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goku wins since he needs to leave a city to fight someone because he's too stong.....super man on the other hand doesnt see the diffrence in power. Oh and goku can draw power from all over the universe superman only gets it fromt he sun another win for goku.
To be honest a lot of that doesn't matter though, Superman's described his time on this planet as living in a "world of cardboard," where he literally has to restrain himself from accidentally destroying anything he touches even if it's, like, a sneeze or something. More than once he's faced enemies that are near his level of toughness, and he's actually happy that he gets to stop holding back.
Goku, on the other hand, is very similar in concept but the "world of cardboard" aspect is never really brought up at all. His actual threshold for anything is relatively vague in normal human reckoning, all we get is that he's "strong." They never really touched upon HOW strong.
I should also point out that if it weren't for the rest of the Z Fighters, Goku wouldn't have won against a single enemy in DBZ. He's VERY much a team player, and requires allies to soften up or distract someone while he does something powerful. Superman's THE be-all-end-all of the DC Universe, and has taken more than his fair share of enemies solo. Of course there are enemies he can't take alone, that's why there's the Justice League, but most of the time that's more to do with multiple events happening at the same time as opposed to one strong enemy that's difficult to beat.
batman can beat superman, actually he might be the only one who could really beat superman
Super man is like a ballon in front of goku , goku lays a finger and superman will pop....
well honestly , i dont think we should even compare these two people with each other...
Last edited by Necro'lic Enigma; 01-28-2009 at 05:39 AM.
wish me luck for furture guys!!!!Thanks for everything!!!^___^
I too think that Goku would win maybe he won't be able to defeat superman when he hasn't turned to supersaiyan but as soon he does he would defeat him in a second(even in the first form).
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Look at this logically. When Raditz was measuring the power level of the farmer, it showed up as 5. Now, Superman is 1,000 times stronger than this because his home is 1,000 times bigger.(If you want proof, look for "The Science of Superman" documentary). But since Superman is so muscular, he would probably be between 8-10,000. Anyone who has watched DBZ will know that Gokus is far greater. I am not biased one way or another, I just want to show the evidence. This information would be useful for a computer simulation, but such a test would be irrelevent as the proof is here.
Yes, but what you AREN'T taking into account is, well, pretty much anything that makes Superman different from humans aside from "planet's bigger lol." Add that to the fact that Kryptonians on average while powerful are still not in Superman's league themselves and your argument is somewhat flawed.
The documentary you've offered as evidence is speculative, and since nobody actually knows the science behind scouters and their ability to calculate power level, you can't even begin to use your argument anyway.
Last edited by Sanosuke23; 02-01-2009 at 11:07 AM.
No disrespect intended but i think most of the people who posted on this thread and went the Goku way knows Goku greatly but only knows Supes barely.
When we talk about how powerful Goku is, where can we draw facts and references? The anime, manga, a couple of movies, a couple of video games...
When we talk about how powerful Supes is, where can we draw facts and references? TONS of comics, animated shows, a couple of movies, a couple of video games, more comics, and more comics...and when i say more and more comics, i do mean more and more power - this fact alone gives Supes a GREAT, and i mean GREAT advantage over Goku.
Goku is basically a martial guy, a fighter, a guy that can beat punch planets and destroy it in the process, a guy who saves worlds.
Superman is also a fighter, a guy that can bore holes into heavenly bodies, a farmer, an educated person, a citizen who contributes to society by having a job, a man of ideals, also a guy who saves worlds. This guy could beat Goku just by writing an article and get him deported back to space through sheer means of slander and propaganda.
And oh, back into those Kryptonite gloves... Sorry pal, unless this discussion gets too opinionated to the point that facts are neglected, acquiring Kryptonite gloves that works on Supes (Earth 1) is not really plausible. Even Bats' kryptonite shard has already been shattered by an eye beam from Superman (earth 2) in his visit to the batcave during the infinite crisis.
Kryptonites are rare, very rare. You could find lots of it in the multiverse, but those won't work on good old Supes.
Who says Supes can't do Instant Transmission? He can do it, it's just not called that way. Want an example? Okay so now let's go into Identity Crisis. See how he instantly transports in front of Ollie (green Arrow) when they were having an argument?...
You see Supes on the monitor in the first panel with Ollie in a debative gesture, and then you see Supes standing right in front of Ollie who is still on the same debative gesture in the panel that follows.
I won't go more onto the pound for pound related discussion. Because seriously that guy named Sanosuke23 have discussed and proved time and time again in this thread that Goku would lose against Supes in a pound for pound fight.
Y'know, I have a fairly good idea about how powerful Superman is cos I'm a big fan, I've read the comics(not all of them of course) seen the movies etc. I've been a fan of Superman longer than Goku and I, in fact, like Superman more. But the ability to accept that your favourite Superhero isn't the most powerful in existence will give a better understanding of the character. My favourite is Spiderman and its obvious he is not as powerful as either, but it doesn't matter. Power alone doesn't make a better Superhero. But you have to face the facts and when you do, you'll start looking at your hero in a much more personal way.
Last edited by Think Fact!; 02-02-2009 at 04:20 AM.
A good point think fact. Favoritism clouds facts.
I (in fact) don't even count Supes as one of my favorites. I'm more into Elongated Man, and Kaiketsu Zubat on the Japanese side of things.
Now if there's someone in DB who has a better chance in beating Superman than Goku, it's gotta be Buu (in any form).
Goku hands down, there is no way Superman could win against something like SS3 or SS4 Goku in any kind of fight. Even though both of them can fly but, Goku can use energy techniques that Superman could never even dream of using.
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However, when going with two beings meant to be the paragons of their given universes, the one whose had his powers escalated, retuned to not be overpowered, and escalated again over the course of almost 80 years now simply has more evidence and a longer track record of ridiculous crap he's done. Goku simply hasn't been fleshed out enough to GIVE a definite answer for him, and his universe isn't much more than a tarp with some trees and rocks drawn on it. That's the core problem with the argument FOR Goku. He's too vague a character.
I also mentioned in my first post on this subject that it depends heavily on WHICH Superman you use. The current one is actually starting to approach Silver Age Superman in power from what I've seen, much more than I originally thought. That being said, I'm revising my match-up list.
Golden Age Superman v. Normal Goku/Kaio-ken: Goku wins. Golden Age Superman is the weakest of them all, and isn't a whole hell of a lot stronger than a human.
Post-Crisis Superman v. SSj1 Goku: This is largely equal from what I can see. Goku doesn't have the strength to blow up a planet with a gesture, not even Freiza does at this point(he has to do some wacky unexplained something to the planet's core) and he's the strongest person in the series at this point. Superman still has strength on Goku(even Post-Crisis Superman was able to move planetoids under the right circumstances), but as I've mentioned before in a point-for-point sparring match Goku can beat Superman.
Post-Crisis Superman v. SSj2 Goku: SSj2 Goku pulls this one out. The same conditions as the previous fight are present, but Goku's got a boost in his speed and power so I can assume if they were about equal before then he'd be stronger now.
Current Superman v. SSj3 Goku: Superman would win this as a matter of attrition if not ability. SSj3, if you'll recall, drains the crap out of Goku. It's basically got a time limit imposed on it, and Superman in his current state is capable of soaking up lots of damage if need be and giving it in return. Goku'd probably kill himself trying to win.
Silver Age Superman v. SSj4 Goku: This basically comes down to one thing: Goku, as a character, was written with the possibility of failure. Silver Age Superman wasn't, unless it was something so minor as to be irrelevant or Superman was morally mistaken. However that's metagame thinking, so let's move away from that. You don't want "lol plot armor" as a defense. Superman was, for forty years, the most ridiculous mofo ever. They gave him a new superpower every goddamn week practically, and had escalated his power to the point where he would be able to survive ONE MILLION NUCLEAR EXPLOSIONS AT ONCE with a concussion, and that's POST-CRISIS SUPERMAN. Silver Age Superman didn't have to eat, drink, or breathe. The only things that could hurt him, THE ONLY THINGS, were Kryptonite and magic, and magic's in there ONLY BECAUSE HE NEVER BOTHERED TO LEARN IT. He didn't understand how magic worked, so his body never learned to resist it. WHAT THE HELL. Silver Age Superman is far too broken for ANYONE to beat, let alone SSj4. About the only people that CAN beat him are children, Jimmy Olsen and Lois Lane, and that's only when it's a "lol look Superman's wrong! Oh golly, he's got water ALL OVER HIM!" situation. It's not that Goku isn't some broken corporate money tree at this point himself, but Superman's just way out there in the "Let's just make him better than everyone" department.
There you have it. It has nothing to do with "favorites." Goku is just a poorly fleshed-out character that works fine in the capacity he was made for but can't be realistically compared to Superman who's had 80 years of explanations, characterization, and general feats of strength to draw from. Hell, my above guesses are just that, guesses, and particularly generous to Goku because he has so many unknowns.
All of this is incredibly stupid however, BECAUSE THEY WOULD NEVER FIGHT. EVEN if they were in the same universe, the nature of Superman's character would simply be to not fight Goku unless he was a threat. Goku would then proceed to annoy the crap out of him for the rest of his life, though they'd probably end up friends. You CAN'T separate that from the character for the sake of the fight, because it's a part of his personality and his mindset in a fight. Taking that away makes the fight inaccurate, and we're back to square one. Superman would simply say "You know what, you win. You're awesome. Whatever makes you feel better. Now if you'll excuse me, I have the avatar of a dark god attempting to take over the universe and it's up to me to beat the crap out of him. Have a nice day."
goku would just get some kriptonite and BAM! fights over
whatever doesnt kill you makes you stronger
men are from earth women are from earth deal with it
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