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Thread: Does anything else compare?

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    Gil
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    Default Does anything else compare?

    First of all I would like to introduce myself. I'm Dan, I'm new to your forums, and I have a very important question regarding the calibre of particular Anime in comparison to others.

    Fundamentally, what I would like to know is whether there are any anime series out there that compare to:
    • Death Note (DN)
    • Code Geass (CG)

    Now obviously this is a very subjective matter as different people have different tastes, but really I'm trying to direct this towards people - like myself and many of my friends - who have found these two (or one) anime superiour to any others they have watched.

    I'll be honest, I haven't actually watched that many anime, in fact, my first anime that I ever watched was Death Note and it blew me away. I have never read a book or watched a TV series/film that has gripped me so much.

    After DN, I had the idea in my mind that anime was amazing, that nothing could compare to it. So I went and tried to find recommendations. I watched ~7 episodes of Bleach, I watched ~5 episodes of Naruto, and each one I got bored with quickly.

    Then came Code Geass which I adored - not quite as much as DN - but loved all the same. I enjoy an in-depth story, glimpses of action, fantasy elements, and some form of mystery, but that still doesn't mean I like nothing more.

    When CG ended I have been longing for a good anime to be lost in, but I just can't find any. I read many recommendations for Kurenai and have just finished watching the series. It was much different to other things I had seen, but I actually enjoyed it. Nevertheless it had so many flaws that I felt could be improved, and was no-way in the same league as DN and CG.

    So what do you think? Was I thrown into the deep-end, watching the best anime I will ever watch, in a league no other anime will ever meet for me? Or have I just not looked hard enough. Please CG/DN fans, enlighten me.

    -Dan.

  2. #2
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    Neon Genesis Evangelion would probably be an excellent start. It starts slowly, I'll warn you that much, but it definitely drops quite a bit of mystery from the get-go, as very little is explained in terms of "what's really going on?" until much later. It has mecha (robots that are piloted) just like Code Geass, so there's that similarity. The second half is where it truly picks up and sets it above almost every anime out there IMHO.

    Just be warned, it's complex. Really, you'll probably have to watch the series and the sequel movie (End of Evangelion) twice before fully understanding it.

    Other series that offer action, mystery, and a deep story:

    -Fullmetal Alchemist (the cream of this crop IMHO, and my 2nd favorite anime of all)
    -Noein: To Your Other Self (good futuristic story with mystery and interesting characters)
    -Eureka Seven (plenty of action, a wide cast of characters, a bit of mystery, etc.)
    -Fantastic Children (a little less action compared to the others, but definitely lots of mystery and a good story)
    -Gurren Lagann (okay, this is mainly action, but the character development is great and while the story is relatively simple, it's well-executed)

    Granted, I did omit some of my favorites, but I'm trying to keep it limited to what you seem to enjoy.

    Also, while I've yet to see Monster, I've heard it's a must-see for all those who enjoyed the suspense of Death Note.
    My name is Kakashi Hatake. What I like....I don't feel like telling you that. My dreams for the future...hmm, never really thought about that. As for my hobbies...well, I have many hobbies.

  3. #3
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    almost 30% of anime is better than death note, 50% than code geass (maybe a little less if r2 is excluded). the only thing you can do about it is deny the truth that it is, although by time denial will get replaced with anger at the makers. and that's a fact.


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    Quote Originally Posted by 3pleT View Post
    almost 30% of anime is better than death note, 50% than code geass (maybe a little less if r2 is excluded). the only thing you can do about it is deny the truth that it is, although by time denial will get replaced with anger at the makers. and that's a fact.
    You're underestimating the number of crappy anime that get released (like .hack/roots). Even if you only limited to the good anime both Code Geass and Death Note were really good shows. I'm not even the biggest fan of them and I can tell that they are good.

    anyways shows to watch

    The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya
    -The juggernaut of anime today, Suzumiya impresses with some of the best animation ever. It's primarily a comedy, but has a lot of sci-fi and such things added to it. Suzumiya is the closest thing that anime has had to a second Evangelion.

    Full Metal Alchemist
    -To say that FMA was extremely popular is an understatement. FMA was the most represented anime at my anime club at campus, beating out Bleach and Naruto. FMA has a compelling story, and excellent characters.

    Neon Genesis Evangelion
    -Often considered to be the platinum standard for anime, NGE is probably the most well respected anime there is.

    Elfen Lied
    -If it wasen't for FMA, this would probably be the best anime of 2004. It has one of the best characters in an anime (Lucy) and a relatively deep and haunting psychological story line. It's violent, and definately not a show you'd watch in public, but it's still an extremely good anime.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrono1219 View Post

    Elfen Lied
    -If it wasen't for FMA, this would probably be the best anime of 2004. It has one of the best characters in an anime (Lucy) and a relatively deep and haunting psychological story line. It's violent, and definately not a show you'd watch in public, but it's still an extremely good anime.

    Are you kidding? The only thing that anime was good for is violence, you're obviously not getting what this kid is asking for, Elfen Lied has no dogmatic conflict.

    A big fan of Death note, and more so of Code Geass (AS you can tell) I know why these animes thrill him.


    Bad guy/ Good guy animes are boring!!! That is why Naruto and Bleach did not hold his interest.

    He's asking for a plot where both the protagonist and antagonist are right depending on the viewers personal opinion.

    Sadly Death Note and Code Geass are the biggest of this category.

    Trigun and S-cry-ed were the first anime I watched that sort of delt with this matter. Both, however, only aired for one 26-episode season, so it's better to just read the manga with those.

    Gundam 00 is sort of like Code Geass, but there isn't a 1 on 1 conflict like CG or DN. It's just Celestial Being Vs. the three superpowers of the world.


    Really, so far that is all, but due to DN's and CG's popularity, I think we can assume these archetype storylines will start appearing more often =]
    Last edited by _Freddie_; 12-29-2008 at 12:23 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremiah View Post
    Are you kidding? The only thing that anime was good for is violence,


    right, because while I admit it has prehaps an over the top amount of violence, you can leave things like the story and Nyu/Lucy conflicts out.

    Bad guy/ Good guy animes are boring!!! That is why Naruto and Bleach did not hold his interest.

    or Geass/Deathnote are just much better executed. Naruto started out as a very good show, but it and Bleach have virtually no real story line. Naruto is basically, Become Hokage, Kill Orichmau, Get Sasuke, etc. They are basically this generations DBZ.

    He's asking for a plot where both the protagonist and antagonist are right depending on the viewers personal opinion.


    Trigun and S-cry-ed were the first anime I watched that sort of delt with this matter. Both, however, only aired for one 26-episode season, so it's better to just read the manga with those.


    26 Episodes is around the standard for a lot of manga to anime adaptions outside of shows like Naruto. I'm not crazy about S-cry-ed, but Vash is among the most enjoyable characters.

    Also, in the case of Death Note there was no clear cut "good guy", but in Geass it's pretty obvious that Lelouch was the good guy and the real difference is the way he went about things.

    also Trigun was much more about Vash's value of others lives then anything else.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrono1219 View Post
    [/color][/b]right, because while I admit it has prehaps an over the top amount of violence, you can leave things like the story and Nyu/Lucy conflicts out.
    Nyu and Lucy are the same person, she just has a split personality, there is no "conflict" between them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chrono1219 View Post
    or Geass/Deathnote are just much better executed. Naruto started out as a very good show, but it and Bleach have virtually no real story line. Naruto is basically, Become Hokage, Kill Orichmau, Get Sasuke, etc. They are basically this generations DBZ.


    Of course they're better executed, they have a better plot, afterall.



    Quote Originally Posted by Chrono1219 View Post
    Also, in the case of Death Note there was no clear cut "good guy", but in Geass it's pretty obvious that Lelouch was the good guy and the real difference is the way he went about things.

    also Trigun was much more about Vash's value of others lives then anything else.
    Well it's obvious the Britannian Empire was "bad". However, Lelouch and Suzaku are enemies, but they both have the same goal, they just believe in different methods. They are the conflict, so my statement still stands.


    As for Trigun, the anime was aout whether you can justify killing someone.

    Knives opinion was "Kill the spiders to save the butterflies" and Vash wanted to save them both.

    In the end Legato forced Vash to kill him to save Milly and Meril.

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    Jeremiah, the OP never said he was only interested in series in where the distinction between right and wrong is hard to see. He said he was looking for some action, mystery, and a good story with fantasy elements.

    "Suzumiya is the closest thing that anime has had to a second Evangelion"

    Not really, if anything's a "second Evangelion", it would be Raxhephon.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doom85 View Post
    Jeremiah, the OP never said he was only interested in series in where the distinction between right and wrong is hard to see. He said he was looking for some action, mystery, and a good story with fantasy elements.

    "Suzumiya is the closest thing that anime has had to a second Evangelion"

    Not really, if anything's a "second Evangelion", it would be Raxhephon.
    When I said second Evangelion i ment like the President of the United States of Anime. Basically the smallest bit of news in the Haruhi world is like an atomic bomb waiting to explode in every haruhists home.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrono1219 View Post
    When I said second Evangelion i ment like the President of the United States of Anime. Basically the smallest bit of news in the Haruhi world is like an atomic bomb waiting to explode in every haruhists home.
    Ah, I see. Yes, in terms of worldwide appeal, lots of merchandise, many formats (anime, manga, light novels, etc.), I could see Haruhi being the next "Evangelion".
    My name is Kakashi Hatake. What I like....I don't feel like telling you that. My dreams for the future...hmm, never really thought about that. As for my hobbies...well, I have many hobbies.

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    I actually find this a very interesting point, and I'll try to provide an answer.

    So what do you think? Was I thrown into the deep-end, watching the best anime I will ever watch, in a league no other anime will ever meet for me? Or have I just not looked hard enough.
    Yes and no.

    You have to understand that Death Note and Code Geass were both very particular cases in recent anime history for the following reasons:

    Death Note was unique in that it included highly realistic (or at least quasi-realistic) elements, such as police procedure and criminal activity, where most of the anime being aired at that time usually leaned heavily towards fantasy. In the past decade or so, as anime became more widely accepted as a genre, the anime industry has been flooded with the most mindless sort of escapism, more intent on selling character-related merchandise like collectibles than spinning a good yarn.

    Death Note in a way is an exemplary case that proved that manga/anime could have a dense, complex plot and still sell to the popular audience. In that sense, what you found attractive in Death Note may not have been qualities that were originally inherent in anime as a genre at all, but rather in Japanese live-action police dramas and detective novels, which is obviously where much of the inspiration of Death Note derives from.

    Code Geass, on the other hand, is unique, paradoxically, in that it has very little true originality. Now before all you Code Geass fans descend to tear me to pieces, I want to stress that that is precisely what made the series so successful. Code Geass is an extremely well made collage of almost every cliche in anime history, from special powers to mecha to amnesia.

    In that sense, your evaluation of the anime differs radically depending on which end of the time line you view it from: to an older audience it would be "just another X rip-off" (with the X substituting for Neon Genesis Evangelion, Gundam, s-CRY-ed, etc. etc.), but to a younger audience it would be series "X" that bears a resemblance to Code Geass, not the other way around.

    Again, I'm not necessarily criticizing Code Geass, nor am I accusing it's creators of plagarism. I'm simply noting that if there was anything Code Geass did first, it's to pull together a number of pre-existing themes and do them better. Hence, some people may get the expression that other anime do not quite compare, which I personally believe is a shame.

    ...an in-depth story, glimpses of action, fantasy elements, and some form of mystery, but that still doesn't mean I like nothing more.
    Try TRIGUN, it fits the bill on almost every level. A solid (and might I say lengthy) anime to recommend is Rurouni Kenshin (Samurai X).
    Last edited by Datenshi; 12-29-2008 at 02:44 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Datenshi View Post
    Code Geass, on the other hand, is unique, paradoxically, in that it has very little true originality. Now before all you Code Geass fans descend to tear me to pieces, I want to stress that that is precisely what made the series so successful. Code Geass is an extremely well made collage of almost every cliche in anime history, from special powers to mecha to amnesia.
    The only "cliche" there is mecha. If your going to generalize everything into such a broad category like "superpowers" then that has been done before in all aspects of entertainment. Everything has been done before, so you are right, Code Geass took what has been done before and improved it, and I still found it tried to be original.



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    Some people have already given you some good ones. Neon Genesis Evangelion and Scryed were both good.

    I recommend you watch Cowboy Bebop and perhaps you'll enjoy Cyborg 009. They're quite old, but very good.
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    The only "cliche" there is mecha.
    Perhaps "cliche" was too full of negative nuances in this case and not entirely correct. "Stereotype" would be a closer word, but strictly in the quasi-Jungian sense of the term as concerning certain recurring types in classic mythology. What I am talking about are specific themes that frequently recur in past anime, such as; "young students piloting giant robots"; "the protagonist suddenly forced unwillingly to share a home with a mysterious and beautiful girl"; "an anti-hero using super-powers to topple an evil organisation"; "civilian by day, hero by night" (anyone would admit the masked hero theme was obviously done tongue-in-cheek); "the antagonist(s) suddenly transferring to the hero's school" (in the second season), "an orphan trained from childhood to be a cold-blooded assassin discovering what it is to be human"; "former villians joining hands with the protagonist" (in the tradition of SHONEN JUMP); "the protagonist is a member of the school board, who's president exerts considerable influence over the entire school", etc. etc. etc.

    If your going to generalize everything into such a broad category like "superpowers" then that has been done before in all aspects of entertainment. Everything has been done before, so you are right, Code Geass took what has been done before and improved it, and I still found it tried to be original.
    Which is precisely my point. In an industry (including manga and juvenile novels) where, in your words, "everything has been done before", the only way to be original is to take pre-existing codes and restructure it in a new fashion. Code Geass simply happened to be the first to do it with such success.
    Last edited by Datenshi; 12-31-2008 at 12:50 AM.
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    Personally Gundam 00 or any Gundam series is better then Code Geass.

    Noein is pretty good.

    Shigure as well.


    "There exist only three respectable beings: the priest, the warrior, the poet. To know, to kill, and to create."-Charles Baudelaire

  16. #16
    boopaloop! 3pleT has a reputation beyond repute 3pleT has a reputation beyond repute 3pleT has a reputation beyond repute 3pleT has a reputation beyond repute 3pleT has a reputation beyond repute 3pleT has a reputation beyond repute 3pleT has a reputation beyond repute 3pleT has a reputation beyond repute 3pleT has a reputation beyond repute 3pleT has a reputation beyond repute 3pleT has a reputation beyond repute 3pleT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrono1219 View Post
    You're underestimating the number of crappy anime that get released (like .hack/roots). Even if you only limited to the good anime both Code Geass and Death Note were really good shows. I'm not even the biggest fan of them and I can tell that they are good.
    don't misunderstand me. when i say anime, i mean anime, not the work of some self proclaimed "artist" trying to fit in the category and failing miserably. kinda like 90% of those mtv stars who try to fit in the "music" category. get it? so, basically, out of all the anime that didn't make me puke, roughly 30% are better than death note.


  17. #17
    Senior Member overwatch has a reputation beyond repute overwatch has a reputation beyond repute overwatch has a reputation beyond repute overwatch has a reputation beyond repute overwatch has a reputation beyond repute overwatch has a reputation beyond repute overwatch has a reputation beyond repute overwatch has a reputation beyond repute overwatch has a reputation beyond repute overwatch has a reputation beyond repute overwatch has a reputation beyond repute overwatch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deld View Post
    I enjoy an in-depth story, glimpses of action, fantasy elements, and some form of mystery, but that still doesn't mean I like nothing more.

    I have a roughly similar taste in anime and so I would recomend checking out the following anime that might be what you are after - though the action might be a bit more prominant in some than it was in Death Note - which was very restrained in action (for anime in general)

    Ergo Proxy - dark scifi based anime with a gripping plot to it.

    Gilgamesh - hardly seen any of this one, but its similar to the others - dark and based around a strong story aspect

    Ghost in the Shell - Start with the 2 films and then try out the miniseries. The films are fantastic (the first is outstanding) and should give you more of what you want. The miniseries focuses in more on the manga story (and thus are not connected to the films in any way) and the first does get a bit childish at the start - the second though returns you to a darker more serious world and has a much strong main story aspect to it

    Wolf's Rain - post apocoliptic world - a more fantasy lean than the others, but retaining a scifi aspect. Story is (again) a strong part of this series

    Cowboy Bebop - a fantastic anime and very well written. Its detinaly worth watching - start with the series - the film is more like an extended episode from about halfway through (which is no bad thing at all - but it means that there are characters which you won't get introduced to)

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  18. #18
    Junior Member AnimeVocalist is a jewel in the rough AnimeVocalist is a jewel in the rough AnimeVocalist is a jewel in the rough AnimeVocalist is a jewel in the rough AnimeVocalist's Avatar
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    Well I know I watched now and then some really bad animes...
    I personally liked watching Code Geass, I read the death note manga... For me enjoyed Coded Geass quite much But I also agree with people up there who suggested Cowboy Bebop and Evangelion.

    How about Slam Dunk? I read the mange and perhaps the best one I have read so far.

    Just my personal opinion!

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  19. #19
    Junior Member fadeelah is on a distinguished road fadeelah's Avatar
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    oh my friend watch hxh and noein surely you will like them and if you like romantic animes watch "lovely complex"

  20. #20
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    don't misunderstand me. when i say anime, i mean anime, not the work of some self proclaimed "artist" trying to fit in the category and failing miserably
    That doesn't make a lot of sense. Anime is short for "(Japanese) animation", hence any sort of animated work done in Japan qualifies as anime, whatever it's artistic merits. Saying that the only real anime is good anime is like saying that bad Hollywood movies are not Hollywood movies at all. Plus, anime is the product of a group effort (producer, director, writer, graphic artists, the guys at the top who gave the green light), and it's quality is not decided by some individual "artist".
    Last edited by Datenshi; 12-30-2008 at 07:22 PM.
    "If a person who indulges in gluttony is a glutton, and a person who commits a felony is a felon, then God is an iron."

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  21. #21
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    Yo. Almost everything that comes to mind has been said. I will however repeat a few that have been mentioned only once or twice. Monster is a bit old style (depending on what you consider old style at least), but its a really good anime that'll get you hooked quickly. It's around 70 episodes or so. Wolf's Rain was also mentioned only once. It's a really good anime that gets the formula just right.
    Here's one that isn't dark and gloomy. .hack//sign. The best .hack with out competition. If you ask me, it's one of those kind of laid back anime. It doesn't exactly try to push the story quickly, but trust me, it has it's high moments too.
    Anyway, I feel like I'm seriously forgetting something. I'll post later if I remember it.
    Sig no longer in development...


  22. #22
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    @Thread Starter

    In my humble opinion, Code Geass and Death Note aren't the best ones out there. Both of them might be the best ones you've seen so far in a subjective and in a personal-tastebuds point of view, but once you've explored more from this medium you'll definitely be seeing stuff that dwarfs your now-best-i've-seen-titles. But then again, you just might be suffering from what i would like to call 'first-is-best' syndrome. I know a lot of people who have been into anime for ten, twenty, even thirty or more years. They have seen, read, loved, and hated a lot and yet they still regard the first one they've seen it as the best no matter what. WHich isn't a bad thing though...unless the first one they've seen is something like 'Shura no Toki'.

    I also know tons of people who are really really confused of the words 'best' and 'favorite'. They tend to intertwine these words more than any other. And there are some who are just not broadening their horizons enough...

    In number-crunching terms, CG and DN do fail in comparison to a lot of other titles with gargantuan sales, reception, influence, reputation, etc. to boast. But, i choose not to discuss this matter as of now, preferring to focus on what you might want to try and check out.

    Bug, yes Monster is definitely something worth mentioning. Deep, dark, heavy-plotted and all, Monster is technically superior to DN IMHO. Armed with an in-depth story with glimpses of action and a strong sense mystery, I really think that Monster just might be what the OP is looking for. Don't expect to see fantasy stuff in Monster though...

    The story revolves around Dr. Tenma, a neurosurgeon who (in refusal to his superior's orders) chose to save the life of a young boy whose parents have been murdered. Dr. Tenma, with his refusal to do what was ordered to him soon got demoted and lost a loved one. Later along the line, 3 doctors including his superior got murdered and Dr. Tenma became the prime suspect to the crime. In search of the real killer and to evade arrest, Tenma turned into a fugitive.

    Another title worth checking is the military drama, 'Zipang'. Kinda like the movie Final Countdown, Zipang's plot revolves around a modern day super-ship and its crew. While doing naval exercises, the 'Mirai' gets caught up in a mysterious storm which messes up their navigational equipment. Later on as the ship recovers, Mirai nearly clashes with the legendary battleship of Imperial Japan, the Yamato. Shocked by the very sight, the crew discovers that they have been transported back in time to the Battle of Midway during WWII. To avoid the alteration of history, the crew tries hard to avoid conflict.

    I have made a review about Zipang on another anime-related site that i'm unable to access nowadays (was auto logged-in, computer crashed, can't log back in because i couldn't remember the password) , i do not know if i'm allowed to mention another anime site here. You could search for it if you're interested to know more about the series...

    And oh, RahXephon is more of a 'second Reideen', not a 'second NGE'.

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