A choice?

[Jose]

I was reading Cap's gay marriage ban thread, and something this question dawned on me.....


So I will ask you [AF member] do you believe homosexuality is a choice, or do you believe homosexuals are just born that way?

=O [please keep this mature, we all know oh so well where topic about sexuality usually end up because of disagreement (trash bin)]

[Diocletian]

I really have no idea. It's one of those things that just shouldn't really matter. It can't be when you're born because if your parents were straight I doubt that would go into your genes and make you gay.

If you don't have to fill it out on a document for a license you shouldn't have to say it.

[Miss Moonlight]

I could be a choice for some, but for some it could also just be a pre-disposition. I don't think it really matters, to be honest.

[Beezer]

I really have no idea. It's one of those things that just shouldn't really matter. It can't be when you're born because if your parents were straight I doubt that would go into your genes and make you gay.

If you don't have to fill it out on a document for a license you shouldn't have to say it.


it could just be a dormant gene that happened to "turn on" with that particular person. The drummer in my band is gay, I'll ask him tomorrow what he thinks, I've never asked him before.

[Anime Forum]

Well I'm no high class doctor but in my view of this, I say they are born liking the same gender, it could be a choice but they may be born like that.

[╬Karami Mew~Meow]

I say it's a choice. People change there opinions & points of view throughout life.

[Eris]

I say it's a choice. People change there opinions & points of view throughout life.

Attraction is not a point of view. If a man likes women with red hair, it's not because he sat down in the kitchen one morning and decided "Darn it, I think I'm gonna choose to like women with red hair." But don't take my word for it. Attempt to make yourself like something that doesn't attract you.

Freud would probably say you're attracted to people who resemble your parents, but he is on the other hand quite full of crap, and obviously had issues with his parents.

[Kojack]

I'm an English student so I haven't a clue, but I remember hearing a while ago about sexual preference being based in biology.

[SigmaSD]

Actually, homosexuality does have some biological basis. There are some drugs that pregnant women take that have estrogen (female hormone), and androgen (male hormone). Some of these hormones affect the fetus' brain, which results in hormonal inbalance later in life.

It can also be attributed to trauma such as rape, and any other types of sexual assault.

My opinion is that it doesn't matter. A person has the right to be in love with whoever they want, regardless of sex.

[Brewmaster]

I think it is a choice.Probably affected by where you live and the surroundings.Or some life experience.I don't think you can really be born with it.

[Overlord Darth Fluffles]

I honestly hear both ends of the coin. I mostly hear people go on about it's totally biological/genetic. There are others who say what we like is our opinion. For me, I feel as if it's choice. As Eris said, it's doubtful someone will sit down and think or just wake up one morning and go "YA KNOW WHAT, I like boys/girls".

Even though I have a gay friend who said "I did both, I just liked the guys more. They fancied my intrest." I'm not sure if that's totally biological (I know like...diddly crap about science). SO hey, I say it's probably a mix of both, but that's just me.

[[BlackDeath]]

They are not born with it, it is something discovered as you mature and become more sexually experienced. You then start to know your preferences and make a choice on your own sexuality eventually.

[ShinigamiPrince]

I see it as a choice. There might be the slightest chance of it having some biological background of some sort, but I think it's a choice that people make.
Not everyone grows up the same way and obviously some people might end up taking a liking to the same gender.
It just depends on the circumstances.

[LittleGirl]

I honestly don't know, and it doesn't really matter to me either. But, I don't think it's a choice. People don't choose to be attracted to certain people. Although, I'm not sure you're just born with it...maybe it's just a preference you develop at a young age...

[rikumi]

Absolutely by choice. Influences from surroundings, by exact. There are too many homosexuals around my place and I often mix around with them. Thus, I know this even though I can't really communicate with them well.

[dream magician]

Hmm,it's the environment that affects the individual, especially when they were still at a young age of exposure, sure it can affect there sexuality or as we say gender, but as we grow older, we acquire that knowledge to be or to be something else, i think it's a choice.

[suzumi]

Freud would probably say you're attracted to people who resemble your parents, but he is on the other hand quite full of crap, and obviously had issues with his parents.

Indeed.

A friend of mine (who is gay) says that he believes that gay people are born that way. That if they really had a choice, then people would chose to be straight. Considering the fact that it is way easier to live that way.

I agree with him.

[starchaser]

Well there is a possibility of a genetic basis to it. There's something called CGN called something Gender non-conformity that you may experience as a child, and if you do there's, if I recall rightly, a 75% that you will be gay or bisexual. Whether there is a genetic basis to CGN is something else being researched.

A lot of people I know have known their whole life. My housemate Jason says he knew he was different from as early as he can remember and a few people's parents have said they knew from the get-go. I think when you reach sexual maturity there is an awakening of sorts or perhaps realisation is a better word, though some people don't realise till they're pretty old.

My bio teacher was married with 2 kids very happily then met another male teacher and the two fell in love. It's so cute if a bit devastating on his ex wife, but they seem to be all happy now.

[3pleT]

i believe homosexuality, just like any other paraphilia, is merely a state of mind developed early in life. and given that the vast majority of humans have some kind of paraphilia, i don't think banning gay marriage makes any god damn sense. and if they try to justify it with some they-are-unable-to-procreate kind of nonsense, why the hell don't they ban the marriage between the sterile men and women? just a bunch of close minded religious idiots.

btw, i'm not gay, just opposing homophobia.

[starchaser]

just a bunch of close minded religious idiots.

I was about to say 'Amen to that' but I just realised the irony.


But yeah, agreement. :)

[lady_jesika]

i believe that its a choice. all that bull about peopel being born gay is just leading scientists for find a "cure" for homosexuality. they dont need to be cured, they just need to be excepted

[starchaser]

i believe that its a choice. all that bull about peopel being born gay is just leading scientists for find a "cure" for homosexuality. they dont need to be cured, they just need to be excepted

Erm, right. Perhaps the religious nutjobs.
But no right minded scientist is going to go 'ahey cure the gays'. There's much better science to be focusing on.
Scientists, like myself, like to understand things and research them. It's our job anyway.

[doomboy536]

Well everyone is a little bit gay really, some people just more so than others. I won't deny that gay people make me uncomfortable, but at the same time I'm happy to live and let live.

[drm0ney]

I hope National Geographics is a good enough source for you all.
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/07/0722_040722_gayanimal.html
This artical talks about animals, both captive and wild, behaving in homosexual ways. At the end of it (there's two pages) it talks about people.

As for my point of view, I've seen enough gay people in my life to know they honestly like the same sex as them. Why would some one choose to have their family, and sometimes friends hate them and not talk to them, if all they had to do was like the other sex?

[DOOM!]

Articles of scientific researches haven't proven anything concrete yet.
I believe it's a slow developing Choice. The choice development speed and age differ from person to person and their psyche. Most factors that cause and enforce this choice are: how they were treated by family members, how many times they got beat up by the opposite gender, if they ever got layed, if they did enjoy/overthrew heterosexual intercourse, how they perceived homosexuality before they converted, and many.
Why, if the homosexuality concept were never popular, people would be less likely to become homosexuals. I don't know why i've been bashed so harshly by all members, the last time i tried to say it's a choice and not a genetical thing.

[SigmaSD]

Well everyone is a little bit gay really, some people just more so than others. I won't deny that gay people make me uncomfortable, but at the same time I'm happy to live and let live.

This is exactly true. Almost everybody is a bit gay. There was a scientist named Kinsey that wrote two books, one on the sexuality of males, and the other on the sexuality of females (the female book actually got him fired cause the world wasn't ready for it). He conducted a survey, and interviewed people privately on their sexuality. Anyway, his studies found that only 10% of the population was totally straight, another 10% was totally gay, and the other 80% of the people were somewhere in between.

[Diocletian]

Well everyone is a little bit gay really, some people just more so than others. I won't deny that gay people make me uncomfortable, but at the same time I'm happy to live and let live.

If Lou Dobbs did not exist that would be not be true.
They do make me uncomfortable and I do find it weird, but I don't think bad of them. No reason to kill them and hate them. Flaming people do need to be beaten though.

[Wio]

Every human being can choose with whom they have consensual sex. What makes one a homosexual if they do not have sex with those of the same gender?


If I desire to have sex with many women or men, regardless of whether I do or not, does that make me a slut? Would I be living a lie by living a monogamous lifestyle where I only engage in sex with my wife?

Not approving of homosexual behaviour is similar to not approving to promiscuous behaviour in that both stem from certain values of sex.

[Variados]

Both.. some are, and some are made.. it just happens..

[Ridana]

The whole "choice/not choice" is an oversimplified argument. Even the spectrum analysis is artificially limiting.

I remember when I was very very young (like 1st, 2nd, or 3rd grade young), back when MTV was still very new. I was flipping through the channels and saw the "Material Girl" video by Madonna. I don't think the term "sexual" attraction would be appropriate to describe what I felt, I had no concept of sexuality, but I definitely felt a strong desire to continue looking at her.

I did not "choose" that moment to abandon the "cooties mentality" of the opposite sex. I also did not "choose" to base my concept of beauty on Madonna ( a. I do not prefer blondes, b. I have not constrained my concept of beauty to caucasian women, however c. I do find sleeve-length gloves a sexy accessory for women to wear with evening gowns).

Now one could argue that my sexuality was not set in stone at that point. That what I NOW, under this set of circumstances, view as the first appearance of my heterosexuality could have, under a slight variance of circumstances, been what I viewed as the first appearance of my desire to wear pink satin evening gowns with white sleeve-length gloves.

It is easy to view sexuality as a spectrum, as we do politics, with it's simplistic left, center, right vocabulary and replace those terms with straight, bi-, and gay. It is of course even easier to view the debate in terms of a dichotomy like choice vs. not choice. But what if sexuality could only be honestly diagrammed as a multilayered multibranched 4 dimensional tree of 3 axis graphs with an overabundance of outlying data points, because that would be the only system that could accurately portray the variance of human sexual expression including asexuals, heterosexuals, bisexuals, homosexuals, ex-heterosexuals, ex-homosexuals, ex-ex-homosexuals, heterosexuals with fetishes for high heels, homosexual men that wear high heels, bisexual masochists, heterosexual men with oedipal issues, homosexual women with oedipal issues, homophobic heterosexual men that like the backdoor, guys into silicone and guys that like all-natural ladies, leather fetishists, swingers, polygamists, wife-swappers, swinging polygamist wife-swapping leather fetishists, tops, bottoms, switches, lipstick lesbians switches with jungle fever and rape fantasies, voyeurs, exhibitionists, and husbands that like to watch, furries, trannies, grannies, and furry tranny grannies, and those into the good old fashioned art of self-love.

This is why I stay out of other people's bedrooms unless I'm invited. I have lived a life that has allowed people to trust me enough that I now know that abnormal is the norm. I've learned that those who look the most "normal" are usually just putting forth the most effort to hide the fact that they are the biggest freaks of all.

You don't need to deny it, you know what your freak is.

It's okay to be a freak, it means you are different, just like everyone else.

Don't be jealous of those who are comfortable with who they are, try to become more comfortable with yourself.

The people you are hiding from are probably bigger freaks than you are.

Sexual freedom and self-acceptance tends to lead to higher levels of general happiness. Sexual repression and self-loathing tends to lead to some serious aggressive tendencies. Our country and the world has plenty of examples supporting these concepts.

Here's to happier days to come.

[Bulf]

I think some people were suppposed to be girls, but they got made into boys at birth. =o Although, some probably just do it as a trend or something.

[Sanosuke23]

I don't know if you're "born gay," but at the same time I don't think it's a conscious decision. It, like many other aspects of personality, is developed as time goes on whether you like it or not.

Of course, technically you probably also have to believe that it's black and white, hetero- or homo- to think about it as either a choice or being born with it, which it isn't. There's different levels of preference everywhere in between and then some.

[suzumi]

I think some people were suppposed to be girls, but they got made into boys at birth.

Those people are called "transsexuals", and they are not gay.

[MissAstaire]

The movie Kinsey scarred me.

I think it is a choice. I don't believe it's something one is born with. I don't know, it just seems a little iffy to say "I was born 'gay' and there's nothing that can change it." I, like many others here, have a friend who is a lesbian. Nevermind that I haven't talked to her in nearly a year, but she is a really cool person. She was straight before Tori, but the guys she chose in her life turned out to be such crap people that wronged and hurt her that she felt (I'm assuming) that it would just be easier and cause her less heartache or something to become a lesbian. Now do I believe she is actually a lesbian? No. Why? Because of how she acted when she wasn't around Tori when she was actually ALLOWED to talk to me. She acted like the most hormone-crazed 18 year old girl I have ever known when a cute guy walked past. Some would say she was Bisexual. I don't believe that either. When she's with Tori, she isn't happy. You can see it on her face and the way she talks and moves even. Tori is a very controlling person, but she, my friend, won't leave her because Tori is what she knows. Which sucks.

No, I don't believe you are born gay/lesbian/straight. I believe it is a choice. But everyone is entitled totheir own choice, even if I don't agree with it.

[starchaser]

This is exactly true. Almost everybody is a bit gay. There was a scientist named Kinsey that wrote two books, one on the sexuality of males, and the other on the sexuality of females (the female book actually got him fired cause the world wasn't ready for it). He conducted a survey, and interviewed people privately on their sexuality. Anyway, his studies found that only 10% of the population was totally straight, another 10% was totally gay, and the other 80% of the people were somewhere in between.

Oh Sigma you totally beat me to it.

They are both really interesting books if you ever get a chance to read them. The film is a good introduciton to him and has Liam Neeson in it, whoo. But he had a scale of sexuality between 1 (definitely straight) and 6 (definitely gay). Most people fit are 2-5.

[Jose]

She was straight before Tori, but the guys she chose in her life turned out to be such crap people that wronged and hurt her that she felt (I'm assuming) that it would just be easier and cause her less heartache or something to become a lesbian. Now do I believe she is actually a lesbian? No. Why? Because of how she acted when she wasn't around Tori when she was actually ALLOWED to talk to me. She acted like the most hormone-crazed 18 year old girl I have ever known when a cute guy walked past. Some would say she was Bisexual. I don't believe that either. When she's with Tori, she isn't happy. You can see it on her face and the way she talks and moves even. Tori is a very controlling person, but she, my friend, won't leave her because Tori is what she knows. Which sucks.


Eh, she could of been closeted the entire time and she decided to come out of the closet when she had someone she could have a relationship with. Erised, just because someone isn't a flaming homosexual doesn't mean that they aren't gay at all, most of the gay people are able to control themselves and aren't the stereotypical gay at all.You are right just because your friend dated one girl that doesn't make her lesbian at all, she could of just curious.


You said yourself she was a very controlling person, that might of been the cause of the her unhappiness, it could of had nothing to do with her girlfriend's gender.(that sounds weird)