Physics in Code Geass

[proEuphie]

Physics in Code Geass


As is well known, in most anime the laws of physics are different than in real life.

However, the more “serious” an anime is the more realistic it usually is, and thus the laws of nature are usually more similar to those in real life in order to avoid seeming like some crazy cartoon.

In Mecha and Apocalyptic Anime & Manga, the thread “Lacus Clyne V/S Euphemia li Britannia” has several posts which touch on Code Geass physics.

In my post number 15 I responded to a poster who wrote:

“Lets see, I hate both of them. The 'all-good' kinda character who can do no wrong. I haven't seen Lacus Clyne before, but I'd prefer her to Euphemia. The first time we saw her she'd just jumped out of a second-story window, and would have gone Splat if Suzaku hadn't caught her. She obviously wasn't gonna land safely.

There. Stupidity in all its glory”


By writing:

“Neither Lacus or Euphemia is all good nor can do no wrong. But Euphemia is the only character in her show who is good enough to be worth liking or caring about.

I think I remember that Euphemia said she had made a rope by tying bedsheets together and was climbing down it when she fell.

Euphemia might have liked to think that Suzaku saved her life by catching her. But deep down she probably knew enough physics to realize that if one person standing on the ground can catch another person without any injury or pain to either then the falling person would not have been hurt badly by falling a few extra feet to the ground.

If Euphemia fell about four feet past Suzaku's arms to the ground she would have added about four feet per second, or 14,400 feet per hour, or 2.727272 miles per hour, to her speed. Adding the effects of walking into a wall at less than three miles per hour to the effects of a collision which is not bad enough to hurt someone at all gives a collision which is still not bad enough to hurt someone badly.

And even if a person is killed instantly by a fall they probably won't "go Splat" when they hit. I have read that the bodies of persons who jumped out of flaming aircraft without working parachutes from heights of hundreds and thousands of feet were found and identified. You may prefer to imagine that objects with identifying inscriptions were fished out of pools of glop, but I think that probably the bodies were intact enough for identification.”

Anyone who thinks they have a strong enough stomach can do more research on the “Splat” topic but I think most of us will be better off just accepting my statement that someone who falls off a relatively low-rise building is not going to “Go Splat” even if they do land hard enough to be killed instantly.

In my post number 18 I responded to a poster who wrote:

“I know this is off topic, but I am too much of a physics nerd to let this go. To say that your math is off is an understatement (and please, I am correcting you because you really, really wrong here; if you want to correct me, PM me instead).

Your math is only correct if Euphemia was barely moving at the time that she hit Suzaku, which is not true; you are not taking into account the fact that Euphemia was falling down at the time, not just moving. Since Euphemia is FALLING, she MUST be going at LEAST 9.8 m/s (32 ft/s), as that is the gravity constant (9.8 m/s squared). If the video is anything to go by, she was at least 4 stories up which is about 20 meters or 60 feet in the air. At about 25 feet, you are most likely going to break BOTH of your legs and injure your spine; at 35 feet, the fall is potentially fatal.

Given this info, she must have been falling at 9.8 m/s (20 meters/2.04 seconds [the time it took her to fall]), which is 21.9 mi/h. Getting in a car accident at 21 miles per hour is not going to be pleasant (most likely whiplash), but at least you are surrounded by metal on all sides and are restrained in your seat (hopefully). If one hits concrete at this speed, bones are going to break, if not pop out your body, and there is good (but definitely not certain) chance that you are going to DIE. And this is if Suzaku WASN'T standing there, which, for all Euphemia knew, he wasn't. With him there, he slows her down (slightly), but not enough to avoid injury to Euphemia or himself. If Euphemia is about 110 pounds (50 kilograms), she is still traveling at 21.9 miles per hour. Stopping that with your body is going to seriously injure you.

Of course, none of this really explains why Euphemia made the decision to jump out of the window in the first place.:wacko.”


By writing:

“My math is not off. It is a fairly correct calculation of the extra speed that falling about four more feet to the ground would have added to Euphemia's velocity if Suzaku was not there to catch her about four feet above the ground. MY point was that Euphie and Suzaku showed no ill effects from his catching her, and falling an extra four feet would not add enough velocity to make the fall significantly more dangerous. Thus Euphie would not have "gone Splat" if Suzaku was not there to catch her.

Why do you say that Euphemia jumped out of a window? Did the episode show her jumping? I just remember seeing Suzaku catching her. And I think she told him she made a rope out of bed sheets and was climbing down it when she fell.”

So what do you think about the physics in episode 5 of Code Geass?

Do you think that Euphemia was stupid enough to jump out a window to what would have been certain death if Suzaku was not there to catch her?

Do you think that Euphie fell only a short distance before Suzaku caught her and thus would not have been badly hurt if Suzaku was not there to catch her?

Do you think that the world of Code Geass must have a much lower force of gravity, thus badly injuring its credibility as drama?

[wolfgirl90]

As per my respect rules, since you are asking semi-valid questions, I shall answer your questions, even though you are asking said questions in a profoundly stupid way; questioning the physics of a cartoon where a bunch of mechs roll around on skates and freaking fly with energy wings is pushing it just a tad.

First, you just said that the more serious that an anime is, the more realistic its physics should be.

However, the more “serious” an anime is the more realistic it usually is, and thus the laws of nature are usually more similar to those in real life in order to avoid seeming like some crazy cartoon.

But then you double back saying that the force of gravity is lower (or suggest that it might be; why else would you bring it up?). As sensible as you claim to be, you still need some work on forming your ideas in a coherent fashion. Since you believe that the physics MUST be realistic, as this is a serious anime and I have quoted you saying as such, I will treat this as reality...which is what I was doing in the Lacus/Euphemia thread in the first place (it was a freaking joke).

Now to your questions. Please take out some pen and paper and take notes as they will be requested at the end of the lecture. Here's a screencap of Euphemia falling out of that window in episode 5.



As you can see, she has already passed the third story window (she was certainly not a short distance from the ground from ANY perspective), but is too far far away from it. This means that she couldn't have fallen from that particular window; she must have been higher than that, from AT LEAST the fourth story window, which is where I will place her for the sake of this example (she easily could have been higher than that).

Now, taking air resistance out of the equation (as Euphemia was tucking in her dress and it wouldn't have helped squat even if she hadn't), since this is Earth, we know that acceleration due to gravity is 9.8 m/s squared (I am well aware of the variants of acceleration due to gravity, but for the sake of simplicity, we are going to use 9.8 m/s squared as a constant). This means that the moment Euphemia fell (jumped, leaped, whatever), she was going AT LEAST 9.8 m/s or 32 ft/s.

The fourth story of a building is typically located 20 meters (60 feet) from the ground. With Euphemia's acceleration, it would have only taken her 2.04 seconds to complete the fall. With the knowledge of the (presumed) height of her fall and the time it took her to complete the fall (speed = distance/time), we can calculate that she was falling at 9.8 m/s or 21.9 mi/h. At this speed in a car, one can get pretty banged up, usually whiplash and bruises somewhere (hell, add another 2.1 mi/h and the airbags would have deployed), but one is surrounded by 2 tons of metal when this happens. Unprotected, falling at that height is most likely going to be fatal as only about 35 feet is needed to be almost certainly fatal. Now class, if Euphemia is falling from almost twice the presumed fatal height (and she could have been even higher than that), what does this mean?

When it comes to Euphemia's intelligence, she admits that she DIDN'T notice Suzaku being under her until AFTER she had leaped from the window (please watch the episode in question; she says this right to Suzaku's face). This of course means that she didn't plan for Suzaku to be under her, that she had jumped without his presence in mind. Of course, this STILL doesn't answer the question as to WHY she felt the need to jump out of a window in the first place (she explains that "bad men" were chasing her, but this is seriously debatable).

In short, my answers are 1) the physics of Code Geass is actually debatable, as are ALL mech anime (hell ANY work of fiction); I was really making a joke that you somehow felt the need to debate, 2) I do believe that Euphemia was stupid enough to leap out of a window without the knowledge of Suzaku catching her because she admitted, to SUZAKU'S FACE, that she didn't know that he was there until AFTER she leaped, 3) I don't believe she fell a short distance; the screencap proves as much and 4) I don't believe that the gravity is lower but that questioning the physics of the show AT ALL, where several ton mechs fly and a teenage boy controls people with his eye, shows a serious need to get out more.

This concludes today's lecture. Please print your name and pass your notes to the front of the room.

[proEuphie]

As per my respect rules, since you are asking semi-valid questions, I shall answer your questions, even though you are asking said questions in a profoundly stupid way; questioning the physics of a cartoon where a bunch of mechs roll around on skates and freaking fly with energy wings is pushing it just a tad.

First, you just said that the more serious that an anime is, the more realistic its physics should be.



But then you double back saying that the force of gravity is lower (or suggest that it might be; why else would you bring it up?). As sensible as you claim to be, you still need some work on forming your ideas in a coherent fashion. Since you believe that the physics MUST be realistic, as this is a serious anime and I have quoted you saying as such, I will treat this as reality...which is what I was doing in the Lacus/Euphemia thread in the first place (it was a freaking joke).

Now to your questions. Please take out some pen and paper and take notes as they will be requested at the end of the lecture. Here's a screencap of Euphemia falling out of that window in episode 5.

Attachment 30149

As you can see, she has already passed the third story window (she was certainly not a short distance from the ground from ANY perspective), but is too far far away from it. This means that she couldn't have fallen from that particular window; she must have been higher than that, from AT LEAST the fourth story window, which is where I will place her for the sake of this example (she easily could have been higher than that).

Now, taking air resistance out of the equation (as Euphemia was tucking in her dress and it wouldn't have helped squat even if she hadn't), since this is Earth, we know that acceleration due to gravity is 9.8 m/s squared (I am well aware of the variants of acceleration due to gravity, but for the sake of simplicity, we are going to use 9.8 m/s squared as a constant). This means that the moment Euphemia fell (jumped, leaped, whatever), she was going AT LEAST 9.8 m/s or 32 ft/s.

The fourth story of a building is typically located 20 meters (60 feet) from the ground. With Euphemia's acceleration, it would have only taken her 2.04 seconds to complete the fall. With the knowledge of the (presumed) height of her fall and the time it took her to complete the fall (speed = distance/time), we can calculate that she was falling at 9.8 m/s or 21.9 mi/h. At this speed in a car, one can get pretty banged up, usually whiplash and bruises somewhere (hell, add another 2.1 mi/h and the airbags would have deployed), but one is surrounded by 2 tons of metal when this happens. Unprotected, falling at that height is most likely going to be fatal as only about 35 feet is needed to be almost certainly fatal. Now class, if Euphemia is falling from almost twice the presumed fatal height (and she could have been even higher than that), what does this mean?

When it comes to Euphemia's intelligence, she admits that she DIDN'T notice Suzaku being under her until AFTER she had leaped from the window (please watch the episode in question; she says this right to Suzaku's face). This of course means that she didn't plan for Suzaku to be under her, that she had jumped without his presence in mind. Of course, this STILL doesn't answer the question as to WHY she felt the need to jump out of a window in the first place (she explains that "bad men" were chasing her, but this is seriously debatable).

In short, my answers are 1) the physics of Code Geass is actually debatable, as are ALL mech anime (hell ANY work of fiction); I was really making a joke that you somehow felt the need to debate, 2) I do believe that Euphemia was stupid enough to leap out of a window without the knowledge of Suzaku catching her because she admitted, to SUZAKU'S FACE, that she didn't know that he was there until AFTER she leaped, 3) I don't believe she fell a short distance; the screencap proves as much and 4) I don't believe that the gravity is lower but that questioning the physics of the show AT ALL, where several ton mechs fly and a teenage boy controls people with his eye, shows a serious need to get out more.

This concludes today's lecture. Please print your name and pass your notes to the front of the room.

I think that it is only fair to warn you that the more you prove your point, the more you disprove it.

[wolfgirl90]

I think that it is only fair to warn you that the more you prove your point, the more you disprove it.

Just like how one can't prove a negative, right? Oh wait, one CAN prove a negative, so why should I believe your logic now when it has been flawed before? And to think that I was trying to be nice to you. Well, if it acts like a troll...

You may want to elaborate on this (go ahead and try). If I can prove my point, it means that my point is not only valid but true, that the proposition that I have presented to you has sufficient evidence to be declared true. Since a proposition can only be either true or false, the information I have given can either only prove my point or disprove my point; it can't do both at the exact same time.

Of course, that was a pretty bold statement to make considering the fact that 1) you made the thread, so of course I am going to keep proving my point, 2) if you hadn't made this thread, I wouldn't have said anything to you and 3) you HAVE YET to present evidence of (let alone actually prove) YOUR point (and this is the second time that you are presenting it, which is the same number as mine).

Then again, I could say the say the same thing to you, what with your belief that Euphemia broke the Geass and that you have proved me wrong over and over again (like hell you have). Does that mean that the more you "prove" that Euphemia broke the Geass, the more that you are disproving it?

[proEuphie]

Just like how one can't prove a negative, right? Oh wait, one CAN prove a negative, so why should I believe your logic now when it has been flawed before? And to think that I was trying to be nice to you. Well, if it acts like a troll...

You may want to elaborate on this (go ahead and try). If I can prove my point, it means that my point is not only valid but true, that the proposition that I have presented to you has sufficient evidence to be declared true. Since a proposition can only be either true or false, the information I have given can either only prove my point or disprove my point; it can't do both at the exact same time.

Of course, that was a pretty bold statement to make considering the fact that 1) you made the thread, so of course I am going to keep proving my point, 2) if you hadn't made this thread, I wouldn't have said anything to you and 3) you HAVE YET to present evidence of (let alone actually prove) YOUR point (and this is the second time that you are presenting it, which is the same number as mine).

Then again, I could say the say the same thing to you, what with your belief that Euphemia broke the Geass and that you have proved me wrong over and over again (like hell you have). Does that mean that the more you "prove" that Euphemia broke the Geass, the more that you are disproving it?

The more you prove your point that Euphemia fell a distance and at a speed that were probably fatal, the more you will prove my point that Euphemia did not stupidly jump out a window at a probably fatal height.

Your math looks a little vague. In your posts you claim that Euphemia fell from 60 feet, that she fell for 2.04 seconds, and that she fell at a speed of 9.8 meters per second (21.92 miles per hour).

A falling object of no initial velocity and no aerodynamic abilities will fall at a speed of zero in the first instant that it is released. It will fall about 32.174 feet in the first second that it falls, and it will fall at a speed of about 32.174 feet per second in the exact instant that the first second of falling ends. It will fall about 67.348 feet in the second second of fall, and will fall at a speed of about 64.348 feet per second at the exact end of the second second of falling. Thus it will fall a total of about 96.522 feet in exactly two seconds.

Thus an object will fall 60 feet in a lot less than two seconds, and an object will fall roughly 100 feet in 2.04 seconds.

I think that an object will have a speed of roughly 60 feet per second when it hits the ground after falling 60 feet. That is 216,000 feet per hour, or 40.90909 miles per hour.

[wolfgirl90]

The more you prove your point that Euphemia fell a distance and at a speed that were probably fatal, the more you will prove my point that Euphemia did not stupidly jump out a window at a probably fatal height.

Again, you need to elaborate on this. When it comes to a proposition, it can ONLY be true OR false based on the evidence given. I can't prove AND disprove something at the same time. In this case, I am either right or wrong and unless you can PROVE me wrong (meaning, show that my proposition is false), you honestly can't say anything. If my information shows that Euphemia fell (again, her word was "leaped"; she said she leaped so I am going to use every related word) from a potentially fatal height, ALL arguments about whether she "jumped" or not are irrelevant. Your point about her not being stupid enough to jump out of a window from a deadly height was proven wrong once I explained that she said, TO SUZAKU'S FACE, that she had LEAPED out of the window without knowing that he was below her. How can you challenge this? You can't. Watch the scene. It couldn't be more clear. How can you make the argument that she couldn't have been stupid enough to jump from that window without looking when Euphemia herself admitted that that's exactly what happened?

Your math looks a little vague. In your posts you claim that Euphemia fell from 60 feet, that she fell for 2.04 seconds, and that she fell at a speed of 9.8 meters per second (21.92 miles per hour).

Hell, I gave you all the information that you needed, included estimates and a picture of her falling out of a window (which from ANY perspective is pretty high). My calculations could be wrong, but they are not vague. My calculation of her exact velocity, be it right or wrong, still doesn't change her height. And I would love for you to say that someone doesn't risk ANY bodily harm by doing the equivalent of jumping off of a four story building. Then you can test this on yourself.

A falling object of no initial velocity and no aerodynamic abilities will fall at a speed of zero in the first instant that it is released. It will fall about 32.174 feet in the first second that it falls, and it will fall at a speed of about 32.174 feet per second in the exact instant that the first second of falling ends. It will fall about 67.348 feet in the second second of fall, and will fall at a speed of about 64.348 feet per second at the exact end of the second second of falling. Thus it will fall a total of about 96.522 feet in exactly two seconds.

First of all proEuphie, while I converted my numbers for you for the sake of simplicity, we are dealing with physics here and we use the metric system; your measurements should be in meters. Second, your reasoning is so off that I seriously question your grasp on simple physics (if you even took the class).

Third, HOW THE HELL did you get 96.522 for after exactly 2 seconds of falling? If 32x2 = 64, how the hell did you 96?!?!

My math may be wrong, but not as wrong as this!!

Alright, once again, even if my math is wrong, we still have Euphemia making the not-so-smart decision to "leap" out of a window, a window that's at least four stories up from the ground according to the screencap (and if you don't believe it watch the episode again). This height is potentially fatal; my calculation of her speed was only to demonstrate just how fatal it is.

Pardon me, but common sense would dictate that one shouldn't jump from four stories in the air, when jumping from just two stories, the height of the average home, could seriously injure you. Are you trying to tell me that despite the fact that Euphemia fell from at least twice that, she would have been fine? Because you seem to be maintaining the opinion that Suzaku didn't have to be there, that his non-presence would have simply added a couple more feet to Euphemia's fall.

You asked if I thought that Euphemia was stupid enough to jump from a deadly height without know that Suzaku was there. From EUPHEMIA HERSELF, we know the answer is YES, because she said that is EXACTLY what happened, that she leaped without knowing that Suzaku was there. You asked if I thought that she only fell a short distance before Suzaku caught her. Not only did she NOT fall from a short distance (from any perspective), Suzaku being there would have done absolutely nothing except ensure that there would be two dead bodies instead of one.

Also, I was making a freaking joke about a cartoon character. Grow up will you.

[proEuphie]

Again, you need to elaborate on this. When it comes to a proposition, it can ONLY be true OR false based on the evidence given. I can't prove AND disprove something at the same time. In this case, I am either right or wrong and unless you can PROVE me wrong (meaning, show that my proposition is false), you honestly can't say anything. If my information shows that Euphemia fell (again, her word was "leaped"; she said she leaped so I am going to use every related word) from a potentially fatal height, ALL arguments about whether she "jumped" or not are irrelevant. Your point about her not being stupid enough to jump out of a window from a deadly height was proven wrong once I explained that she said, TO SUZAKU'S FACE, that she had LEAPED out of the window without knowing that he was below her. How can you challenge this? You can't. Watch the scene. It couldn't be more clear. How can you make the argument that she couldn't have been stupid enough to jump from that window without looking when Euphemia herself admitted that that's exactly what happened?

In some systems of logic, but not in all systems of logic, a preposition can only be all true or all false. And you have made not one preposition, as you think, but more than one preposition. Examine my words:

"The more you prove that Euphemia fell a distance and at a speed that are usually fatal, the more you will prove my point that she did not stupidly jump out a window at a height which is usually fatal."

Hell, I gave you all the information that you needed, included estimates and a picture of her falling out of a window (which from ANY perspective is pretty high). My calculations could be wrong, but they are not vague. My calculation of her exact velocity, be it right or wrong, still doesn't change her height. And I would love for you to say that someone doesn't risk ANY bodily harm by doing the equivalent of jumping off of a four story building. Then you can test this on yourself.

Test this on yourself. Drop a distance of one foot, and if it does not feel too bad the first time, do it several times until you are confident with that drop. Then increase your height gradually by half a foot or a foot at time until you reach four feet, or four and a half feet, or five feet, or whatever height you assume that Suzaku's arms were, or you give up (I would probably give up at two or three feet myself). If you keep it up to four or five feet and and do not find dropping four or five feet, the additional distance Euphemia would have fallen if Suzaku did not catch her, to be too hard or too dangerous, you will have to admit the first degree of defeat. You will have to admit that since Euphemia seemed to be totally unharmed when Suzaku caught her she almost certainly would not have been seriously injured if he did not catch her and she fell the rest of the way to the ground.

First of all proEuphie, while I converted my numbers for you for the sake of simplicity, we are dealing with physics here and we use the metric system; your measurements should be in meters. Second, your reasoning is so off that I seriously question your grasp on simple physics (if you even took the class).

Third, HOW THE HELL did you get 96.522 for after exactly 2 seconds of falling? If 32x2 = 64, how the hell did you 96?!?!

My math may be wrong, but not as wrong as this!!

If a falling object accelerates 9.81 meters per second, at the exact end of second number two it will be falling at a speed of two times 9.81 meters per second, or 19.62 meters per second, or 70.632 kilometers per hour, or 43.89 miles per hour. At the exact end of second number two the object will have fallen a distance of one times 9.81 meters plus two times 9.81 meters, or three times 9.81 meters, or 29.73 meters, or 97.54 feet. Thus I calculated about 96.522 feet as the total distance fallen in two seconds, not the speed after two seconds.

Alright, once again, even if my math is wrong, we still have Euphemia making the not-so-smart decision to "leap" out of a window, a window that's at least four stories up from the ground according to the screencap (and if you don't believe it watch the episode again). This height is potentially fatal; my calculation of her speed was only to demonstrate just how fatal it is.

Pardon me, but common sense would dictate that one shouldn't jump from four stories in the air, when jumping from just two stories, the height of the average home, could seriously injure you. Are you trying to tell me that despite the fact that Euphemia fell from at least twice that, she would have been fine? Because you seem to be maintaining the opinion that Suzaku didn't have to be there, that his non-presence would have simply added a couple more feet to Euphemia's fall.

That's what the episode shows. One, that Euphie would have fallen just four or five more feet if Suzaku did not catch her. Two, that he caught her with no harm to either of them. Three, and thus that she would not have been injured if she fell the rest of the way to the ground. If she was unharmed when Suzaku caught her, falling a few more feet would almost certainly not have been the straw that broke the camel's back (or Euphie's back).

You asked if I thought that Euphemia was stupid enough to jump from a deadly height without know that Suzaku was there. From EUPHEMIA HERSELF, we know the answer is YES, because she said that is EXACTLY what happened, that she leaped without knowing that Suzaku was there. You asked if I thought that she only fell a short distance before Suzaku caught her. Not only did she NOT fall from a short distance (from any perspective), Suzaku being there would have done absolutely nothing except ensure that there would be two dead bodies instead of one.

Also, I was making a freaking joke about a cartoon character. Grow up will you.

But the episode clearly shows One, that Suzaku was there, Two, that Suzaku did catch her, and Three, that their bodies were not only alive after he caught her but they showed no ill effects at all.

[Aku no Hikari]

Allow me to humbly point out what in the Holy Lulz she's trying to ramble this time...

The more you prove your point that Euphemia fell a distance and at a speed that were probably fatal, the more you will prove my point that Euphemia did not stupidly jump out a window at a probably fatal height.

"Fell" being the operative word in the former, as opposed to "stupidly jump" in the latter. She's trying to say that if the fall is deadly, then Euphie didn't "stupidly jump". Now I'd like to break "stupidly jump" into two parts:

1) Jump, which means that her action was intentional, as opposed to just "fall"; and
2) Stupidly, which means that her action lacked proper reasoning (or in this context, safety measures... I assume)

Before I proceed, I'd like to ask you which one exactly are you trying to prove here? Are you trying to say that Euphie did not JUMP ON PURPOSE (despite the fact that she ADMITTED the opposite), or that she did jump on purpose, but it was not "stupid"? I'll assume that it's the latter, as your whole thread seems to revolve around it. And I'll go with the assumption that by "stupid", you mean "reckless", and that you're trying to say that she already had it planned to fall safely, or at least somehow knew that she would safely, despite of the distance and all.

Assuming that this is the case, my next question would be: HOW the hell did you conclude this? Does the fact that Euphemia's fall was going to be fatal mean that Euphemia MUST have known that it won't be so?

If that's the case, then this is just another one of your flawed arguments. "Drugs are dangerous. Therefore, he can't be taking them stupidly." LOLWUT?

And my answer is: Stop trying to prove that your awesome-super-best-character-in-the-entire-anime Euphemia isn't stupid. It's too late. The fact is that Euphemia is one of the most stupid characters in Code Geass. (I think she's the second most stupid one, right after Tamaki. But I might be wrong since there could be yet a dumber character that just didn't come to my mind.)

At least if you want to try proving that Euphemia didn't do it "stupidly", try using a valid argument; one that is relevant.

[Aozora*Pen]

Physics in Code Geass


As is well known, in most anime the laws of physics are different than in real life.

However, the more “serious” an anime is the more realistic it usually is, and thus the laws of nature are usually more similar to those in real life in order to avoid seeming like some crazy cartoon.

In Mecha and Apocalyptic Anime & Manga, the thread “Lacus Clyne V/S Euphemia li Britannia” has several posts which touch on Code Geass physics.

In my post number 15 I responded to a poster who wrote:

“Lets see, I hate both of them. The 'all-good' kinda character who can do no wrong. I haven't seen Lacus Clyne before, but I'd prefer her to Euphemia. The first time we saw her she'd just jumped out of a second-story window, and would have gone Splat if Suzaku hadn't caught her. She obviously wasn't gonna land safely.

There. Stupidity in all its glory”


By writing:

“Neither Lacus or Euphemia is all good nor can do no wrong. But Euphemia is the only character in her show who is good enough to be worth liking or caring about.

I think I remember that Euphemia said she had made a rope by tying bedsheets together and was climbing down it when she fell.

Euphemia might have liked to think that Suzaku saved her life by catching her. But deep down she probably knew enough physics to realize that if one person standing on the ground can catch another person without any injury or pain to either then the falling person would not have been hurt badly by falling a few extra feet to the ground.

If Euphemia fell about four feet past Suzaku's arms to the ground she would have added about four feet per second, or 14,400 feet per hour, or 2.727272 miles per hour, to her speed. Adding the effects of walking into a wall at less than three miles per hour to the effects of a collision which is not bad enough to hurt someone at all gives a collision which is still not bad enough to hurt someone badly.

And even if a person is killed instantly by a fall they probably won't "go Splat" when they hit. I have read that the bodies of persons who jumped out of flaming aircraft without working parachutes from heights of hundreds and thousands of feet were found and identified. You may prefer to imagine that objects with identifying inscriptions were fished out of pools of glop, but I think that probably the bodies were intact enough for identification.”

Oh wait. Now it's a fourth floor window, actually. It all depends on the artist's perspective.

That aside, the first we see of Euphemia, she is not climbing down a rope made of bedsheets, she is leaping/jumping out the window.

Orlly? Catch a person falling/leaping from a fourth floor window without injuring either of them? If you would care to do the research, a fall from a fourth floor window is enough to do plenty of damage to the person falling, not to say the person standing beneath who has to catch a person of Euphemia's weight, if there was even a person in the first place. The lightest injury he/she would get off with would be a sprained back.

The key words here, being of course, 'walking into the wall' and 'less than 3 miles per hour.' Exactly what speed is this? And oh sure, walking straight into the wall won't give you any kind of injury, not even bruising of the epidermis. Right.

Also, the 'Splat' theory is most likely right considering that it is a fourth floor window and that if there had been no-one there to catch her, she would, in the worse case have her brains splattered over a Concrete sidewalk and have bones broken.

Of course, this being an anime, their physics is questionable in order to make impossible things possible.

[wolfgirl90]

Examine my words: "The more you prove that Euphemia fell a distance and at a speed that are usually fatal, the more you will prove my point that she did not stupidly jump out a window at a height which is usually fatal."

Once again, E-L-A-B-O-R-A-T-E. I have already said (twice before) that I don't understand what you are saying (I hardly ever understand what you are saying). YOU need to explain YOUR words as YOU are the one with the burden of proof here. I am NOT responsible for figuring out YOUR words. YOU need to explain them to ME.

A proposition is classified as a truthbearer, an entity that is EITHER true OR false and NOTHING ELSE. Either my proposition is true or its not. It can't be both at the same time under any circumstance. For example, if I said that Euphemia died, what I said is either true (that she is dead) or its false (that she isn't dead). It can't be both.

Thus I calculated about 96.522 feet as the total distance fallen in two seconds, not the speed after two seconds.

I wasn't talking about speed, idiot. If something is moving at "something per second" you simply multiply by the number of seconds. If Euphemia fell at 32.124 m/s, like you said, you simply multiply by two. And under no circumstances should you get 96 after multiplying 32x2.

Distance = velocity x time. Plug in numbers (I will be using the metric system and YOUR numbers).
Distance = 19.62 m/s x 2 seconds (the seconds cancel each other out)
Distance = 39.24 meters

I mean, I will admit that my math was wrong before, but your math is STILL WRONG even now.

That's what the episode shows.

I don't CARE what the stupid cartoon is showing; the fact that what is shown in the episode conflicts with reality is the reason why I made the comment about Euphemia being stupid in THE FIRST PLACE and the reason why we are having this discussion. The episode also shows that several ton mechs can move with the agility of a human being (or better). Are you telling that's reality? Daffy Duck got shot in the face with a shotgun many times in his career but still gets up and completes every cartoon. Are you saying that since the cartoon shows that a shotgun to the face won't kill you that it applies in real life?

YOU are the one who said that, since Code Geass is a "serious" anime, the laws of physics must be more realistic.

However, the more “serious” an anime is the more realistic it usually is, and thus the laws of nature are usually more similar to those in real life in order to avoid seeming like some crazy cartoon.

I, on the other hand, only treated the physics of the CARTOON as real for the sake of the argument when in reality, the laws of physics in ANY CARTOON (let alone Code Geass) are seriously debatable, where they are either seriously warped (Code Geass, every Gundam series) or are completely ignored altogether (Eureka Seven, Gurren Lagann).

But the episode clearly shows One, that Suzaku was there, Two, that Suzaku did catch her, and Three, that their bodies were not only alive after he caught her but they showed no ill effects at all.

Yeah, no kidding stupid, its a freaking CARTOON. Again, I don't care what the episode shows since it is a cartoon. Nothing is real. It doesn't represent reality. Why you decide to argue this, I have no idea.

Again, my proposition is that Euphemia "leaped" (her words, not mine) from a clearly fatal height, WITHOUT KNOWING that Suzaku was there and, IN REALITY, would have died, whether Suzaku caught her or not. Your proposition that she DID NOT stupidly jump from a fatal height is proven false because 1) despite differences in perspective, one can't argue that Euphemia is not falling from AT LEAST the 3-4 story window, both heights being fatal and 2) SHE ADMITTED to Suzaku that she WAS NOT aware that he was below her when she LEAPED from the window.

[Rongue]

To this thread I must say....
lol Anime physics...... /thread
Lets not forget spinzaku.

People that jump from the top of a trailer can get really hurt, I have seen it happen.
People that jump from 4 stories up? Ya.... your going to get atleast a little hurt even if someone breaks your fall.

Anime physics work like this though. Make up some BS to fit your anime.

*looks at Tengen Toppa Gurren lagann* Kick physics out and do whatever the heck you want.
*looks at code geass* Magical eye powers...... ok physics are needed but not really a must.
*looks at sport anime* Ya you need physics.

[proEuphie]

Once again, E-L-A-B-O-R-A-T-E. I have already said (twice before) that I don't understand what you are saying (I hardly ever understand what you are saying). YOU need to explain YOUR words as YOU are the one with the burden of proof here. I am NOT responsible for figuring out YOUR words. YOU need to explain them to ME.

A proposition is classified as a truthbearer, an entity that is EITHER true OR false and NOTHING ELSE. Either my proposition is true or its not. It can't be both at the same time under any circumstance. For example, if I said that Euphemia died, what I said is either true (that she is dead) or its false (that she isn't dead). It can't be both.

After thinking about it, I realized I should restate my statement to:
"The more you prove that Euphemia fell a distance THAT USUALLY PRODUCES A SPEED THAT IS USUALLY FATAL, the more you will prove my point that she did not stupidly jump out a window at a height which is usually fatal."

The capitalized words are deliberately changed to make my meaning clearer. I hope this makes what I intend to prove a little clearer.

I wasn't talking about speed, idiot. If something is moving at "something per second" you simply multiply by the number of seconds. If Euphemia fell at 32.124 m/s, like you said, you simply multiply by two. And under no circumstances should you get 96 after multiplying 32x2.

Distance = velocity x time. Plug in numbers (I will be using the metric system and YOUR numbers).
Distance = 19.62 m/s x 2 seconds (the seconds cancel each other out)
Distance = 39.24 meters

I mean, I will admit that my math was wrong before, but your math is STILL WRONG even now.

I humbly request that before you use the word "idiot" again you try a little experiment which is so safe that I tried it a few days ago.

A) Hold a cardboard filing box n your hands. It can be empty or filled in any kind of objects of any reasonable total weight, as long as the objects are not breakable. let go of the box. Move your hands below the falling box and hold them out and let the box land in your hands.

B) Hold a ruler vertically in your hand, noting the number that one of your fingers is at. Let go of the ruler. Catch the ruler again as quickly as you can. Note the position of your finger on the ruler.

When I tried that I believe that it took me at least a tenth of a second to catch the falling objects and each time they fell about one or two inches. If an object falls 9.8 meters in the first second you might expect it to fall at least 0.98 meters or 98 centimeters in the first tenth of a second, yet I believe you will be able to see that falling objects fall just a few centimeters in the first tenth of a second.

At first sight this simple experiment would seem to contradict the well-established laws that a falling body will fall 9.8 meters in the first second. This seeming paradox is actually no more paradoxical than my statement that:

"The more you prove that Euphemia fell a distance THAT USUALLY PRODUCES A SPEED THAT IS USUALLY FATAL, the more you will prove my point that she did not stupidly jump out a window at a height which is usually fatal."

I don't CARE what the stupid cartoon is showing; the fact that what is shown in the episode conflicts with reality is the reason why I made the comment about Euphemia being stupid in THE FIRST PLACE and the reason why we are having this discussion.

Actually two different things which are shown in the episode appear to conflict with each other in a realistic physics environment. You are making the statement that the evidence about the total distances that Euphemia fell is valid and correct and that the apparently contradictory evidence that Suzaku caught her without injury to either of them just a few feet above where she would have landed is not equally valid or and correct.

Thus you are making an argument which can be logically carried on to state that Euphie and Suzaku died at the beginning of episode five and the rest of the episode and the rest of the series are not what actually happened and are not the real story!

This is because you try to resolve the apparent paradox by arbitrarily deciding that one scene in an episode is more valid and correct evidence than another scene in that episode which appears to contradict it.

The episode also shows that several ton mechs can move with the agility of a human being (or better). Are you telling that's reality?

Are you claiming that biological organisms out perform mechanical devices in every form of possible competition? If so, you should remember the ballad of John Henry.

If you are claiming that bigger always equals slower, as in a television ad I saw which that stated that mice are quick and elephants are slow, imagine an experiment that my fictional super villain, Ima Devil, might subject you to.

You would have a light weight remote control bomb attached to you and be forced to run a distance of 100 feet racing against a trained racing animal which would start 100 feet behind you and would start at the same time as you on a parallel track. If the racing animal passed you Ima Devil would detonate the bomb by remote control.

Ima Devil offers you the choice of running against an elephant or a mouse.

Your argument that several ton mecha could not match the speed and agility of humans seems to indicate that you would choose to race against the elephant instead of the mouse.

If you are under what would seem to be any reasonable maximum weight requirement for military service than any bull would weigh several times as much as you. Thus if larger is usually slower it would be perfectly safe for you to run with the bulls at Pamplona since you would be faster and more agile than the bulls.

There is a a optimum size at which mecha can perform best, and neither of us knows what it is.

Daffy Duck got shot in the face with a shotgun many times in his career but still gets up and completes every cartoon. Are you saying that since the cartoon shows that a shotgun to the face won't kill you that it applies in real life?

YOU are the one who said that, since Code Geass is a "serious" anime, the laws of physics must be more realistic.

It is perfectly possible to show that the two apparently conflicting scenes in "The Princess and the Witch" are consistent with each other and with the known laws of physics in our world. Thus there is no need to say that Code Geass is no more serious than a Daffy Duck cartoon. Code Geass can reasonably be considered serious enough for fans to love it and for me to hate it with a bitter hatred as the most evil television ever.

I, on the other hand, only treated the physics of the CARTOON as real for the sake of the argument when in reality, the laws of physics in ANY CARTOON (let alone Code Geass) are seriously debatable, where they are either seriously warped (Code Geass, every Gundam series) or are completely ignored altogether (Eureka Seven, Gurren Lagann).

Yeah, no kidding stupid, its a freaking CARTOON. Again, I don't care what the episode shows since it is a cartoon. Nothing is real. It doesn't represent reality. Why you decide to argue this, I have no idea.

Again, my proposition is that Euphemia "leaped" (her words, not mine) from a clearly fatal height, WITHOUT KNOWING that Suzaku was there and, IN REALITY, would have died, whether Suzaku caught her or not. Your proposition that she DID NOT stupidly jump from a fatal height is proven false because 1) despite differences in perspective, one can't argue that Euphemia is not falling from AT LEAST the 3-4 story window, both heights being fatal and 2) SHE ADMITTED to Suzaku that she WAS NOT aware that he was below her when she LEAPED from the window.

[wolfgirl90]

"The more you prove that Euphemia fell a distance THAT USUALLY PRODUCES A SPEED THAT IS USUALLY FATAL, the more you will prove my point that she did not stupidly jump out a window at a height which is usually fatal."

It still doesn't make sense. Again, its not up to me to figure what the hell you are saying; its up to you to explain. You need to explain yourself. If you are not going to take the time to explain, I am not going to take the time to figure it out (as if I did before). Math aside, we still have Euphemia admitting to Suzaku that she leaped out of that window without knowing that he was there. This goes under the classification of "stupid", jumping out of a window without looking for obstacles. You're saying that Euphemia "did not stupidly jump out a window at a height which is usually fatal" however, if Euphemia leaped out of a window from a deadly height (and for all we know, for no apparent reason), as you have said that I have proven (meaning, by your own admission, that the height that Euphemia fell was a potentially fatal one) without looking down to see if anyone was there, this qualifies as "stupid". There is no arguing this.

So far, the only thing that might block this from reaching the collection of nerves that serve as your brain would be your personal feelings of Euphemia and your unwillingness to call her stupid. Hell, the fact I called her stupid, more than anything else, might have lead to the creation of this thread in the first place.

I humbly request that before you use the word "idiot" again you try a little experiment which is so safe that I tried it a few days ago.

When I tried that I believe that it took me at least a tenth of a second to catch the falling objects and each time they fell about one or two inches. If an object falls 9.8 meters in the first second you might expect it to fall at least 0.98 meters or 98 centimeters in the first tenth of a second, yet I believe you will be able to see that falling objects fall just a few centimeters in the first tenth of a second.

Sorry, but I will call you an idiot until you either stop acting like a troll (as all trolls are idiots) or you actually present something that shows that you have intelligence. Pardon, but if you admitted that each time you did that "experiment", the object fell about an inch or two, if an inch is 100 centimeters, wouldn't 98 centimeters be "about" one inch? You just contradicted yourself.

Also, YOU have been using 9.8 as the gravitational constant JUST LIKE ME (at least I admitted in my VERY FIRST POST in this thread that the number is technically not a constant and that acceleration due to gravity on Earth varies). Hell, you even used more significant figures than me. So why in the world are you trying to prove that that number can't be used in every situation NOW when you have been using it JUST LIKE ME? Hypocrite much.

This is because you try to resolve the apparent paradox by arbitrarily deciding that one scene in an episode is more valid and correct evidence than another scene in that episode which appears to contradict it.

You are not following what I am saying. I am talking about the differences between reality, what would have happened in real life, versus fiction, what happened in the cartoon. Am I saying that what happened in that scene is the only one that is correct? No, and you are a fool for thinking otherwise (I think you are the only person here who is not getting it...or has realized it, but just like in every one of your threads, while you expect humility from others, you lack it yourself). What happened in that scene (hell the WHOLE SERIES) is not real. Its physics are not real. So Euphemia leaping out of that window and surviving doesn't represent reality. IN THE CARTOON, Euphemia survived her fall. IN REAL LIFE, Euphemia would have died.

Your argument that several ton mecha could not match the speed and agility of humans seems to indicate that you would choose to race against the elephant instead of the mouse.

Umm...did I say anything about speed? No. I believe the word I used was AGILITY (you even quoted me as saying such), which is different from overall speed. Agility is the ability to change one's body position effeciently. While I would lose in a contest of speed against an elephant, I would win hands down in a contest of agility. Agility and speed are two different things.

It is perfectly possible to show that the two apparently conflicting scenes in "The Princess and the Witch" are consistent with each other and with the known laws of physics in our world.

*sigh* Again, you have the burden of proof here. PROVE IT.

[proEuphie]

[/I]Sorry, but I will call you an idiot until you either stop acting like a troll (as all trolls are idiots) or you actually present something that shows that you have intelligence. Pardon, but if you admitted that each time you did that "experiment", the object fell about an inch or two, if an inch is 100 centimeters, wouldn't 98 centimeters be "about" one inch? You just contradicted yourself.

Please search for metric conversion on the internet or look at a ruler which has inches marked off on one edge and millimeters and centimeters marked off on the other edge.

Also, YOU have been using 9.8 as the gravitational constant JUST LIKE ME (at least I admitted in my VERY FIRST POST in this thread that the number is technically not a constant and that acceleration due to gravity on Earth varies). Hell, you even used more significant figures than me. So why in the world are you trying to prove that that number can't be used in every situation NOW when you have been using it JUST LIKE ME? Hypocrite much.

The number of 9.8 meters can be used in every situation. I was not trying to say that it can not be used in every situation. My post # 12 above has a section:

At first sight this simple experiment would seem to contradict the well-established laws that a falling body will fall 9.8 meters in the first second. This seeming paradox is actually no more paradoxical than my statement that:

"The more you prove that Euphemia fell a distance THAT USUALLY PRODUCES A SPEED THAT IS USUALLY FATAL, the more you will prove my point that she did not stupidly jump out a window at a height which is usually fatal."

I think that phrases such as:"would seem to contradict" and: "This seeming paradox" clearly imply that there is an apparent contradiction or paradox, not an actual contradiction or paradox.

You are not following what I am saying. I am talking about the differences between reality, what would have happened in real life, versus fiction, what happened in the cartoon. Am I saying that what happened in that scene is the only one that is correct? No, and you are a fool for thinking otherwise (I think you are the only person here who is not getting it...or has realized it, but just like in every one of your threads, while you expect humility from others, you lack it yourself). What happened in that scene (hell the WHOLE SERIES) is not real. Its physics are not real. So Euphemia leaping out of that window and surviving doesn't represent reality. IN THE CARTOON, Euphemia survived her fall. IN REAL LIFE, Euphemia would have died.

YOU are not following what I said. Euphemia is clearly seen landing in Suzaku's arms at a speed which is slow enough not to harm either of them. Euphemia is shown falling to Suzaku's arms at a speed which can be calculated. From calculating Euphemia's speed the height she fell from can be calculated. And it is obvious that height will be too low for a fall from it to be dangerous. The slow speed she is seen landing at proves that.

So if Euphemia is also seen falling from a much greater height than calculated from her speed, Code Geass fans can consider which scene and which bit of information is more important to Code Geass. Clearly the height that Euphemia fell or jumped from is a minor piece of information. Clearly the fact that Suzaku and Euphemia were both unhurt and had many later important scenes is much more important to the story and plot of Code Geass.

Thus, if forced to choose, Code Geass fans will choose to believe that the scenes which show Euphemia falling from a usually fatal height are incorrect, that they were drawn and animated by workers who did not know or care how serious an anime Code Geass was and how much it deserved more scientific realism. And thus they will have to admit that there is no reason to accuse Euphemia of stupidly jumping from a usually fatal height in that episode.

Code Geass fans who consider every element to be equally valid and think it is wrong to choose which plot element is more correct than another, will have to say that Euphemia was shown both to fall from a height which is usually fatal in our world and to land in Suzaku's arms at a slow and safe speed which in our world would result from falling a much shorter distance.

The most obvious way they could choose to resolve he situation is to say that the gravitational acceleration is much less in the world of code Geaas than in our world and thus it is reasonably safe to fall from the height that Euphemia fell, even though a fall from that height would probably be fatal in our world. Thus they would have to admit that Euphemia was not stupid if she jumped from that height in her world with her experience with falls and heights.

So I have come up with two explanations of the seeming paradox in "the Princess and the witch", each requiring that those who advocate it admit that Euphemia did not stupidly leap from a height that almost certainly would be fatal.

Of course since Code Geass is supposed to take place in an alternate history the laws of physics including gravitational acceleration should be exactly the same in its world as on our planet Earth, so the second explanation I gave is not acceptable to scientific or science fictional purists.

Never fear, I will resolve the apparent three way paradox between:
1) The height Euphie was seen falling from.
2) The slow and safe speed Euphie was seen falling at when Suzaku caught her.
3) The gravitational acceleration being the same in the world of Code Geass as on our Earth.

I will soon provide a number of resolutions of that apparent paradox and show that what happened in "The Princess and the witch" can be perfectly plausible without making Euphemia seem stupid.

Did I say anything about speed? No. I believe the word I used was AGILITY (you even quoted me as saying such), which is different from overall speed. Agility is the ability to change one's body position effeciently. While I would lose in a contest of speed against an elephant, I would win hands down in a contest of agility. Agility and speed are two different things.]

Suppose that Ima Devil changed the race into a contest of agility. You and the elephant would run the course separately and would be timed for total time. The course would have many twists and turns and inclines and two or three foot steps up and down, and narrow passages beside pools of paint that would disqualify the person or animal who stepped into it.

And there might be a gate which could only open if a pin was picked up from the ground and gently placed on a sensor, and another gate which could only be opened if objects totaling five hundred pounds were moved and placed on a sensor, and a gate which could only be opened by reaching two feet down a pipe and turning a latch, and so on.

Are you certain you could outperform an elephant in such tests of agility?

*sigh* Again, you have the burden of proof here. PROVE IT.

The proof is coming.

[wolfgirl90]

Okay, look, I'm just going go and skip that previous point (I don't care what you are saying anymore).

My main point (I don't care what yours is anymore) is that what happened in the cartoon and what WOULD HAVE HAPPENED in real life are two totally different things. OF COURSE Euphemia landed in Suzaku's arms without anything happening to her. ITS A CARTOON!! As you have pointed out numerous times before, the show would have effectively ended right then and there if Euphemia died from the fall. Regardless of all the math and everything else, we still have Euphemia falling from an extremely dangerous height WITHOUT LOOKING DOWN (she admitted to Suzaku that she didn't look before jumping, which is stupid no matter what) for pretty much no reason (we never clearly establish what the reason is) and at this point, I honestly don't care what it is.

You got some proof that she didn't do something stupid? Whatever. Good luck with that. PM me when you get it. Of course, just to make it clear, I will continue to hate Euphemia no matter what you do. I pretty much hated her the moment I found out what she was trying to do, so there really isn't much you can do about that. I mean, that's why I continue to insult her. Its the reason why I said that she would have been sidewalk pizza. Because I don't care if she died and I find the idea of her dying that way rather hilarious (sorry, but its true; whine about it in your next post that I am also going to ignore).

However, like I have been trying to tell you, I already know the physics in Code Geass is different from real life. EVERYONE knows the physics in Code Geass is different from real life. The physics of EVERY cartoon is not only different from real life but also different from each other. In fact, the variability of cartoon physics is the reason why I stated in in my first post my confusion as to why you would even concern yourself with the physics of this show in THE FIRST PLACE considering the fact that there are things in there that are completely made up.

So later in the thread, I came to the conclusion that you are not trying to argue physics with me (because, despite some of my mistakes, your physics sucks); you are trying to prove, by whatever means necessary, that Euphemia didn't do something stupid, in this case, jump out a window at a potentially deadly height (which is a futile effort wasted on me because I think that everything that Euphemia did was stupid). So its not about something level-headed like physics; its about trying to change my opinion about Euphemia, which is not going to happen no matter what you do. In fact, pushing it and pushing it and pushing it is making me HATE her even more.

If you want to keep pushing, go ahead.

I think that's just about the end of this thread. Sayonara.

[Aozora*Pen]

I humbly request that before you use the word "idiot" again you try a little experiment which is so safe that I tried it a few days ago.

A) Hold a cardboard filing box n your hands. It can be empty or filled in any kind of objects of any reasonable total weight, as long as the objects are not breakable. let go of the box. Move your hands below the falling box and hold them out and let the box land in your hands.

B) Hold a ruler vertically in your hand, noting the number that one of your fingers is at. Let go of the ruler. Catch the ruler again as quickly as you can. Note the position of your finger on the ruler.

When I tried that I believe that it took me at least a tenth of a second to catch the falling objects and each time they fell about one or two inches. If an object falls 9.8 meters in the first second you might expect it to fall at least 0.98 meters or 98 centimeters in the first tenth of a second, yet I believe you will be able to see that falling objects fall just a few centimeters in the first tenth of a second.

At first sight this simple experiment would seem to contradict the well-established laws that a falling body will fall 9.8 meters in the first second. This seeming paradox is actually no more paradoxical than my statement that:

"The more you prove that Euphemia fell a distance THAT USUALLY PRODUCES A SPEED THAT IS USUALLY FATAL, the more you will prove my point that she did not stupidly jump out a window at a height which is usually fatal."



Actually two different things which are shown in the episode appear to conflict with each other in a realistic physics environment. You are making the statement that the evidence about the total distances that Euphemia fell is valid and correct and that the apparently contradictory evidence that Suzaku caught her without injury to either of them just a few feet above where she would have landed is not equally valid or and correct.

Thus you are making an argument which can be logically carried on to state that Euphie and Suzaku died at the beginning of episode five and the rest of the episode and the rest of the series are not what actually happened and are not the real story!

This is because you try to resolve the apparent paradox by arbitrarily deciding that one scene in an episode is more valid and correct evidence than another scene in that episode which appears to contradict it.

The experiment does not prove anything. Look, the distance is way off, for one thing your hands are nowhere close to being the same size as a filing box, there is no control experiment, and last of all the box is nowhere near the predicted 50 kilograms. Code Geass tried and successfully gave the image of Euphemia being 'thin and frail and oh-so-light' and they succeeded, .'. neither Euphemia or Suzaku is injured. Warped physics. In reality, we all know what happens to an average-weight person who jumps from a high fourth story window, no? And I believe that was what you(?) were trying to prove in the first place anyway.

Who ever said anything about the rest of the series Not being the real story? Again, given Code Geass' warped physics, Suzaku 'caught' Euphemia and the series goes happily on. Finito.

[proEuphie]

Okay, look, I'm just going go and skip that previous point (I don't care what you are saying anymore).

I wish you specified which point you want to skip. I suspect you are just doing that to avoid admitting you were wrong about a point.

My main point (I don't care what yours is anymore) is that what happened in the cartoon and what WOULD HAVE HAPPENED in real life are two totally different things. OF COURSE Euphemia landed in Suzaku's arms without anything happening to her. ITS A CARTOON!! As you have pointed out numerous times before, the show would have effectively ended right then and there if Euphemia died from the fall. Regardless of all the math and everything else, we still have Euphemia falling from an extremely dangerous height WITHOUT LOOKING DOWN (she admitted to Suzaku that she didn't look before jumping, which is stupid no matter what) for pretty much no reason (we never clearly establish what the reason is) and at this point, I honestly don't care what it is.

I have pointed out that you seem to arbitrarily select which happens in the cartoon. To you the jumping or falling from a usually fatal height seems to be much more important than the landing safely. Thus you say that the falling from a usually fatal height is the important factor which the landing safely contradicts. You could choose to say that the landing safely is the important factor which which the falling from a usually fatal height seems to contradict and thus attack the shot showing Euphemia falling from a usually fatal height as being an inaccurate and carelessly planned shot.

Or you could say that both elements are equally valid and there is no apparent contradiction between them because the gravitational acceleration is different in Code Geass than in our world.

Or you could insist that the gravitational acceleration must be the same in Code Geass as in our world. That gives three elements: 1) height of the fall, 2) slow, safe landing, and 3) gravitational acceleration. And you can say that any one or any two of those three elements can be correct but it would be paradoxical for all three to be correct. That is what you seem to be saying. And I will show that it is not paradoxical, it just seems paradoxical.

You got some proof that she didn't do something stupid? Whatever. Good luck with that. PM me when you get it.

Why PM you? Why not tell everyone that Euphemia did not do something stupid? What would I have to gain by sending a PM instead of a post?

Of course, just to make it clear, I will continue to hate Euphemia no matter what you do. I pretty much hated her the moment I found out what she was trying to do, so there really isn't much you can do about that. I mean, that's why I continue to insult her. Its the reason why I said that she would have been sidewalk pizza. Because I don't care if she died and I find the idea of her dying that way rather hilarious (sorry, but its true; whine about it in your next post that I am also going to ignore).

What was Euphemia trying to do that made you hate her? Please list all the Code Geass characters you hate in order of your hatred.

However, like I have been trying to tell you, I already know the physics in Code Geass is different from real life. EVERYONE knows the physics in Code Geass is different from real life. The physics of EVERY cartoon is not only different from real life but also different from each other. In fact, the variability of cartoon physics is the reason why I stated in in my first post my confusion as to why you would even concern yourself with the physics of this show in THE FIRST PLACE considering the fact that there are things in there that are completely made up.

So later in the thread, I came to the conclusion that you are not trying to argue physics with me (because, despite some of my mistakes, your physics sucks); you are trying to prove, by whatever means necessary, that Euphemia didn't do something stupid, in this case, jump out a window at a potentially deadly height (which is a futile effort wasted on me because I think that everything that Euphemia did was stupid). So its not about something level-headed like physics; its about trying to change my opinion about Euphemia, which is not going to happen no matter what you do. In fact, pushing it and pushing it and pushing it is making me HATE her even more.

If you want to keep pushing, go ahead.

I think that's just about the end of this thread. Sayonara.

You certainly have a high opinion of yourself. In case you forgot, you were not the first poster in Lacus Cline Vrs Euphemia Li Britannia to say that Euphemia was stupid for jumping out of a high window.

So this thread is to convince all of them, not just you, that it is perfectly possible that Euphemia did not stupidly jump out of a window at a height which is usually fatal.

As for the physics of each and every cartoon being different from that in real life, there are a lot of people who find their enjoyment of any story marred by any scientific, historic, geographic, etc. flaws. Any of them who are Code geass fans will be pleased to see that A lot of those problems can be explained. I have already given two possible ways to think of "The Princess and the Witch" that have no contradictions about Euphemia's fall. Both of those explanations, of course, show that Euphemia need not have stupidly jumped out of a window at a usually fatal height. And I have many more possible explanations to give -- none of them demanding a stupid Euphie.

Because you are not the only person this thread is addressed to, this is not the end of this thread. Sayonnara to Wolfgirl90, Konnichiwa to the rest.