intended to be seen. I wouldn't really care what language it was in otherwise. But because I like things in their purest forms, that's why I prefer the originals mostly.

AutisticOtakuGirl
05-11-2009, 01:49 PM
I really don't get why people prefer subtitled anime over dubbed. Personally, I prefer dubbed over subbed for many reasons. (1) For me it's easier to remember what's going on and what's said when watching the english dub, rather than reading subtitles. (2) When watching subbed anime you have to read the subtitles rather than paying attention to what's going on on the screen. Even though it's right there on the screen you can really miss a lot of what happens especially details (3) Sometimes the subtitles go by so fast that you can't keep up or there's to much to read in one shot, also many japanese names can be long or difficult to pronounce so I often have to slow down when some names are shown in which case I may also miss reading the rest before it goes off the screen. Sometimes I try speed reading subs and I still can't finish it in time. This also makes it difficult to know everything that's going on or being said. Some anime can have lot's of dialogue in it (Death Note for example) making it even more difficult to keep up. I remember when going to an anime club (which the majority of the anime was subbed) one series I particularly had the most trouble with was Kare Kano (His and Her Circumstances) The subtitles were so many and thay went by so fast it was basically impossible to keep up.

The main reason I know of for people prefering subbed over dubbed is that they often say the dubs sound like crap, which I also disagree with. Though, there are some anime that that really do have horrible dubbing (best example I can think of is the original dub of One Piece) there are also a lot of anime that have really good and decent dubs like Death Note, Code Geass, and Ouran High School Host Club. So, anyway, I for one prefer watching english dubbed anime over the subtitled version any day.

Just a note to all of those who say that dubbed anime is also often edited. If you're watching the dubbed anime on cable TV then that's why it's edited. That doesn't mean that if you were to go out and by a series on DVD that it would be edited. That's only when it's shown on TV in which case they edit out content for cultural reasons and because most anime on TV (with exceptions such as the Adult Swim block on Cartoon Network) is being geared toward kids in which they basically cut out all blood, sexual situations, language, drugs, occult stuff or any other material parents may find offensive or inappropriate. Though there are a few dubbed anime that are mostly sold on DVD edited (almost anything from 4kids) or have totally edited versions sold (Naruto, One Piece), most anime with dubs do not. 4kids specifically license and release anime for children only which is why they're videos are sold edited. Most anime that have been shown on Cartoon Network like during the old Toonami block (Rurouni Kenshin, Outlaw Star, Tenchi Muyo, Yuyu Hakusho, Blue Submarine no. 6), were anime already out on video that they edited so it could be shown to kids.

Gjallarhorn
05-11-2009, 02:23 PM
Well, that's not always true. While I like some dubs (for an example, DIC's sailormoon dub, as flawed as it was), the only real reason i'd choose the original over the dub is because it's the original, it's uncut and as it's intended to be seen. I wouldn't really care what language it was in otherwise. But because I like things in their purest forms, that's why I prefer the originals mostly.

Not true. While fansubs often are are subtitle recordings from broadcast television. While Japan does tend to censor less from broadcast television in comparison to the US, it is still something that is practiced. The real "original" form would be what is on the series DVDs, most most fansubbed videos are not from.

Light Buster
05-11-2009, 02:25 PM
BECAUSE THEY CUT SOME SCENES, DUB WRONG AND THE VOICES SUCK!!!:banghead::mad:

Plus it's good to learn how to speak in Japanese while you're watching!!!

OK!!!

I don't think you watch anime enough to understand.

While it is your own opinion that the dub voices "suck", cutting scenes is something that happens to a very, very small amount of anime. Of the small amount of anime the appear on television (and would therefore be subject to the rules of the network), an even smaller amount of anime have to be edited due to the time and/or the target audience. If you are basing this off of anime from 4KidsTV and Cartoon Network, then DUH, of course they are edited.

The dubbing...again, unless you are fluent in Japanese, you have no idea if the dub is right or wrong. If you are comparing the dub (whose script was compiled by professional translaters) to a sub (most likey done by an amature), then you have a moot argument.

If you think you can learn conversational Japanese by watching Naruto, go ahead and try it.:laugh:
At least this is understandable.

Scarred DNA
05-11-2009, 02:51 PM
I prefer subtitled anything over dubbed. I watch French movies in their original language, I watch German movies in their original language, I watch Spanish movies in their original language, I watch Chinese movies in their original language, and I watch Japanese movies and anime in their original language.

It's not exactly that the dubs are bad (although in a lot of cases, you can just tell they did it on the cheap), it's just that I'd rather watch the show in its original language . . . in its original context. The original voice actors were chosen for a reason, and that reason usually shines through in their performance.

Expecting a sometimes completely different company to get the same performance out of a second-generation of voice actors is not realistic, imo.

In the case of live-action films - I just can't stand to see the desync between what I see their mouth doing, and what I hear.

Rem Nightfall
05-11-2009, 03:21 PM
I prefer subs and raws more often then dub because I feel the voices match the characters more.
L in the English dub sounds like a croaky frog and he sort of sounds like a very old man.
Example (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lomc3lxzgmw)
The Bang just doesn't seem right to me. They don't do it right or well enough.

Setsuna from Gundam 00 sounds monotone in the dub.

And let me get this straight, dubs don't say the Japanese names right or even change their names to more American ones. They don't do that very often, but I know 4kids does. Also the same thing with Pokemon and Sailor Moon though much older. They try to say their names this time around. And in most cases it just doesn't work.

Edit: Also with Scarred DNA. I watch all foreign films and shows in their original language. Why is it different with anime or things that come from Japan?

Seńor Nobody
05-11-2009, 03:26 PM
I prefer subtitled anything over dubbed. I watch French movies in their original language, I watch German movies in their original language, I watch Spanish movies in their original language, I watch Chinese movies in their original language, and I watch Japanese movies and anime in their original language.

It's not exactly that the dubs are bad (although in a lot of cases, you can just tell they did it on the cheap), it's just that I'd rather watch the show in its original language . . . in its original context. The original voice actors were chosen for a reason, and that reason usually shines through in their performance.

Expecting a sometimes completely different company to get the same performance out of a second-generation of voice actors is not realistic, imo.

In the case of live-action films - I just can't stand to see the desync between what I see their mouth doing, and what I hear.


I agree.

_-Anonymous-_
05-11-2009, 03:30 PM
BECAUSE THEY CUT SOME SCENES, DUB WRONG AND THE VOICES SUCK!!!:banghead::mad:

Plus it's good to learn how to speak in Japanese while you're watching!!!

OK!!!


i find that hard to believe.....

-akichan-
05-11-2009, 04:17 PM
I prefer Japanese sub. English translation in animes kinda gets in my nerves by how they pronounce the names in Japanese, and how the voice pitches goes up and down by every other word they say.

Miss Moonlight
05-11-2009, 04:48 PM
Not true. While fansubs often are are subtitle recordings from broadcast television. While Japan does tend to censor less from broadcast television in comparison to the US, it is still something that is practiced. The real "original" form would be what is on the series DVDs, most most fansubbed videos are not from.
I know. What I meant was mostly editing by dubbing companies. I own the original japanese DVD's.

Memento Mori
05-11-2009, 04:57 PM
I'd like to throw in the fact that sometimes the Japanese voice actors/actresses overdo the emotions of the characters IE: When the character is frustrated or upset, while the English voice actors/actresses (in general) make the character more believable when it comes to emotion.

AF SUCKS
05-11-2009, 04:58 PM
I think what people are upset about in translated anime is what American production companies edit out deliberately.

The only example I can think of was the 4kids job on One Piece, lots of senseless edits and horrible dubbing and voice casting. But when you look at it from the productions point of view in some cases anime has a lot of cultural references that Americans simply might not understand. I think the fans feel like their being robbed of some sort of purity for the sake of dialog being logical to a wider English speaking audience.

Miss Moonlight
05-11-2009, 05:00 PM
I'd like to throw in the fact that sometimes the Japanese voice actors/actresses overdo the emotions of the characters IE: When the character is frustrated or upset, while the English voice actors/actresses (in general) make the character more believable when it comes to emotion.
Hmm. Sometimes to me, it seems the opposite: the original va's seem to have alot of emotion, and the english va's sometimes don't come as close to achieving the same emotional effect. It depends on the anime though, I guess.

AutisticOtakuGirl
05-12-2009, 04:00 PM
BECAUSE THEY CUT SOME SCENES, DUB WRONG AND THE VOICES SUCK!!!:banghead::mad:

Plus it's good to learn how to speak in Japanese while you're watching!!!

OK!!!

If you're watching the dubbed anime on cable TV then that's why it's edited. That doesn't mean that if you were to go out and by a series on DVD that it would be edited. That's only when it's shown on TV in which case they edit out content for cultural reasons and because most anime on TV (with exceptions such as the Adult Swim block on Cartoon Network) is being geared toward kids in which they basically cut out all blood, sexual situations, language, drugs, occult stuff or any other material parents may find offensive or inappropriate. Though there are a few dubbed anime that are mostly sold on DVD edited (almost anything from 4kids) or have totally edited versions sold (Naruto, One Piece), most anime with dubs do not. 4kids specifically license and release anime for children only which is why they're videos are sold edited. Most anime that have been shown on Cartoon Network like during the old Toonami block (Rurouni Kenshin, Outlaw Star, Tenchi Muyo, Yuyu Hakusho, Blue Submarine no. 6), were anime already out on video that they edited so it could be shown to kids.

Capernicus
05-12-2009, 04:22 PM
It varies on the anime for me. I think the Azumanga Daioh dubbing was much funnier than the sub, though both are good. I like the Strawberry Panic sub (though Nagisa's voice hurts my ears a little), but unfortunately there's no dub for me to compare it to. I've heard Shuffle! in both forms, and I like both. I dunno.

I'm lazy. I usually watch the dub if it's available, and if I hate it then I switch.

Funny though, I've never heard a sub I didn't like...maybe I just don't watch enough subbed anime...

Regardless, I'm glad someone decided to point out this ridiculous hate-on for dubs. And I'm even more pleased that quite a few respected members of this community are on the same page as me. And, infinitely even more pleased that only 2 or 3 posts were by retarded Japanophiles. *coughotakudogcough* =D

AF SUCKS
05-12-2009, 04:30 PM
Tenchi in Tokyo had a well documented nude scene with all the female characters, not to mention that Ryoko was nude most of the time. Outlaw Star as well had more than brief nudity. These are edits that had to happen to get these shows on the air especially in the afternoon when they're targeting the after school crowd. The violence in Rurouni Kenshin was tamed down a bit compared to the Samurai X series it derived from.

Oh, and I do believe CN had a slight problem with the premise of Yuyu Hakusho dying. They aired it anyway but Turner Networks did raise an objection to the show.

wolfgirl90
05-12-2009, 04:40 PM
And let me get this straight, dubs don't say the Japanese names right or even change their names to more American ones. They don't do that very often, but I know 4kids does. Also the same thing with Pokemon and Sailor Moon though much older. They try to say their names this time around. And in most cases it just doesn't work.

Edit: Also with Scarred DNA. I watch all foreign films and shows in their original language. Why is it different with anime or things that come from Japan?

The origin really doesn't matter. However, of the small amount of people who watch anime with any sort of regularity, an even smaller amount of people watch them in Japanese (by watching fansubs and such) and an even smaller amount of people PREFER to watch anime in Japanese for one reason or another.

Because of this, due to the very small amount of people who prefer to watch anime in Japanese, it would not be at all cost effective to appeal to just these people. The licensing fees are already expensive and these people may not even buy the DVDs that are produced. Be honest: if there was a sub-only version of your favorite anime on DVD, would you buy it or say "screw it, I can watch it on the Internet"?. That is the reason why, despite all of the demands for uncut versions of Yu-Gi-Oh and Shaman King (complete with Japanese track), the DVDs failed.


I prefer Japanese sub. English translation in animes kinda gets in my nerves by how they pronounce the names in Japanese, and how the voice pitches goes up and down by every other word they say.

When it comes to saying names right, I don't understand the double standard placed on English voice actors.

So let me get this straight: its bad when the English voice actors can't pronouce Japanese names correctly but its fine when Japanese voice actors can't say English names correctly? Why is this?

I'm suprised that, by this logic, nobody's head bursts from watching anime like Code Geass and Le Chevalier D'On in Japanese.

It like a linguistic hell.

Diocletian
05-12-2009, 06:21 PM
BECAUSE THEY CUT SOME SCENES, DUB WRONG AND THE VOICES SUCK!!!:banghead::mad:

Plus it's good to learn how to speak in Japanese while you're watching!!!

OK!!!


Dub wrong? How can you dub wrong? Unless you have a degree in English I wouldn't count on you telling me that their grammar is wrong.

BTW, you're not learning Japanese. You're learning simple, basic stuff that they say over and over again ex. Itadakimasu, Ohayogozaimasu. That my friend is not going to make you fluent.

espeon977
05-12-2009, 08:27 PM
I prefer subs to dubs sometimes.

The dubs done by the Studio Ghibli films are well done, and Bandai and Funimation usually do good jobs.

Zatch Bell had a good dub too, they captured Keyo(maru)'s pretty well, as well as all the other characters Suzume/Susie sounded like the clueless girl she was, Zatch sounded hyper, and the name changes were reasonable. (I can understand Suzume to Susie, they sound kind of alike, and it's easier for younger viewers to remember) (i can't actually remember the unchanged names well since I only watched the dub by the way)

Prine Of Tennis also had a good dub, as well as Pani Poni Dash, Becky sounded like the kid she was, the bunny sounded introverted and shy, and well, everyone else was pretty fitting. The jokes were also clear.

As for the reason people only watch Japanese dubs

They want the original voice acting, or they're fans of the seiyuus.

They've seen too many bad dubs to believe any are good.

(examples of bad dubs I have are Haruhi Suzumiya, everyone but Haruhi and Mikuru were fine by me, but those two, Mikuru was too high pitched, and Haruhi... she didn't really sound sinister enough. Then there's Lucky Star, if you heard what Wendy lee did to the Timotei joke, you would know, her voice isn't fitting for Konata, and you could tell they were just reading off the script. Then there's Naruto, I have to turn the volume on my tv WAY up to hear anything Hinata says, but it's too late and then I have someone else's annoying voice (usually Sakura or Naruto's voice) blasting in my ears.

I can't really think of anything else, other than the Japanophile thing.

Tetsanosuke
05-12-2009, 09:15 PM
Example: English dub of Kojinki No Gash Bell... Sure it works but they cut out things. I'd rather watch the subbed version of this anime because it's not torn into an American kids show. x3 In the Japanese version blood exists. So in that way it seems 'pure' or another sense of the word for me.

But if they do a good job with dubbing, and don't change anything really, I couldn't care less. I like watching both any way, so I can see the discrepancies between each. =o

Edit: Good and bad are subjective in this case, really, so my good can be what you call bad, and vice versa. So in the end it's not a big deal. Unless you're an otaku zealot. Then- apparently it is.

Acnologia
05-12-2009, 11:53 PM
I mainly watch subs cause they are easier to access, and we don't have cable. I have some english anime DVDs though, like Bubblegum Crisis, which IMO was very good, and they didn't censor anything.

Rem Nightfall
05-13-2009, 12:06 AM
The origin really doesn't matter. However, of the small amount of people who watch anime with any sort of regularity, an even smaller amount of people watch them in Japanese (by watching fansubs and such) and an even smaller amount of people PREFER to watch anime in Japanese for one reason or another.

Because of this, due to the very small amount of people who prefer to watch anime in Japanese, it would not be at all cost effective to appeal to just these people. The licensing fees are already expensive and these people may not even buy the DVDs that are produced. Be honest: if there was a sub-only version of your favorite anime on DVD, would you buy it or say "screw it, I can watch it on the Internet"?. That is the reason why, despite all of the demands for uncut versions of Yu-Gi-Oh and Shaman King (complete with Japanese track), the DVDs failed.



When it comes to saying names right, I don't understand the double standard placed on English voice actors.

So let me get this straight: its bad when the English voice actors can't pronouce Japanese names correctly but its fine when Japanese voice actors can't say English names correctly? Why is this?

I'm suprised that, by this logic, nobody's head bursts from watching anime like Code Geass and Le Chevalier D'On in Japanese.

It like a linguistic hell.

To the first. You buy French films with subtitles and you buy Spanish films with subtitles. I don't see any difference between Japanese other then people being bias. I watch Raws as well as Subs. And for the most part believe I should be doing my own subtitles cause most subbers don't have the translations incorrect.


To the second. I sort of like the Japanese spin to the English names, It make them sound so much better. I don't like the way English Americans speak. They put to much emphasis on one letter in most cases. I sort of like the soft Japanese way of saying English names. Just like I prefer British English over American English. Japanese Engrish is nice.

-akichan-
05-13-2009, 12:23 AM
BECAUSE THEY CUT SOME SCENES, DUB WRONG AND THE VOICES SUCK!!!

Plus it's good to learn how to speak in Japanese while you're watching!!!

OK!!!

I respect personal opinions. Especially how straight that is. C'mon, he/she is only 13, no need to be mean. I like how this person was so straight when giving a personal opinion. But words could be better.^^;

Seta Souji
05-13-2009, 01:13 AM
I've only watched a handful of anime dubbed but never really had a problem with it. The only thing I prefer subbed are movies because the facial expressions of the actor/actresses must match the voice. It adds that extra "umph" to the art of acting.

Baka Tenshi
05-13-2009, 01:16 AM
Why in the world do people choose Japanese sub over English dub?
Because I like it better. The dubs ruin it for me.

FLASH-X
05-13-2009, 01:27 AM
you are right kiryuu dubs ruin the whole god damn story

rikumi
05-13-2009, 03:30 AM
I've never watched dubbed anime series. It just spoils my mood when I'm really into that particular anime. The last time I came by Code Geass R2 dubbed in English, I got a mild headache because the dubbers' voices don't really suit my ears. Perhaps it's because of habit?

Frankly, I think it's annoying to my ears if I watch an anime without Japanese-speaking voices. Probably because Japanese tone sounds normal along with the lips of the characters. The quality should be much better, also.

OtakuInu!!!
05-13-2009, 03:32 AM
Show me one person that's actually done this.

I can!!! I take notes while watching but if the subs are too fast to read I pause the DVD.

OtakuInu!!!
05-13-2009, 03:35 AM
I respect personal opinions. Especially how straight that is. C'mon, he/she is only 13, no need to be mean. I like how this person was so straight when giving a personal opinion. But words could be better.^^;

thanks!!!:laugh:

OtakuInu!!!
05-13-2009, 03:39 AM
Dub wrong? How can you dub wrong? Unless you have a degree in English I wouldn't count on you telling me that their grammar is wrong.

BTW, you're not learning Japanese. You're learning simple, basic stuff that they say over and over again ex. Itadakimasu, Ohayogozaimasu. That my friend is not going to make you fluent.

Dub wrong meaning the inappropriate words in the Japanese that they dub because they make kids watch them.

I don't ask to be fluent. I just want to know how to speak even just a little.

OtakuInu!!!
05-13-2009, 03:45 AM
If you're watching the dubbed anime on cable TV then that's why it's edited. That doesn't mean that if you were to go out and by a series on DVD that it would be edited. That's only when it's shown on TV in which case they edit out content for cultural reasons and because most anime on TV (with exceptions such as the Adult Swim block on Cartoon Network) is being geared toward kids in which they basically cut out all blood, sexual situations, language, drugs, occult stuff or any other material parents may find offensive or inappropriate. Though there are a few dubbed anime that are mostly sold on DVD edited (almost anything from 4kids) or have totally edited versions sold (Naruto, One Piece), most anime with dubs do not. 4kids specifically license and release anime for children only which is why they're videos are sold edited. Most anime that have been shown on Cartoon Network like during the old Toonami block (Rurouni Kenshin, Outlaw Star, Tenchi Muyo, Yuyu Hakusho, Blue Submarine no. 6), were anime already out on video that they edited so it could be shown to kids.

I do watch animes on cable T.V. plus in my country there are two dubs and we have no choice. I also buy DVDs. So I know that!!! Like I know most animes are not for children.

OtakuInu!!!
05-13-2009, 03:47 AM
I'd like to throw in the fact that sometimes the Japanese voice actors/actresses overdo the emotions of the characters IE: When the character is frustrated or upset, while the English voice actors/actresses (in general) make the character more believable when it comes to emotion.

true that!!! especially the Tagalog voice in my country.

OtakuInu!!!
05-13-2009, 03:50 AM
i find that hard to believe.....

Which part?

OtakuInu!!!
05-13-2009, 03:56 AM
Lulz. To be young, foolish, and naive.

Nobody can learn any language from watching television without understand the basic from a native or a college level class.

Sorry if I am. I don't watch on T.V. I buy DVDs.

Medousa
05-13-2009, 04:18 AM
If I come across an anime that I can only find in dubed version, is good enough reason for me not to watch it!

1. Most dubs actors sounds the same and they dont deliver the emotions of the japanese voice actor as they should imo.

2. Some japanese words like -sama, -dono for example which are used after the name can not be accuretly translated in english simply because there is no such word in english dictionary and the dubed version ends up traslating them with -sir, -miss etc which is tottaly inacurate.

3. One other reason is that we allrdy know english how about we try to learn some japanese also?

subs ftw

OtakuInu!!!
05-13-2009, 04:26 AM
If I come across an anime that I can only find in dubed version, is good enough reason for me not to watch it!

1. Most dubs actors sounds the same and they dont deliver the emotions of the japanese voice actor as they should imo.

2. Some japanese words like -sama, -dono for example which are used after the name can not be accuretly translated in english simply because there is no such word in english dictionary and the dubed version ends up traslating them with -sir, -miss etc which is tottaly inacurate.

3. One other reason is that we allrdy know english how about we try to learn some japanese also?

subs ftw

I mostly agree!!!

midori-no-ink
05-13-2009, 06:22 AM
It's interesting to see how this debate has evolved, especially considering the dramatic increase in dub quality over the past few years.

For me, it's entirely a matter of which version happens to fall into my hands first. As a result, I tend to watch primarily subtitled or raw anime when I get the time to do so since they seem to be easier to find online (or at a rental shop). I have a soft spot for those dubbed and edited shows they aired on Toonami and whatnot, but I have a tendency to skip over dub tracks on DVD's I purchase due to a love of the Japanese language.

Japanese is my major. I love the language, I love the culture. (There's plenty I dislike about the language and culture as well, but this isn't the place for those opinions.) The Japanese used in most anime (relatively speaking) is easy to understand, and interesting, even if a bit unusual at times. By no means is it a substitute for a textbook...but it can be a fun supplement. What's wrong with applying what you're studying to something you genuinely enjoy? And it's true: the more input of one language you get, the greater your fluency will become. Of course they key to this is having a decent understanding of the language you're trying to boost your skills in...but this isn't a language acquisition debate.

Back on topic. Anime may have originally been produced in Japan for a Japanese-speaking audience, but dubs have value as well. They're a variation on the original, and I see nothing wrong with that. Even with the older dubs that didn't pay as much attention to reproducing the "exact" feel of the original, they were still enjoyable and very much watchable. If you want absolute authenticity, go with the sub. If you want to the interpretation created with your language-speaking demographic in mind, go for the dub, but you can't expect it to be identical to the Japanese. If it were meant to be that way, the anime would have been produced in English in the first place, don't you think?

Back when anime was not as popular and less emphasis was placed on turning the dub into an exact translation of the original script, I feel like the sub/dub argument made more sense, but it's still going on? Hmm. I find it funny that people get all caught up in sub vs. dub as opposed to manga being printed left-to-right or right-to-left. Unless that debate already fizzled over and I missed out on it entirely :)

Taikutsu_Remedy
05-13-2009, 07:01 AM
I am an ardent lover of dubs, my reasons explained more eloquently here (http://taikutsuremedy.blogspot.com/2009/04/west-strikes-back-in-defense-of-dubbing.html).

And I know I'm going to lose all credibility for saying this, but my love of dubs extends even to 4kids productions. I don't care how bastardized they are, the moment I heard Seto Kaiba threatening to, "crush" Yugi with his, "liquidity and giant balance sheet," I knew there was at least one nobel prize worthy writer working at 4kids.

midori-no-ink
05-13-2009, 07:13 AM
And I know I'm going to lose all credibility for saying this, but my love of dubs extends even to 4kids productions. I don't care how bastardized they are, the moment I heard Seto Kaiba threatening to, "crush" Yugi with his, "liquidity and giant balance sheet," I knew there was at least one nobel prize worthy writer working at 4kids.
See, it's instances like this that make it impossible for me to hate dubs - sure maybe it's not what the original Japanese creator intended, but gosh darn it, it's hilarious!

AF SUCKS
05-13-2009, 08:16 AM
Watashi wa no otaku!!!

Chigau!!

This is proof that you can't learn Japanese from anime.

Doom85
05-13-2009, 09:20 AM
And I know I'm going to lose all credibility for saying this, but my love of dubs extends even to 4kids productions. I don't care how bastardized they are, the moment I heard Seto Kaiba threatening to, "crush" Yugi with his, "liquidity and giant balance sheet," I knew there was at least one nobel prize worthy writer working at 4kids.

I agree, I find some 4Kids dubs to be somewhat acceptable. Pokemon's original dub was great, and despite having totally original theme songs, they were actually good. The edits and occasional poor choice of dialogue aside, Yu-Gi-Oh (the first one, haven't bothered with GX or 5D) had a decent dub, mainly Yami/Yugi and Kaiba's voices. I've yet to watch Shaman King, but I heard some liked its dub somewhat. Cardcaptor Sakura, however, was edited so much and had so many episodes removed it wasn't even the same show anymore, and One Piece, hoo boy, by removing entire story arcs they made future arcs impossible to work with characters from those early arcs returning and one of the future Strawhats having a major part of his character motivation revolve around a character in one of the arcs removed by 4Kids, and that doesn't even mention the awful voice acting (save Zoro, or as 4Kids insisted, "Zolo") and idiotic "translation". Thank god for Funimation and its far superior dub (which, BTW, had its Strawhat VAs picked out by Oda himself, so the dub has the official stamp of approval by the creator himself :)).

Manhattan_Project_2000
05-13-2009, 09:34 AM
ITT: Nerds who whine about Animu voices not being in a language they don't speak and normal people. Face it, almost any dub done in the last 5 or 6 years is decent or better in quality, and very few of you are qualified to judge the quality of the Moonspeak dubs because you don't speak Moonspeak. And quit confusing Dubs with editing animu, they're two different issues entirely.

Anime Forum
05-13-2009, 09:38 AM
I actually find english dub better because I can understand what is said but Japanese dub is also pretty cool and most of the people in my school who likes anime like the Japanese dub. I guess it just all depends on the view point of each individual and their opinion. It really does not matter what language its in because it is all about the experience and as I said, the view point of the eye if the beholder.

AF SUCKS
05-13-2009, 09:44 AM
ITT: Nerds who whine about Animu voices not being in a language they don't speak.
But, if they know how to say "kawaii" and "baka" that makes them fluent.

Right?

The Grey Crane
05-13-2009, 10:02 AM
I do watch animes on cable T.V. plus in my country there are two dubs and we have no choice. I also buy DVDs. So I know that!!! Like I know most animes are not for children.



Sorry if I am. I don't watch on T.V. I buy DVDs.

Self-contradiction?

And are you sayin' Filipino dubbers are sucky dubbers? If your answer is yes then i shall prove you wrong.

SeraphimAriaRhapsody
05-13-2009, 10:34 AM
Sorry if I am. I don't watch on T.V. I buy DVDs.

It doesn't matter if you buy dvds. You still have to learn how to read and write the language, even with tv as an extra learning aid to understand the flow of the language.

Since your young, people are not going to take you seriously.

If you type without thinking things through, your going to be treated cruelly with mean remarks or intellgent post that make you look stupid.

Rem Nightfall
05-13-2009, 10:37 AM
Chigau!!

This is proof that you can't learn Japanese from anime.

Yes wrong is right. No means of in Japanese.

Shinigami_55
05-13-2009, 10:39 AM
i really can't have a good opinion because all anime i watch is in the original language and is subbed to portuguese, but i've seen a few episodes of an anime that was dub in english and i don't enjoyed it.(even if i can understand really good the english language.)

Manhattan_Project_2000
05-13-2009, 01:53 PM
But, if they know how to say "kawaii" and "baka" that makes them fluent.

Right?

Conversasionally fluent at least. What more words could you possibly need to convey thoughts in Japan?

AF SUCKS
05-13-2009, 01:54 PM
Yopparai

and

Isogashii

Diocletian
05-13-2009, 06:03 PM
Dub wrong meaning the inappropriate words in the Japanese that they dub because they make kids watch them.

I don't ask to be fluent. I just want to know how to speak even just a little.


How do you know that if you don't speak Japanese?


Conversasionally fluent at least. What more words could you possibly need to convey thoughts in Japan?

"How much?" and "Is a capsule hotel okay?" could help, but those are sentences and beyond "otaku" minds.

Damnit kids you aren't otaku! Unless you can name all the Kamen series in order and each protaganist you aren't "otaku".

Gjallarhorn
05-13-2009, 06:23 PM
How do you know that if you don't speak Japanese?



"How much?" and "Is a capsule hotel okay?" could help, but those are sentences and beyond "otaku" minds.

Damnit kids you aren't otaku! Unless you can name all the Kamen series in order and each protaganist you aren't "otaku".

Let's not forget the Super Sentai series.

wolfgirl90
05-13-2009, 10:01 PM
I can!!! I take notes while watching but if the subs are too fast to read I pause the DVD.

AGAIN, you are assuming that the words that you are looking at are accurate, which may or may not be true, but you wouldn't know because you don't speak Japanese.:banghead:

Sure, there might be phrases that you know and recognize, but you are not learning these phrases from the anime (you already know them).


Dub wrong meaning the inappropriate words in the Japanese that they dub because they make kids watch them.

I don't ask to be fluent. I just want to know how to speak even just a little.


Like I just said, you wouldn't know anything about this because you do not fluently speak Japanese. How do you know which words are appropriate to use in English if you are not fluent?

Its okay not to be fluent in Japanese (in fact, if you are trying to learn Japanese exclusively from anime, you never will be), but you really can not complain about the "accuracy" of the dub translations since you really wouldn't know anything about the language.

Diocletian
05-13-2009, 10:06 PM
Let's not forget the Super Sentai series.

Bonus points if you can name all the attacks used in Godzilla Tokyo S.O.S. I used to be able to name most of the moves but my memory isn't as good as when I was a 12 year old.

OtakuInu!!!
05-13-2009, 10:21 PM
Chigau!!

This is proof that you can't learn Japanese from anime.

But I just made that watashi wa no otaku up!!! I don't even think it's the correct sentence!!!

OtakuInu!!!
05-13-2009, 10:25 PM
Self-contradiction?

And are you sayin' Filipino dubbers are sucky dubbers? If your answer is yes then i shall prove you wrong.

No.

OtakuInu!!!
05-13-2009, 10:27 PM
AGAIN, you are assuming that the words that you are looking at are accurate, which may or may not be true, but you wouldn't know because you don't speak Japanese.:banghead:

Sure, there might be phrases that you know and recognize, but you are not learning these phrases from the anime (you already know them).



Like I just said, you wouldn't know anything about this because you do not fluently speak Japanese. How do you know which words are appropriate to use in English if you are not fluent?

Its okay not to be fluent in Japanese (in fact, if you are trying to learn Japanese exclusively from anime, you never will be), but you really can not complain about the "accuracy" of the dub translations since you really wouldn't know anything about the language.

I know that but animes are not the only one's I have reference from learning to speak Japanese.

Rem Nightfall
05-13-2009, 10:28 PM
But I just made that watashi wa no otaku up!!! I don't even think it's the correct sentence!!!

Which means, I am of Otaku....not quite right.

OtakuInu!!!
05-13-2009, 10:36 PM
Which means, I am of Otaku....not quite right.

Ayt!!! So what sould it be? Watashi wa otaku desu?!!! or Watashi wa otaku desu ka?!!!

Rem Nightfall
05-13-2009, 10:57 PM
Ayt!!! So what sould it be? Watashi wa otaku desu?!!! or Watashi wa otaku desu ka?!!!

Watshi omia[don't know how to actually spell it] otakuinu.

I am nerd dog.

OtakuInu!!!
05-14-2009, 03:54 AM
Watshi omia[don't know how to actually spell it] otakuinu.

I am nerd dog.

Thanks!!!

Asday
05-14-2009, 06:43 AM
They make it sound childish... once a series is English dubbed, it just becomes a 'cartoon', and they take out all the foul language and really tone down the gore. I personally can't stand English dubbed anime.
I think you've been on the receiving end of 4kids. I hate what they did to Pokémon.

Back on topic, though, I just prefer the Japanese language. Sometimes the dubs are "better", though, 'specially in the case of FLCL, (good lord that was fast-paced).

An example I like to point to, sometimes, is right at the beginning of Final Fantasy X. Auron gives Tidus a sword: "A gift from Jecht." To which Tidus replies: "My old man?" Terribly lip-synched to what I'm guessing used to be: "Do-san?" Things like that are just embarrasing.

EDIT: And I just noticed that this thread is 5 pages long, and I replied to the first page. Sorry. D:

AF SUCKS
05-14-2009, 08:56 AM
But I just made that watashi wa no otaku up!!! I don't even think it's the correct sentence!!!
It's not.

no is the possesive particle and is totally out of place here.

It's more like 'watashi wa otaku des'.

Mou chotto benkyo desu ne.

Reonic Flux
05-18-2009, 02:22 AM
*goes on topic*

Well, I'd rather watch the Japanese audio with English subs rather than hear the crappy American dubs. I'd rather take the risk of having the incorrect spelling of one word in the sub. At least the others have a higher chance of getting it correct.

Zrow
05-18-2009, 07:18 PM
Just kill them all >_<

SJ King
05-18-2009, 07:47 PM
It varies, but for the most part Subs will win.

For example

Death Note- Had a GREAT dub. Liked it more than the sub.

One Piece- Has a HORRIBLE Dub, like the sub more.

Code Geass-Same as Death Note

Naruto- Same as One Piece



it just varies.. for the most part, the subs are better IMO.

High Risk
05-18-2009, 10:14 PM
It has always been 50/50 for me.

For example, I can't even handle watching the japanese version of Trigun because the two female side character's voices are annoyingly high pitched and they sound like 10-15 year olds.

On the other hand, I prefer the sub for Bleach. I used to watch it about 3-4 years ago when it was still in Japan but I did watch the American version once or twice and didn't like it as much.

The voices have to match the characters. If it sounds better in English, fine. If it sounds better in Japanese, fine. I don't mind reading the subtitles for better quality voice acting.

yakman1692
05-19-2009, 03:45 PM
I agree that it really depends on the dub. Some are better than the subs, others are much much worse. However, dub vs. sub doesn't really affect which I watch. Usually its whatever I find first (usually sub). If I find out there's a dub, I may check it out to compare, but only in rare cases do I think the dub is better.

kero_-_chan
05-19-2009, 04:35 PM
i watch subs for 1 simple reason, i HATE american accents, only dub i ever liked was hellsing and oh guess what!

now if all dubs where done in england, then id probably be a dub supporter but as it stands, dubs can go jump with those horrible voices.

Dead rose
05-20-2009, 01:44 AM
well, if you are addicted to japnese audio then english dubs sound weird and horrible to you.but most of the dubs are bad. they try to bring out that japnese accent in their voice but fail miserably making it sound childish.
but it it depends on the animies too. in hell girl anime that english dub was "a bit" okay. but in others its awfull. take naruto for example. they cut out all those gore scenes in fighting and they just "over edit" that whole series making it more like a 7-8 year old's anime

kero_-_chan
05-20-2009, 02:13 AM
that'd probably be because of 2 things, 1, most cartoons in america are aimed at the 2-10 range, 2, cause the cartoons main demographic is so young they wanted to make it suitable for that age group.

another reason why i hate dubs, not just because of the accents, but because they change the very essence of what anime is.

Doom85
05-20-2009, 02:34 AM
take naruto for example. they cut out all those gore scenes in fighting and they just "over edit" that whole series making it more like a 7-8 year old's anime

On the TV broadcast, yes. However, on the DVD, the English version is completely unedited.

Also, how do they change what anime is? Same story, same characters, same animation, just different voices, ZOMG! When the creators of Cowboy Bebop, FLCL, and El-Hazard have said the dub is better, clearly dubs are not changing anything. And I'll try not to be offended by the whole "hate American accents" thing, but it is annoying (people can't help what accents they have, it's kinda petty to hate them).

wolfgirl90
05-20-2009, 09:47 AM
that'd probably be because of 2 things, 1, most cartoons in america are aimed at the 2-10 range, 2, cause the cartoons main demographic is so young they wanted to make it suitable for that age group.

That has to be done sometimes, I'm afraid. While older teens and adults are the ones with money to buy things, its been more than apparent that its that demographic that is not at the forefront of buying anime merchandise. Its children and young teens, not because they have money, but because they usually get more stuff at once (from their parents) and also because they are willing to buy broader merchandise (lunchboxes, stickers, cereal, backpacks, etc).

The anime companies (especially the distribution companies) are not making a lot of money from DVDs alone. They need to find ways of making money, so, depending on the anime (Naruto, Yu-Gi-Oh, Pokemon, etc), they are going to try to appeal to one of the most profitable demographics: children.

KeijiMaeda
05-20-2009, 09:56 AM
I watched a lot of dubbed anime when I was younger, but as I grew older I began to favour subbed a lot more.

Why? Well, firstly because I always prefer to read than just listen. I'm the kind of person who will choose to have the subtitles up whenever possible when watching TV or a film. Secondly, I think the Japanese accent and language is better suited to the fantasy setting. Having it all in English with American accents just doesn't sound as good.

kero_-_chan
05-21-2009, 09:54 AM
On the TV broadcast, yes. However, on the DVD, the English version is completely unedited.

Also, how do they change what anime is? Same story, same characters, same animation, just different voices, ZOMG! When the creators of Cowboy Bebop, FLCL, and El-Hazard have said the dub is better, clearly dubs are not changing anything. And I'll try not to be offended by the whole "hate American accents" thing, but it is annoying (people can't help what accents they have, it's kinda petty to hate them).

ok wait, thats something i didnt specify in my comment, i kept it simple to convey the basic thought but what i ment was i hate them in anime (had an american gf for 4 years :P) i hate american accents in anime.


The anime companies (especially the distribution companies) are not making a lot of money from DVDs alone. They need to find ways of making money, so, depending on the anime (Naruto, Yu-Gi-Oh, Pokemon, etc), they are going to try to appeal to one of the most profitable demographics: children.


they dont make much money from the dvd sales because they are so rediculously expensive in the first place, dunno about in the US but in AUS, a single 26 episode anime, box set, normally costs like $160 which is just insane. if the price goes up because of the costs of dubbing them then why dont they offer un-dubbed box sets for a lesser price as well as their dubbed version separatly, i aint gonna pay a tonne of extra money for a feature ill never use, so if they want my money ever its in their best interest to tailor their product to the my consumer need.

Doom85
05-21-2009, 10:28 AM
In the USA/Canada, anime is quite cheap, you can get a 26-episode series for $40-50 (or even cheaper if you shop smart). If anime boxsets cost that much in Australia, I think importing R1 (North American region) DVDs might be a cheaper alternative. You'll need a region-free DVD player, but I don't think those cost too much.

Releasing sub-only sets along with a bilingual set ultimately hurts sales since the stores aren't sure what to stock and the fanbase may favor one version too greatly over the other. Gurren Lagann faced this problem, IIRC Bandai said sales seemed to suffer because of this approach and all future series they do will either be dub/sub, or sub-only like Hayate the Combat Butler and sola.

Save for obscure series, dubbing a series IS meeting the general consumer need. As soon as Bandai announced certain series would be sub-only, the forums were filled with, "well, there goes my buck for Bandai" and so on. Dubs help keep the company in business, this has been true even back in the VHS days (which make the DVD prices look insanely cheap in comparison, newer fans have no idea how much anime used to cost back in the day), as Greg Aryes pointed out, "some old-school fans thought the reason we sold the dub videotapes for less was because we were trying to push the dub. Uh, no, what sort of business pushes a method that costs the company money to make? The simple fact is that the dub tapes cost less because the dub sold more."

In fact, sub-only sets for obscure anime may end up costing consumers MORE than if a dub had been included, just because the companies have to charge more since the series' obscurity and lack of dub will lower sales. For example, take Bandai's upcoming releases: Code Geass, a dub/sub release, has R2 Part 1 coming out for $40 MSRP with 9 episodes. Hayate the Combat Butler, a sub-only release, has Part 1 coming out for $40 MSRP with only 7 episodes. So losing dubs will probably not help save you money, quite the opposite in fact.

wolfgirl90
05-21-2009, 11:34 AM
they dont make much money from the dvd sales because they are so rediculously expensive in the first place, dunno about in the US but in AUS, a single 26 episode anime, box set, normally costs like $160 which is just insane. if the price goes up because of the costs of dubbing them then why dont they offer un-dubbed box sets for a lesser price as well as their dubbed version separatly, i aint gonna pay a tonne of extra money for a feature ill never use, so if they want my money ever its in their best interest to tailor their product to the my consumer need.

The DVDs are expensive because the distribution companies are losing money. Simply acquiring the license for an anime costs a lot of money. Add that up with dubbing costs (voice actors, translators, etc) and production costs (editing, making the DVDs, shipping them out, etc) and you have an expensive process, so anime DVDs are going to be a little expensive. It also doesn't help when people don't buy DVDs that are made at all.

So, to make money, they need to appeal to as many people as they can. Anime that would usually be branded for teens, like Naruto, will usually be edited to appeal to both children and teens (for as much as people complain about the dub, the dub is the thing that is making the money).

For obscure anime, like Bokusatsu Tenchi Dokoro-chan, as Doom85, these are often released with just a sub and few features. However, the majority of anime fans watch dubs (that's what started the business, and that's what keeps it going), so hearing a "sub-only" series usually turns off a lot of people, even the people who watched the series originally in Japanese. Dubbing is better in long run since much more people watch dubs than subs.

Also, the price of anime DVDs is rather good compared to what they pay for in Japan. In the US (AUS is not that much different), we often get about 3-5 episodes (plus special features) on a DVD for $30-40. The Japanese pay more than that for less, so we are the ones getting a deal. When it comes to box sets, those are a HUGE deal. Its pretty much always cheaper to buy the series boxset rather than buy each individual DVD. For example, your average 26 episode anime series will be released on about 6 DVDs, each costing about $30. That means buying each DVD will cost you $180. A series boxset of the same 26 episode will cost about $100, for a savings of $80!! In AUS, the same thing happens; paying $160 for a boxset is much better than paying $240 (or more!!) for the same amount of DVDs.

-akichan-
05-21-2009, 03:16 PM
Wow...I actually saw some anime DVDs with only two episodes, costing up to $50 USD.

yakman1692
05-21-2009, 04:11 PM
The price isn't a big deal for me, I usually only buy the series I know I'm gonna watch alot. And even then, if I don't like the dub I can easily put it on Japanese audio.

Doom85
05-21-2009, 04:26 PM
Wow...I actually saw some anime DVDs with only two episodes, costing up to $50 USD.

In Japan, that's the norm, it's insanely expensive compared to other countries. In the US, the only company that did that was Bandai Visual, and they closed down a while back.

Taikutsu_Remedy
05-21-2009, 06:51 PM
in AUS, a single 26 episode anime, box set, normally costs like $160 which is just insane.

Where the hell are you buying your dvds? O.o

I'm presuming prices vary across Aus, but in Sydney, I can normally get 26ep boxsets from between $30-$90, depending on the popularity of the series. The most expansive boxset I've ever seen was $140, but that was for Eureka Seven which is 50 episodes.

kero_-_chan
05-21-2009, 09:49 PM
dude where AM i buying them from? O.O

well, wollongong, only place that sells any is a music store and the prices are inflated, id go to sydney but a) dont have a car adn b) dont know where to shop in the first place.

Hautalken
06-01-2009, 11:30 AM
Show me one person that's actually done this.

*raises hand*

That's how I picked up so much Arabic actually ^^; Without the need of subs. And now I'm watching Japanese dramas and am slowly figuring out the language. That's the best part about subs! It gives me a chance to learn the language too.
And if the series is subbed, then there's less chance of scenes being deleted. Mostly it's the fight scenes that are deleted. And I really hate it when that happens -.-

So I'd rather go with subs :3

AF SUCKS
06-01-2009, 12:07 PM
And if the subtitles are paraphrasing what's actually being said, how would you know?

Also, could you carry on a conversation with someone in Japanese face to face armed with this self taught knowledge?

Hautalken
06-02-2009, 03:38 AM
Paraphrasing doesn't happen all the time. And once I catch the jist of the sentence, or if I learn the basic structure of most sentences, I can manage.

And no I can't do japanese. Not as yet, because I only began last month. But Arabic, yes.

agiup
06-02-2009, 04:36 AM
any subs will do as long as its correct lol

AF SUCKS
06-02-2009, 08:37 AM
Paraphrasing doesn't happen all the time. And once I catch the jist of the sentence, or if I learn the basic structure of most sentences, I can manage.

And no I can't do japanese. Not as yet, because I only began last month. But Arabic, yes.
On one hand I can see how the ear training would work, the ESL schools around here suggest their students keep a TV on during the day so they can better understand the flow of spoken English. But on the other hand in and of itself I just don't think it's a realistic way of learning Japanese, what do you have to go against other than the subtitles? They're going to speak in Japanese form which is SUB > OBJ > DATE, TIME, LOC, ETC., > ADJ > VERB and subtitles are written in the way we're used to reading. I went to see Letters from Iwo Jima in the theater and I can speak and understand a fair amount, but it was during this picture that I could catch what was written in English was different from what was said. Albeit they did a very good job translating these edits were unavoidable, I doubt anyone else watching would have cared to know it was done.

CherryBlade
06-06-2009, 05:29 AM
dubbed anime is usually westernized too much...but i can't blame anyone for that cuz dubbing is supposed to westernize the anime,to make it easier for ppl to understand what's going on..not everyone is an otaku you know^^
but personally i prefer subs.that includes anime,movies, series or anything..i just like watching the original version of everything.feels more natural. that's why i also sometimes(just sometimes) prefer reading manga over anime..i want to know the creator's original thoughts without any alternations:)