What would exist if nothing existed? [Archive]

Eris

12-31-2007, 07:03 PM

Something has to exist, right...?

No. It doesn't. What you're describing sounds like the universe before the big bang. The big bang was the creation of space-time (matter is a by-product of that), so before the big bang, there was no space-time. Not just no planets, there was no universe for the planets to be in; and no time for the planets to not exist in.

You can imagine this by gradually removing spacial dimensions. Start with a room, three spacial dimensions and time, move in all directions while you can, walk in circles--jump, move your arms. Then you imagine one dimension collapsing; the world is now two dimensional. You can not move up or down (indeed, nothing exists there), just sideways. Like a drawing on a paper. Then another dimension collapses, and you're one dimensional. You can now only move along one line. But you're fine, since there still is that dimension, you can imagine it as a really long and narrow tube, so you can't walk sideways or turn around in, only backwards and forwards. Then, that dimension collapses as well, you're now zero-dimensional. You can not move at all. There is not nothing all around you, because there is no all around you. But heh, there is still time. So, you sit in your point in space and wait, until time collapses. And hey presto, space and time does not exist. Now ponder on that for a moment. You are in nothingness. Not emptiness, nothingness. The universe itself does not exist (also, feel free to ponder whether it ever did?)

Magisha

12-31-2007, 07:05 PM

Eh? *tilts head to the side*

If nothing existed, how can anything exist. If there was no oxygen, no living things can exist. . . Basically, if nothing, as in not a speck of dirt or any air, that techinically means, "nothing," will exist. . . O____o

If there is nothing that exists, there will be nothing that has to exist. . . O______o

Ugh, now I'm confusing myself.

demon_girl_

12-31-2007, 07:27 PM

hmm, if nothing exsited, then wouldn't there just be darkness at each corner you run to?i think it's kind of like being in a silent black hole, nowhere to go, just stuck there in a never ending blackness.but i do agree with what Eris had to say, that makes since to, but i do myself see things a bit diffrently from the others, more of a active imagination, like it could turn into alice in wonderland and all of a sudden you see cheshire cat's teeth come out of hiding in the dark, so yeah i guess there is something even if there is nothing in the first place.sorry if that really doesn't click, im speaking in my terms,lol.

haku_of_mist

12-31-2007, 07:32 PM

Paradoxical. Not to mention a pointless question.
Literally "nothing" would exist.

I agree. There's really no answer to this.

Knuffle Bunny

12-31-2007, 07:36 PM

No. It doesn't. What you're describing sounds like the universe before the big bang. The big bang was the creation of space-time (matter is a by-product of that), so before the big bang, there was no space-time. Not just no planets, there was no universe for the planets to be in; and no time for the planets to not exist in.

If you believe in Christianity , God created [I]something from nothing. He just said a few words. =3

If we look at it scientifically though, it contradicts the idea. Science claims nothing can be made without something.
"Matter from nothing? Preposterous." x3 So in fact, scientists believe that there had to be something that triggered the Big Bang.
So, actually, no Eris, according to science, there had to be something.

According to Christianity: If there truly was "nothing" then there would be no God. Because God is something, something "uncomprehendable", but still something. And without God, there would be nothing, because God created something from nothing.

According to science: There couldn't have been "nothing" if something is created from it.

So the two contradict eachother, guess it depends on what you believe in.

@Haku of Mist - See? There is an answer! =3

the_last_icarian

12-31-2007, 07:36 PM

Eh? *tilts head to the side*

If nothing existed, how can anything exist. If there were no oxygen, no living things can exist. . . Basically, if nothing, as in not a speck of dirt or any air, that basically means, "nothing," will exist. . . O____o

If there is nothing that exists, there will be nothing that has to exist. . . O______o

Ugh, now I'm confusing myself.

Hehe, me too. Maybe we should just be glad that something exists! I mean, we're here, aren't we?

Hideki Motosuwa.

12-31-2007, 07:42 PM

Aaaahhh! That makes my brain hurt! To me, the question is: What color would nothingness be? When you close your eyes, you see a blend of colors in the black... but if nothing was there, would the color be black? I mean if there is nothingness, then we can't see any color, but there is no such thing as no color because there is always a color?

overwatch

12-31-2007, 07:48 PM

You ask me what would exist if there was a situation where nothing existed - so I reply that there would be nothing at all - because that is the status.
The pre-big bang and God have nothing to do with this because you have already stated that in the world setting there is nothing - no colour, no dimensions - even time - now that boggles the mind to consider.
However, many here are taking the line that you mean before the big bang and to that I reply with the line "its all theory today; tomorrow it will be wrong and in a 100 years it will be laughable" such is the way science of what we only scrape at understanding goes

edit - you say there must be something - why must there be anything? Justify that line to me please as the only answer I can think of is linked to Gods - and in nothing there are no gods/god

Elphaba

12-31-2007, 08:16 PM

yeah something has to exist
but i just don't know what
so confused

sa5m

12-31-2007, 08:17 PM

If nothing existed, then we would not be here contemplating whether or not anything existed. : D

Shia_san

12-31-2007, 08:24 PM

okay, is anyone, other than me, confused here?
>tilts head to one side< nothing exists...so isn't nothing something????:confused: idk...don't ask me.

overwatch

12-31-2007, 08:27 PM

nope - nothing is nothing - not a single thing at all - not black, not dark, not time, not space, not an atom, not god
nothing - easy to write down - but not something the human mind can truly imagine

Masali

12-31-2007, 09:05 PM

If you believe in Christianity [I know bringing religion was a bad idea, but Eris mentioned Big Bang so, I just felt the urge], God created something from nothing. He just said a few words. =3

It's funny you used christianity and Eris in the same sentence without any negative connotation surrounding "Christianity".

Anywho, there's nothingness around you, And you can represent that anyway you want. Personally, if I was surrounded by the darkness of space I'd represent it as black. If I was surrounded by nothingness, and not darkness it'd be a dull gray to me. But it is difficult to fathom, maybe impossible. But it's fun to try!

Future_Defense

12-31-2007, 09:47 PM

The problem is, if nothing exists than nothing exists. The human mind cannot comprehend nothingness, so this question is kind of void.

PanzerJager

12-31-2007, 10:08 PM

If we look at it scientifically though, it contradicts the idea. Science claims nothing can be made without something.

There was something that caused the Big Bang, but science has not been able to say what it was.. As for people who just dismiss the Big Bang as a theory, I say that gravity is just a theory too..

According to Christianity: If there truly was "nothing" then there would be no God. Because God is something, something "uncomprehendable", but still something. And without God, there would be nothing, because God created something from nothing.

All religions are just products of man's attempts to understand why things happen, but have never actually been accepted as proof of anything by anyone who is (or was) intelligent..

If this offends any of you indoctrinated people, please forgive my heretical ramblings.. XD

Eris

01-01-2008, 06:07 AM

If we look at it scientifically though, it contradicts the idea. Science claims nothing can be made without something.

Science does not claim something can be made without something. You're making the fundamental error of thinking that time is linear, and existed before the big bang. Creation of matter requires time; if there is no time, nothing can be added or removed. But in all time, the universe has always existed. What we're discussing is the events before time, so to speak.

"Matter from nothing? Preposterous." x3 So in fact, scientists believe that there had to be something that triggered the Big Bang.

That is an intuitive argument that does not follow from the basic principles of science. Many things in science are intuitively preposterous, never the less correct. Like the fact that the earth is round.

So, actually, no Eris, according to science, there had to be something.

That is down right wrong.

According to Christianity: If there truly was "nothing" then there would be no God. Because God is something, something "uncomprehendable", but still something. And without God, there would be nothing, because God created something from nothing.

That I cannot comment upon.

According to science: There couldn't have been "nothing" if something is created from it.

That is wrong again.

So the two contradict eachother, guess it depends on what you believe in.

How... do they contradict each other? You seem to be making the same argument for both cases.

Famahama

01-01-2008, 06:15 AM

space perhaps? or hell. or maybe heaven.

Aizmov

01-01-2008, 06:17 AM

I can't imagine nothing not existing

Masali

01-01-2008, 06:51 AM

;1935748']space perhaps? or hell. or maybe heaven.

Space is something. Hell and Heaven are kind of...ideas. I GUESS ideas are considered something.

TheAsterisk!

01-01-2008, 02:18 PM

Nihilism would have a whole new meaning! (Waits for laugh, smiling)
...Nothing? Ok...
People aren't really capable of contemplating true nothingness; many here have been thinking of emptiness or absence of material/matter instead. We can't think of nothingness easily because no human experience truly relates to it.
I guess if there were nothing, the universe would not exist as it is defined. I suppose a point (as in geometry) would be the closest concept I can compare to nothingness.

MasterLuna

01-01-2008, 10:29 PM

Nothing would exist. Basically you almost answered your own question, just missing a few words. NOTHING WOULD EXIST. If nothing would exist, it doesn't mean SOMETHING would exist, it would mean NOTHING would exist.

International 4-8818

01-01-2008, 10:36 PM

asking of there is nothing then there is nothing. Like saying there is no apple in front of me. Is there an apple?

Zenx

01-01-2008, 10:58 PM

prototypetetra

01-01-2008, 11:00 PM

There will always be something that exists, Alarix; Even in an immaterial point of view, emptiness or in this case "nothingness" is an existence by itself. Thus, "Nothing" is not the right answer, in my opinion. There is no correct answer for this question, I believe it is so because the question is faulty.

jtj

01-01-2008, 11:30 PM

well nothing would exist, but we would not know that nothing existed because we would not be there because we don't exist. :P

Sanosuke23

01-01-2008, 11:31 PM

It's funny you used christianity and Eris in the same sentence without any negative connotation surrounding "Christianity".

There were brackets involved.

----------------------------

I can't believe this is a question. There is no known point of "Nothingness," and so it is quite impossible to even truly fathom it.

Akihiko Yamamoto Hozagaki

01-01-2008, 11:33 PM

Ugh... this thread confuses me utterly. It's like how I'll choose the oddest times to dwell on why I'm alive >_<. It also reminds me when I was like... nine and wondering what the "Nothingness" was in "The Neverending Story". Oh god, those were confusing times XD!

Fetal Fetish

01-01-2008, 11:41 PM

This is basically a pointless question. The question answers itself. "If nothing existed." Nothing exists. Time, space, all of it is gone.

TheAsterisk!

01-02-2008, 06:57 AM

Does anything exist? I mean, is it not possible, nay, likely that our entire existance is just a complete lie, a simulation, a dream? Have you ever stopped and thought "Am I really awake right now?"... I have, and I believe that my entire being counld not exist at all. I mean... can any thing really "exist" because in another reality, nothing you know may have ever have been real. Does this post exist? Does this fourm exist? Does the Internet exist? I mean, you can't TOUCH the internet, can you? So in that matter, does everything we are doing "exist"? I say nay! The whole theory of existance is ridiculous.

End lecture that really proved nothing at all.

Bertrand Russell (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bertrand_Russell) once said that sometimes one wishes that [armchair] philosophers who question reality would get into a car and drive into a wall at a speed proportional to their disbelief in the existence of said wall.
I do believe I share his sentiments concerning this particular matter.
Since percieved reality is the only way we can view our surroundings, why bother to ask if it's accurate? It's all we can know.

Eris

01-02-2008, 07:31 AM

Since percieved reality is the only way we can view our surroundings, why bother to ask if it's accurate? It's all we can know.

There is a very important reason for doing it: Logic. Logic requires true premises. If a premise is false, any conclusion can be drawn from it. If all arguments and premises are sound, logic is never wrong. That is a tremendously powerful tool, so it's only logical (pun sort of intended) that we must scrutinize our premises.

Though, this must take constructive forms. Simply professing "the world doesn't exist!" does not add anything.

Clawdia

01-02-2008, 07:33 AM

Cheese.

Cheese always exists.

gaburieru

01-02-2008, 07:41 AM

It's called vacuum.

Eris

01-02-2008, 08:02 AM

It's called vacuum.

Not really. Vacuum is still something. It has spacial dimensions, etc. It's possible for less to exist than vacuum; therefore it is not nothing.

Knuffle Bunny

01-02-2008, 09:34 AM

Let me rephrase myself then. = 3=

According to religion God has always been there, so therefore there has always been something. And there cannot be nothing becasue God is always there.

As for the Big Bang, it's only a theory. There could have been something before, there could have not.

omniking3

01-02-2008, 09:42 AM

"Existence" is a human perception. If there was nothing, there would be nothing for us to percieve, and vice versa. This is just feedback loop, there is no logical solution. I've tried p => q logic also.

Knuffle Bunny

01-02-2008, 09:54 AM

This is just feedback loop, there is no logical solution. I've tried p => q logic also.

Human logic is extremely flexible. It's like how people solve math problems differently. Based on what you already know, and what you already believe in, your logic can be affected substantially.

If you were christian, you'd say that there could never truly be "nothing" because God is always there, and therefore, definately not a feedback loop.

"Existence" is a human perception. If there was nothing, there would be nothing for us to percieve, and vice versa.

Think about it this way. Let's say the human race didn't exist. We couldn't percieve anything because we don't exist, but that doesn't mean that nothing else exists

~RiOtFoRpHoEnIx~

01-02-2008, 10:06 AM

*Tilts head* Is it me or is this going to be one of those threads that just keeps going around and around in circles? Plus, I'm definitely confused here seeing as how can someone try and comprehend nothing existing, because my mind just keeps coming to the answer that if nothing existed, would we even exist and if that is the case, then how can we try and gather an answer to what exists then... bleh ... I made no sense at all then I think. In other words, if nothing exists .. would we even exist? and if not ... how in the heck should I know what exists when I don't.

Eris

01-02-2008, 12:34 PM

As for the Big Bang, it's only a theory. There could have been something before, there could have not.

But theory in science does not mean the same as theory in colloquial English. In science, a theory is a model explaining experimental data. In colloquial English, a theory is a hunch. The colloquial meaning can not be applied to scientific theories.

luvtoshikun

01-02-2008, 12:44 PM

if there isn't anything then this conversation wouldn't happen and we would't exist so we wouldn't know what it would be like. If it was possible I think it would be unbarrible...confuzled

Zenx

01-02-2008, 12:49 PM

Cheese.

Cheese always exists.

Is there proof cheese EVER existed? Can you prove it does? I realize that I can't prove that it doesn't, but their is always doubt that our reality is non-existant.

In a non-existant world where things exist only because the existing things that want the non-existant world to exsit, which may be ours, if a non-existing person where to drive his or her non-existing car into a non-existing wall, it would result in a non-existing crash. This would never prove what exists or not in a world where nothing exists. It like a dream. Just because something dies in a dream, doesn't mean that it actually died. But that disproves itself in the sence that if you created a world in your dreams, the dream person, who does not exist, would die <_<.

Sanosuke23

01-02-2008, 06:53 PM

genericusername2

01-02-2008, 08:54 PM

Idiots like yourself.

TheAsterisk!

01-03-2008, 09:04 AM

Idiots like yourself.
Says the user with Sgurd Ekoms as a name.
Your new username would be "Gnihton" if there were nothing, right? Or would it be "Gnihton Ekoms?" Or maybe "Lawardhtiw" seeing as there'd be nothing to "ekoms."

onigiri princess

01-03-2008, 10:25 AM

dust xD tiny specs of dust in dark dark space, but i guess nothing would exist without the sun ^-^' (i gonna get nightmares after this)

Vendetta

01-03-2008, 11:30 AM

Ah, this reminds me of a long debate on the bus :P

Nothing is abstract, therefor nothing doesn't exist. Even in space there are microparticals which create something. Theoretically <b>if</b> nothing existed we would have a neverending vacuum or something similar to space prior to the big bang. There has been no place found in which 'nothing' exists.

Knuffle Bunny

01-03-2008, 12:22 PM

But theory in science does not mean the same as theory in colloquial English. In science, a theory is a model explaining experimental data. In colloquial English, a theory is a hunch. The colloquial meaning can not be applied to scientific theories.

In science, a theory is an idea that has no proof. Some evidence to suggest it, but no solid proof.

TheAsterisk!

01-03-2008, 12:49 PM

In science, a theory is an idea that has no proof. Some evidence to suggest it, but no solid proof.

...No...those are hypotheses, possible, untested explanations.
A scientific theory is a model used to explain the natural world based off of observations and deductions. A hypothesis doesn't become a theory unless it's well supported and fits the natural world and new observations of it.

Eris

01-03-2008, 01:10 PM

In science, a theory is an idea that has no proof. Some evidence to suggest it, but no solid proof.

No, what you are describing is a conjecture or possibly a hypothesis.

I sincerely urge you to do some fact checking (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory#Science) before you start pushing your misunderstandings as truth.

PanzerJager

01-03-2008, 01:21 PM

In science, a theory is an idea that has no proof. Some evidence to suggest it, but no solid proof.

I would be willing to bet that you believe the theory of gravity.. despite what you may believe this almost universally accepted theory falls in the same category as evolution and the big bang; Despite whatever your local reverend may say..

I sincerely urge you to do some fact checking (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory#Science) before you start pushing your misunderstandings as truth.

And everyone else as well..

Finvarra

01-03-2008, 08:21 PM

If you think about it there is no such thing as nothing.
When you think of nothing you either think of white space or eternal darkness.
Well arn't those something?

Leorina

01-03-2008, 09:47 PM

If you think about it there is no such thing as nothing.
When you think of nothing you either think of white space or eternal darkness.
Well arn't those something?

We do not know the 'true' definition of "nothing" because if we didn't exist, then we would have no conciousness, thus we would not be able to define "nothing" or see "nothing." We imagine non-existence and unconciousness, but we cannot experience "nothing" in the way the topic has asked.

My conclusion: There is such as "nothing": humanity has yet to witness and define "nothing." We may never be able to.

AngelxWithin

01-04-2008, 08:32 AM

What?!?

No Pizza?!?

No Food?!?

Whats The Point Of Existing Without Them?!?

Meyrin

01-04-2008, 08:41 AM

Now before you reply with "nothing... duh" (like what the last person I asked said to me), think about it.

Imagine if nothing existed. No darkness. No space. No emptyness. No pizza.

Something has to exist, right...?

Your question dosent make sence. How can something exist if nothing exist. The only logic answer is nothing.

Knuffle Bunny

01-04-2008, 08:47 AM

I would be willing to bet that you believe the theory of gravity.. despite what you may believe this almost universally accepted theory falls in the same category as evolution and the big bang; Despite whatever your local reverend may say..

I'm not Roman Catholic. Agnostic.

If they had proof of the Big Bang, the church would be out the window by now.

The Theory of Gravity is in question. It doesn't matter if it's universally accepted, that's just belief, and science doesn't revolve around belief. It revolves around fact.

For instance, many textbooks claim that the moon revolves around the Earth. This is universally accepted, is it not?
However, if the Theory of Gravity were true, it would show that the sun's gravitational force on the moon is more powerful than the Earth's gravitational force on the moon, and therefore, the moon should be revolving around the sun, not the Earth.
[see here for more details (http://www.bringyou.to/apologetics/p67.htm)]

But, we have examined the moon very closely and it indeed revolves around the Earth. The theory of Gravity has holes, because it has not been entirely proven.

The Wing Man

01-04-2008, 08:52 AM

I don't know, god or something like that.

Sword

01-04-2008, 02:21 PM

I don't know, god or something like that.
If god even exists, it isnt relevant here. Because God is not of the phsical plain that we can interact with. If nothing existed it would be complete darkness. Because darkness isn't a "thing" per say, but it is the absence of light.

zorarock

01-04-2008, 02:26 PM

Nothing wouln't even exist

TheAsterisk!

01-04-2008, 02:43 PM

I'm not Roman Catholic. Agnostic.

If they had proof of the Big Bang, the church would be out the window by now.

The Theory of Gravity is in question. It doesn't matter if it's universally accepted, that's just belief, and science doesn't revolve around belief. It revolves around fact.

For instance, many textbooks claim that the moon revolves around the Earth. This is universally accepted, is it not?
However, if the Theory of Gravity were true, it would show that the sun's gravitational force on the moon is more powerful than the Earth's gravitational force on the moon, and therefore, the moon should be revolving around the sun, not the Earth.
[see here for more details (http://www.bringyou.to/apologetics/p67.htm)]

But, we have examined the moon very closely and it indeed revolves around the Earth. The theory of Gravity has holes, because it has not been entirely proven.

There's a simple reason that the sun doesn't rip the moon away from the Earth. The gravitational force is directly related to the masses of the two (or more, but we'll keep it simpler for now) objects in question, yes, but the force is also inversely proprtional to the distance (the distance squared actually, if I remember right [EDIT: I did.]) between the two objects. So even though the sun has a much greater mass, than the Earth, the moon orbits the Earth because it is much nearer.

I will add the equation as soon as I find it - my physics book is in the other room right now.
[EDIT] Here's the simpler equation to describe approximately circular orbits. It's pretty much the same as Newton's equation for any circular motion, but incorporating the objects' masses and seperation distance (as the theory of gravity dictates).
{F = ((G)(M)(m)(v^2))/(R^2)} where F = gravitational force, G = the universal gravitational constant (=6.673x10^(-11)), M and m = the objects' respective masses, v^2 represents the velocity squared, and R^2 is the objects' seperation distance squared.

The only was you could ever say the theory of gravity isn't accurate is if you were using some of the older, simpler equations (like the one I used above) to try to predict some of the more eccentric orbits. The theory of gravity, as it is, is sound.
Try again.
[EDIT] Reading up a bit, I didn't find "the Theory of Gravity" but, rather, the "Law of Universal Gravitation," implying that one might not have to defend the definition of a scientific theory to defend gravity. A law is something that, over time, observed to be true. The only deduction(s) would be mathematical.

As for the TOPIC of the thread, we would not see anything, not even darkness. The universe would either be zero dimensional (like a geometric point) or simply cease to exist. Our sensory organs (and brains processing the signals/nerve impulses from them) would not be able to cope with such a radical change in environment, not to mention we'd be long dead seeing as we're three dimensional (four, if you consider time) creatures. We can contemplate nothing, but we can't really observe or experience it (as Leorina said, though it can be defined abstractly).
God (as in any deity) would also not exist, regardless of it's state now. If God is there now, then it will not be in "nothing," as it is something. If God is a social doctrine, then it will not exist as the societies may not exist. If it is a thought in one's mind, then God will be gone as one may not think absent the necessary tissues and organs, which are invariably composed of matter, and so won't exist. This is not to (any) challenge religion; it is merely what the abstract concept of nothing implies would be (or wouldn't).
(The only way any god/deity would still exist were if that god were actually defined as the state of existence itself. I don't know of any religion with such a definition for any deity, but that doesn't mean there isn't such a belief system. If there is, would someone be kind enough to let me know what it is called? I'd really appreciate it...)

Eris

01-04-2008, 02:47 PM

For instance, many textbooks claim that the moon revolves around the Earth. This is universally accepted, is it not?
However, if the Theory of Gravity were true, it would show that the sun's gravitational force on the moon is more powerful than the Earth's gravitational force on the moon, and therefore, the moon should be revolving around the sun, not the Earth.
[see here for more details (http://www.bringyou.to/apologetics/p67.htm)]

What the heck? That link you posted is a parody. It mocks people, just like you, who use the "only a theory"-argument. If you carefully examine the background image, you will see it says "Parody! Hoax! Lies!"

PanzerJager

01-04-2008, 03:00 PM

What the heck? That link you posted is a parody. It mocks people, just like you, who use the "only a theory"-argument. If you carefully examine the background image, you will see it says "Parody! Hoax! Lies!"

I didn't even look at the link..

I would comment more on this, but it looks as if Eris and TheAsterisk! have this covered..

Leorina

01-04-2008, 03:08 PM

[see here for more details (http://www.bringyou.to/apologetics/p67.htm)]

I'm surprised you took this as truth. I've never heard about Einstein's Theory of LOL.

TheAsterisk!

01-04-2008, 03:28 PM

What the heck? That link you posted is a parody. It mocks people, just like you, who use the "only a theory"-argument. If you carefully examine the background image, you will see it says "Parody! Hoax! Lies!"
I didn't even look at the link to begin with, but I must say it was quite amusing. Whoever wrote that did a pretty good job mocking "arguments" in favor of Intelligent Design, creation-science, and the like.
I just jumped at akari_aurion based on stuff I knew (mostly) off the top of my head, since I was so annoyed somebody could say something so silly.
I'd like to add that, if, as akari_aurion believes, the sun has more pull on near-earth bodies, jumping off a cliff should cause one to fall towards the sun and not back towards Earth. See, even if one were silly enough (even at 13 years old) to believe that site to be serious and then credible, the idea could be rendered ridiculous with a 'thought experiment.'

myahon

01-05-2008, 05:58 PM

an unending vaccuum, just like the places of space that have yet to be filled with matter.

Unless no laws of physics and time existed at which point someone could create themself and then create laws of physics afterwards.

sataned

01-06-2008, 09:14 PM

ok i dont get it...
if by nothing you mean everything we see and are used to on earth and around earth and in the milky way galaxy then yes there would be tons more planets and giant rocks and giant balls of ice flying around space...

if you do mean absolutely nothing anywhere no universe ..then wtf.. your basically asking wot if
an orange was an apple but that apple was really an orange... theres your answer the orange is an orange(if theres nothing than theres nothing)... so if nothing existed, of course nothing exists nothing is there...
i think... but then HowTF did our galaxy get here? how did we get here? OH DANG!! then IM WROng if nothing exists something has to exist to make something nothing!? or maybe if there was nothing something might exist without anything or anyone knowing thus making basically non existant since no one is acknowledging it... but then that means if theres nothing theres something ....
wot?
AHHHHH BRAIN CAVING IN!!!

ChibiNaruto

01-07-2008, 03:00 AM

Now before you reply with "nothing... duh" (like what the last person I asked said to me), think about it.

Imagine if nothing existed. No darkness. No space. No emptyness. No pizza.

Something has to exist, right...?

I would imagine that "nothing" would be the only exisisting factor. So that's the only thing that exists which is nothing..

alarix

01-08-2008, 10:04 PM

What?!?

No Pizza?!?

No Food?!?

Whats The Point Of Existing Without Them?!?

Exactly!

And for those who simply claim: "The human mind cannot fully fathom nothingness so the answer is literally nothing"... well space goes on for infinity and we know it's true but the human mind cannot understand infinity either.

Like numbers. See?

Zenx

01-08-2008, 10:20 PM

Zenx is on drugs. I mean that in the nicest way possible.

If we are dreaming, then the dream exists as long as we believe in it. Once we disbelieve it(DC 22) we know we're dreaming. However, the dream is still going, and those still dreaming will think you're insane. Or on drugs. Really, they mean it in the nicest possible way, though.

If anyone in my town actually got to know me, aside from my friends, I would be comitted to an insaine asylum immediatly -_-. My mind think up things like this on the spot, among other strange things <_<. It's fun ^_^.

Caelus

01-09-2008, 11:50 AM

With out luck, stupid questions would still exist.

Gaarademon

01-10-2008, 08:53 AM

the color black!

bug

01-10-2008, 07:30 PM

Well, it's like saying, "Over there is an apple. What is over there(same direction as the apple)". The answer would simply be the apple. If nothing existed, then nothing would exist. In this universe, there is something everywhere, but if nothing existed, no atoms, gods(depending on your religion), planets, galaxies, universes, and the other things that we haven't discovered yet(if there is something there), then nothing would exist. Take a piece of paper. Imagen that it is existence itself. Then throw it out. There we go. Now nothing exists.

aerroW232

01-10-2008, 07:48 PM

If nothing existed it would be a white galaxy, but then again nothing would be white it would be invisable, but how would it be invisable if nothing existed? The simple explanation is that it couldnt be anything because we wouldnt be there to see so right?

╬Karami Mew~Meow

01-10-2008, 07:51 PM

When it's all darkness, then what could possibly exist?! ..well, except for darkness, and black lol

Maledictis Voca

01-11-2008, 09:36 AM

I'd still have to say.. Nothing, dur-duh-dur!!

If nothing existed there cant in any way shape form color place and language be something there unless you're talking about an empty space or a paradox or simply an empty void, but if nothing existed.. Those wouldn't either.

And the people talking about the definition of nothing..

If we never existed and same as everything else, then the word nothing wouldn't exist nor have a definition.

And no offence to any religious beliefs, god isn't proven to really exist. You cant see or touch it either so you cant know it's there. And if nothing is there, the belief of god wouldn't exist either. Fact or fiction wouldn't exist and nor would religion. If nothing existed, the spiritual plain wouldn't exist either. Just looking at the scientific view of it, no offence.

Akira Kogami[LC]

01-19-2008, 07:21 PM

Nothing would exist.

Dananananananana DUH!

alarix

02-15-2008, 08:18 PM

I hear a lot of people said "nothing will exist you dummy" (or think). Well aside from agreeing, allowing me to re-word this question.

Is it possible for nothing to exist?

Now you're going to say "yes, you dummy".

So don't. Be more philosophical, instead of skeptical.

Asriel

02-15-2008, 08:32 PM

A white empty space.................

Of course that couldn't exist either sooooooooooooo

NOTHING OF COURSE!!!!
Dun dun dun!!!!!!!!!!

KP4

02-15-2008, 08:34 PM

Seriously nothing will exist. Everything is made up of atoms. Nothing exist means no atoms. Thus it would be a vacuum with a temperature of 0 Kelvin and no pressure. At least this is according to human understanding.

Flah Blah

02-15-2008, 08:57 PM

The flying spaghetti monster.

Asriel

02-15-2008, 09:00 PM

Seriously nothing will exist. Everything is made up of atoms. Nothing exist means no atoms. Thus it would be a vacuum with a temrature of 0 Kelvin and no pressure. At least this is according to human understanding.

O___O

u ain't speakadin te egelish!

JK
I understood what you just said(lol)

Derrick Remon

02-15-2008, 09:08 PM

If something Happen that possibly mad the world not exist, turn into darkness, etc. I would love my Family as much as I can, until the last Moment, that's all that would be left.

Aizmov

02-15-2008, 09:23 PM

After thinking this through what will exist is:

1) Wozniak making great stuff
2) Jobs having no one to sell them to
3) Gates copying them
4) Ballmer jumping around

Momokachan

02-15-2008, 09:45 PM

I'm sure someone already covered this point, but I'm tired, and it's four pages of basically philosophy to read through, late on a Friday night where I'm more likely to doze off watching tv than say anything profound.

Nothing exists. Spot the missing punctuation in that sentence, and it might make sense.

Basically, since "nothing" is a concept, it is therefore something, and therefore, the concept of "nothing" is actually paradoxical. Therefore, what we experience everyday includes "nothing" existing.

Maybe I'll come back tomorrow when I'm not ready to pass out.

Snababo

02-17-2008, 02:25 PM

This is right up my street. (I LOVE PHYSICS)

Right the definition of nothing states that nothing is the absence of all things i.e. Things we see hear feel taste and smell. So hence nothing is a place without something. But b catagorizing calling nothin nothing does that not make it a something as it has a name. Then there is the idea that "is darkness the absence of light or light the absence of dark" if you can figure that out PM me. What I am trying to say is that by being nothing nothing is in fact something.

Which is more or less what Momokachan said ;)

Rhoswen

02-17-2008, 02:32 PM

Sorry to disappoint some of you, but 'darkness' and 'white space' count as something.
Nothing does not include anything.
So, I guess no existence whatsoever.

Amziefied

02-17-2008, 02:38 PM

Confusing questions wouldnt exist....

Nariko

02-17-2008, 05:45 PM

This is a stupid question.

Nothing will be there to begin with.

allaboutyou3678

02-17-2008, 05:58 PM

***HEAD ASPLODE** All depends on what you believe. I actually believe in nothingness it makes no sense, but that because I exist.

omniking3

02-17-2008, 07:34 PM

ok, listen.

Existence is a product of consciousness. Consider quantum physics. When we observe an electron, its superposition collapses to something we can process in our minds. Now, if we apply that principle to every particle that has a waveform (everything in existence), then we can say that everything we say is only an interpretation of our minds. Take for example, Shroedinger's cats.

He theoretically placed a cat in a box with a deadly posion, which would be released by the decay of a radioactive compound. Now, when the box is closed, we have no idea whether the cat is dead, alive, or in between. The cat is in a superposition, that is to say it exists as more than one entity at the same moment in time. Now, when we open the box, the superposition collapses, and we see whether the cat is dead or not. We can say that, when we are not observing the cat, it is dead, alive, and in between. This sounds hard to believe, but the trick is, that we cannot observe the cat, without collapsing the superposition. These superpositions and waveforms have been proven to exist. This applies to this nothingness as follows:

If there was nothingness, we would simply not be perceiving anything, and everything would exist in a state of superposition. So, nothing, is in fact, everything.

I better get reppies for going through this lecture... -_-

ComposerOfRequiems

02-18-2008, 03:43 AM

███

02-18-2008, 06:30 AM

If nothing existed than the word and definition of existing wouldn't exist, therefore nothing could possibly exist.

alarix

02-22-2008, 08:10 PM

Here's another related question which philosophers have debated on: Is it possible for something to "always" exist?

So did the world always exist or did it go bang and there it is. Then if so it means that it was possible for nothing to exist.

ie If God made the world, then who made God etc.

Tayuya+

02-22-2008, 08:20 PM

I used to think about this all the time. I eventually came to this conclusion...

There would simply be... nothing. If there's nothing, there's no people. If there's no people, there's no consciousness. Therefore.. there's simply nothing.

demonplight

02-22-2008, 08:27 PM

think of this as a limit, with a hole in the line. where as we can tell what is going on until we are very very close, at the point we have no idea, not a clue. that is the math part.
as for the philosophical part their would be no energy, no time, and no matter. in addition to nothing, their would be no concept of nothing. no idea, nor anyone to create the thought of the form something, and the subsequent nothing. so to be honest a universe of nothing cannot exist, because nothing is a concept like 0 where their has to be someone to give the label nothing, to the concept, or lack their of. savy?

also something cannot come from nothing, with our current understanding of the universe.

alarix

02-22-2008, 09:09 PM

demonplight

02-22-2008, 10:24 PM

yes. because so long as you use always as a standard of measurement there is a possibility. because always refers to time in the reference eternal. and time is a product of movement or kinetic energy. so the less matter their is in the universe the less energy there is, so the less movement. as a result time will shift. and begin to slow down in respect to our relation to time. so at any point unless all matter disappears at once, there will be one sub atomic particle. at that moment time will be so skewed that it could survive for indeterminable amount of time. in addition because of this event either in creation, of destruction intelligent life will no longer exist to give the concept time definition. it is difficult for me to explain, but I hope that I did it right. but it is near absolute, to humane reasoning that something cannot come from nothing. so in this if the universe started at a point where all math breaks down, their has to be some thing out there that introduced matter first, and that then introduced energy as a result and time following. this event is called the big bang. if you take Adam, and Eve out of the Bible, Genesis does hint of this event.