Dubbed and subbed.

[The Grey Crane]

And to the Grey Crane, who didn't understand point three. You can't get an english version of the mona lisa, why would you expect an english version of any other art form? It is what it is. I'm simply trying to say that if you like dubs you like someone else's vision of an original idea. そうだ！日本語少し勉強したらどう？難しすぎるんじゃねぇか、っあ？アニメを見るとき楽しいことは新しい単 語を習うことだ。してみろ。

Everyone is giving me negative rep points and I've been nothing but civil. I thought this was a discussion.

No, no. It's not that i didn't understand point three, it just didn't make a valid sense. I know what you were trying to imply with it, just so you know.

Just because the Mona Lisa (and other painting obra mestras) doesn't have an "english version" doesn't mean that other works of art (like anime, like novels) shouldn't have one too. You're generalizing, you use the borderlines of originality in painting and sculpture and apply it to anime and "ANY OTHER ART FORM", it just won't work. That's like saying stuff like "when you apply swiss cheese spread on a french bread, it's not the original bread anymore."

You're raising points about originality in some art forms and trying to make it relevant with another art form - not a good way to go unless you want to make a fool out of yourself, seriously.

And perhaps you also know that more often than not, an anime is just the animated spinoff of a manga original.

And don't worry, i'm not into the whole rep thingy. I'm not one of those who gave you negative reps.

[Memento Mori]

It doesn't take up THAT much space. Besides, the image it takes up is, most of the time, irrelevant to the story.

Taking up the amount of space a sub does is not even remotely close to the difference between a dub and an original. Simply put, the alteration from a sub is a lot less than the alteration from a dub.

But by revoltingmexican's logic, its still taking the original artform and ruining it. Which is what I don't get. He's only picking on the dubs, when you can use his same argument (which is flawed) on subs.

[AznOtaku]

But by revoltingmexican's logic, its still taking the original artform and ruining it. Which is what I don't get. He's only picking on the dubs, when you can use his same argument (which is flawed) on subs.

I suppose what he means is that the degree of altering the original by subs is a lot less than by dubs.

It's like giving the Mona Lisa a caption in Photoshop vs using those artistic filters in Photoshop. That's what I think he meant.

[revoltingmexican]

I love the comments I got on what I've written; clearly people on this forum are intelligent. I was just trying to keep the thread alive! Dub vs. Sub is always the one that has everyone at eachother's throats. And to defy my own logic, I love Robotech (which is dubbed, edited, cut, ripped to shreads). I think the best Dub I've heard is Robot Carnival's dub.

[The Grey Crane]

I suppose what he means is that the degree of altering the original by subs is a lot less than by dubs.

It's like giving the Mona Lisa a caption in Photoshop vs using those artistic filters in Photoshop. That's what I think he meant.

By what revoltingmexican has previously stated, a dubbed show is a "mutilated" one. That being said, the assumption of me and several others about his statements are true - that he considers dubbing as a form of ruination of the art form that is anime.

It is a TV show, why make a big deal out of its originality by taking it too far to a point in which "mutilation" becomes synonymous to dubbing?

Dubbing can go as far as altering obscene languages and even character names, but by way of TV programming it's safe to say that even with that degree of alteration, the show in general is still pretty much the same. As far as changing the voices are concerned, it IS dubbing, after all.

Anyway...

The degree of alteration greatly depends on who did it. If we take it on a global scale and use multiple examples of dubbed and subbed anime for comparison, the ratio of alteration isn't "a lot less".

First of all, let's face it, a lot of subbed anime around the net and underground markets during the past few years are in fact illegally done.

Here in the far east, the illegal market is so vast it covers a lot of things from cheap Dolce & Gabana imitations to anime. Due to being less costly than dubbing, subbing is used more often by those involved in making a profit out of anime illegally. More often than not, with their underhanded ways, an anime is butchered by how they sub it. That being said, if you think that the alteration in subbed products is a lot less than those in dubbed ones, think again. Not only does it contain altered names or bad english that will make the story much less understandable, it also contains subtitles from a different show, and subtitles which are obviously meant for the show but a lot of the parts seem totally out of nowhere.

@revoltingmexican, I am not trying to swat you off and i'm not trying to contest the superiority of my preference over yours (none is superior, it is just preference after all). I'm just disagreeing with your statements.

[Gjallarhorn]

Lulz. By Revolt's logic, nothing should ever be translated or brought abroad, ever, under any circumstances.

Way to go, champ.

[kimi no kioku]

It's funny. I always liked Dubs, except Code Geass. I love the Japanese version. Other than that, I usually prefer the dub. In Persona Trinity Soul, I'd never watch it dubbed, that would be awful. The sub was so cool. But Higurashi, I tried to watch Kai subbed, and I couldn't get through it. It's funny how that works.

[zartonis]

I enjoy both subbed and dubbed anime. However, I have found, like many others here, that a dubbed anime often has voice-overs by actors that do not really fit the characters. It is also extremely hard to translate all of the emotions expressed by the original actors, who are usually much more involved with the Director during the production process than a voice-over actor dubbing a work later would be. There are notable exceptions however, as I truly enjoy the dubbed version of many of Hayao Miyazaki's movies, but they are movies and much more time is spent on them than regular TV series.

[Diocletian]

I love the comments I got on what I've written; clearly people on this forum are intelligent. I was just trying to keep the thread alive! Dub vs. Sub is always the one that has everyone at eachother's throats. And to defy my own logic, I love Robotech (which is dubbed, edited, cut, ripped to shreads). I think the best Dub I've heard is Robot Carnival's dub.

*
The man speaks the truth. The hilariously racist Chinese dub makes it all the more better. It's so bad it's good.

*I apologize for the use of this clip, but I need to show some proof to make my point.

[Anime Forum]

I see nothing wrong with dubbed anime and I actually find it pretty fun to watch, though I do enjoy the subbed version better. I mean anime is anime and both versions are enjoyable.