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Thread: The best Gundam pilot ever... comparison (spoiler warning)

  1. #26
    Junior Member Valonsire will become famous soon enough Valonsire's Avatar
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    damn

    Well setsuna and the Exia is cool. And ive never heard of Amaru or Kira, what Gundam series are they in?

  2. #27
    Senior Member B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam's Avatar
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    Amuro was the protagonist of the first Gundam series, he is a recurring character in the Universe he exists in (Universal Century timeline) and is a significant factor to the whole "History":

    Mobile Suit Gundam (00079 aka First Gundam):

    -Amuro pilots "The Gundam" (it is the first one after all)
    -Amuro/White Base Team Shifts the bloody stalemate of 8 months war to the Federation's favour, the Federation wins at the battle of a Baoa Quu
    -The Gundam becomes a symbol of hope and destruction, a significant factor. A "Gundam" is henceforth usually a significantly powerful unit compared to other ones, this remains true for most Gundam series, even those not in the Universal Century.


    Crossbone Gundam: Skull Heart (Umon's Flashback)

    -Umon Samon's achievement of defeating 6 Rick Doms at A Baoa Quu in nothing more than a disguised Ball unit remains unnoticed because Amuro's achievements overshone it.


    Char's Deleted Affair:

    -Federation units equipped with a cruddy dodge routine made to primitively copy Amuro's movements attack the Axis, while the Axis had superior numbers AND more experienced pilotes, their losses during the first half of battle were 3 times as great only because of the copied movements.


    Zeta Gundam:

    -Amuro is not the main protagonist, but appears as member of Qaraba which fights the fachist titans organisation on Earth.
    -In his appearances he repels an all new enemy MS with nothing more than an unarmed aircraft and aides the Storm of Kilimajaro, allowing Quattro to make his speech exposing the Titans evil ways.


    Char's Counterattack/Hi Streamer:

    -Amuro's rank is a Lieutenant Commander, considering that he served under people who fear him as newtype and treated him like a prisoner/dangerous subject during the Gryps conflict, thats an extremely high rank (In comparison, his rival Char Aznable is Supreme Commander at that time)
    -A complete Neo Zeon combat fleet instantly retreated for the sole purpose of his arrival on the battlefield, a VERY smart move.
    -In his last moments, Amuro not only saves Earth but also shows the World the light of hope before he dies.

    Gundam F90:

    -Amuro Ray's combat data is copied on an assisting AI, the "A.R. (Amuro Ray) Chip" and implemented into the new Gundam F90.
    -Bosch's reason for defecting was that he saw Amuro's power at the Axis and wanted to possess the power of the Gundam (though a Gundam is only a weapon with symbolic meaning due to its achievements and meaning in war)


    Crossbone Gundam: Skull Heart

    -Tobia Arronaux, the protagonist along with 3 of the best pilot of Crossbone Vanguard (assuming they are because they are the only survivors) fought against a unit with an AI mimicing Amuro in the 1st Gundam, all of Tobia's wingmen were destroyed, they survived only because Amuro's Newtype spirit prevented the cockpits from being destroyed.


    Super Robot Taisen:

    -In SRW F/F Final, it is possible to make Shinji Ikari HAVE SPINE/GUTS by repeatedly launching him with Amuro, Amuro's similiar history and situation (caught in action without choosing to be hero, bad/tragic relation to parents, hard childhood) inspires Shinji and creates an alternate story for Neon Genesis Evangelion where Shinji does NOT emo out during the end and accepts his role as protagonist.
    -Turn A characters state that the names Amuro Ray and Char Aznable are deeply engraved in Black History, although various other Gundam protagonists are also around, no such thing is mentioned about them.


    Mobile Suit vs Giant God/Counterattack of Gigantis:

    -Amuro and Char manage keep the "Giant God Gigantis", which is nothing else than Ideon (A Super Robot capable of destroying galaxies, time and space) at bay.


    Fun Fact:

    -Amuro is the inventor of Haros, in SRW, he once threatens to sue Athrun from Gundam SEED for producing Haros, makes you wonder if he will comment on the ones in Gundam 00...


    Kira Yamato is the Protagonist of Gundam SEED, which was popular recently (it was the newest as Gundam 00 didn't exist yet), it plays in the Cosmic Era universe. Kira Yamato is a Super Coordinator, Coordinators are genetically altered humans which enhanced learning and physical traits, making them allround geniuses, they are meant to "coordinate" mankind's evolution (in the Universal Century, Newtypes such as Amuro *are* the evolution of mankind)
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  3. #28
    Junior Member Valonsire will become famous soon enough Valonsire's Avatar
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    Holy **** I didnt know there were so many. I only thought there was G gundam, Gundam Seed, Gundam Wing, and Gundam 00

  4. #29
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    Damn man..... You truly are the best fan of Gundam. Hands down. You also made me see that Amuro is better than Heero in many ways... However. i'm still biased to heero seeing as Gundam Wing was the first Gundam show I had ever watched.

  5. #30
    Senior Member B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valonsire View Post
    Holy **** I didnt know there were so many. I only thought there was G gundam, Gundam Seed, Gundam Wing, and Gundam 00
    Btw, how come you watched Gundam SEED and said you don't know Kira Yamato? o_O

    The series you know are mainly AUs (Alternate Universes), those you never heard of are mainly of the Universal Century, which is the 1st/Main Universe and also the largest.

    The Universal Century's Series and Movies consist of (written in Chronological order of the Story, NOT production order or order you should watch):

    -Movies are marked with (M)
    -UKTIMATELY Recommended ones for watching are marked with (R)
    -Amuro/Char Saga series are automatically Recommended and are marked with (*)


    MS IgLOO Series
    The take place before and during the 1st Gundam in different places, they are all done fully in 3D, it is recommended to watch them after seeing the Original. MS IgLOO 2 is only chronologically before Apocalypse 0079 because it is during the Zeon Earth Invasion.

    MS IgLOO: The Hidden One Year War (R)
    MS IgLOO 2: Gravity of the Warfront (In Production)
    MS IgLOO: Apocalypse 0079 (R)


    Mobile Suit Gundam (0079)
    0079 was the Year Amuro first boarded the Gundam and it was also the year the One Year War mainly took place in, the graphics are outdated for todays standards, but it is treated as a significant factor of Anime History, becoming the foundation of the "Real Robot Anime". The 3 Movies are a compilation of the series.

    Mobile Suit Gundam (*)
    Mobile suit Gundam (M)(*)
    Mobile Suit Gundam II: Soldiers of Sorrow (M)(*)
    Mobile Suit Gundam III: Encounters in Space (M)(*)


    Mobile Suit Gundam: The 8th MS team
    This series runs in a parallel time to the original, it is one of the best Gundam series out there. If Shakespeare were the Inventor of Gundam, this would be Romeo & Juliet. Last Resort is a sort of an epilogue revealing the Fate of the Protagonists, Miller's Report is a recap of the happenings from an Investigator who judges the actions of the protagonist.

    The 8th MS Team (R)
    The 8th MS Team: Last Resort (M)
    The 8th MS Team: Miller's report (M)


    Gundam 0080: War in the Pocket
    A Sidestory that, just like 8th MS Team, rather impresses with Storyline than with Awesome Mecha. It is very sad, saying any more would be spoiler.

    0080: War in the Pocket


    Mobile Suit Z Gundam
    This is the Actual Sequel to the original Mobile Suit Gundam, the protagonists of the 1st series are still around as Cameos or even significant support roles. This is also one of the top notch examples of a Genius Gundam Series. The movies are once again a compilation, but with partially strongly renewed graphics giving the awesome plot of Zeta the awesome look it deserves.

    Z Gundam (*)
    Z Gundam, A New Translation: Heirs to the Stars (M)(*)
    Z Gundam, A New Translation II: Lovers (M)(*)
    Z gundam, A New Translation III: Love is the Pulse of the Stars (M)(*)


    Mobile Suit ZZ Gundam
    Somewhat a Sequel to Z Gundam, Though it doesn't connect to the next series of the continuation all too much. But the protagonist of Z plays a support role.

    ZZ Gundam


    Mobile Suit Gundam: Char's Counterattack
    After taking a long break and leaving the stage to others, Amuro, the original hero of Gundam returns as Main character to save the day once more. This movie is PURE GENIUS, it marks the actual end of the Amuro/Char Saga (though their influence of the timeline is long not gone after this).

    Mobile Suit Gundam: Char's Counteratttack (M)(*)


    Mobile Suit Gundam F91
    After years of peace brought by Amuro's Sacrifice at the Axis, a new threat stirs up and it is up to a new hero to resolve it. As the Amuro/Char saga ended already, this movie doesn't painfully try to rip it off awkwardly but starts something own.

    Gundam F91 (M)(R)


    Mobile Suit Victory Gundam
    This series was produced directly after Char's Counterattack, having the bad side-effect of people who were spoilt by its awesomeness not being able to cope with the new plot and designs, but don't look down on this one either.

    Victory Gundam


    G Saviour
    This movie is Live Action, thats something fresh and new, but it was made by CANADIANs, that I blame the Canadians, but everything about this except the Gundam in it has so nothing in common with Gundam, the Director (who, not being japanese, apparantly didn't know much about Gundam) totally didn't understand ANYTHING that makes Gundam awesome and made this into a slacked-off Hollywood-ish Science Fiction potpourree of FAIL. The plot is fail, the actors are fail, the designs are fail and pretty much everything else in this as well. It is so fail that even a lot of official sources don't feature it in the UC timeline making the story canon doubtful.... fortunately.

    G-Saviour (M)


    Damn man..... You truly are the best fan of Gundam. Hands down. You also made me see that Amuro is better than Heero in many ways... However. i'm still biased to heero seeing as Gundam Wing was the first Gundam show I had ever watched.
    Well he also has his own awesomeness to some extent, and I'm not here to force you out of personal preference. And as since I'm accustomed with the W universe as well I also got treats for fans of it. Bonus pic => You get.



    On the image you see:
    -Wing Gundam Seraphim (4 Wings, the 2 extra ones correct a stabilisation flaw of the original Wing Zero)
    -Tien Lung Gundam (Can control Mobile Dolls to counteract its lack of ranged attacks)
    -Gundam Derringer Arms (as you could guess, it just has more firepower)
    Last edited by B Gundam; 06-29-2008 at 02:11 PM.
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    Some things are timeless. In a literal sense.

  6. #31
    Senior Member B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam's Avatar
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    And Valonsire gets intros for the Universal Century Timeline:

    Mobile Suit Gundam (aka 0079, 1st Gundam, clips from Gihren's Greed):
    +
    ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.


    MS IgLOO (The Hidden One Year War/Apocalypse 0079):
    +
    ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.


    MS IgLOO 2: Gravity Battlefront/Gravity of the Warfront/whatever (In Production)
    +
    ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.


    The 8th MS Team:
    +
    ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.


    0080 - War in the Pocket:
    +
    ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.


    0083 - Stardust Memories:
    +
    ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.


    Z Gundam (Clips from the Movie):
    +
    ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.


    ZZ Gundam:
    +
    ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.


    Char's Counterattack:
    +
    ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.


    Gundam Unicorn (NOT a series):
    +
    ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.


    Gundam F91:
    +
    ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.


    Victory Gundam:
    +
    ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.
    Last edited by B Gundam; 06-29-2008 at 02:33 PM.
    Life is like Gundam ZZ, anime ja nai!
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    Some things are timeless. In a literal sense.

  7. #32
    Senior Member Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth's Avatar
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    The best gundam pilot period, is any pilot who is not in a gundam or a newtype or not protected by plot armor that manages to make a difference.
    Oh. Wait. There are none. = (

    People.

    Plot Armor does not equal Good.
    Pretty much -every single main character- in the Gundam Universe happens to be equipped with 1000 meter thick plot armor. No matter how crappy of a pilot they are, slap them in a gundam or give them "luck".. Hurrgh.


    Also, SRT is a crossover where they sit around and create wacky combination plots, not exactly good evidence.


    WARNING





    POSTS BY NINETEENTH CONTAIN OFFENSIVE, DISPICIBLE, AND ABSURD CONTENT THAT IS TOO CONTROVERSIAL AND TOO AWESOME FOR ACTUAL MESSAGEBOARDS. KEEP NINETEENTH OUT OF THE REACH OF CHILDREN. PROLONGED EXPOSURE TO NINETEENTH MAY CAUSE CANCER
    HEY LOOK I FINALLY UPDATED THIS AFTER 5 YEARS. DO NOT ASK ABOUT MY REP. YOU WERE NOT HERE WHEN DID THAT AND IT'S A LONG STORY.
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  8. #33
    Senior Member B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam's Avatar
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    First, it is comparing Amuro to other Gundam Pilots, not a platform for you to complain about plot armor.

    Second, this is the wrong series to discuss about plot armor, Tomino is the person who removed it all along causing a good deal of relationships to end with someone dying, the whole shrike team getting killed, etc. a lot of Gundam Protagonists other than Amuro/Char who made a large difference died:

    Yuu Kajima (Main Character)
    Lalah Sune (Beloved one of a Main Character)
    Four Murasame (same as above)
    Hathaway Noah (Main Character)
    Every member of Shrike Team (including insignificant ways of death)
    Chen Agi (Beloved one of main character)
    Lots of awesome wingmen (Apolly/Roberto/Phillipe/Samana/Bilbeet/etc.)
    Garma Zabi (though he doesn't count, think of his situation, he would have gotten a happy end like in a fairy tale but dies instead)
    Puru and her clone (both relations with a Main Character)

    Plot armor only occures if the character survives under unexplanable circumstances or ridiculous circumstances, Amuro in 0079 had gundarium as plot armor (though technically it isn't one because it is explicitely STATED to hold a lot of damage, and was never directly hit by a strong beam aside of the Zeongs towards the end), after that its not present, the dodging behaviour of Newtypes are stated by their predictive powers and enhanced reflexes. Amuro never returned after a huge laser beam disintigrating his complete unit in space while losing his helmet.

    As for Amuro not getting hit, it is NOT luck, even a primitive copy of his most basic dodge routines caused a heavily outnumbered Federation Force (fodder has no plot armor under any circumstances) to become a major threat for experienced aces:





    Last edited by B Gundam; 06-29-2008 at 05:00 PM.
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  9. #34
    Senior Member Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by B Gundam View Post
    First, it is comparing Amuro to other Gundam Pilots......
    Second, this is the wrong series to discuss about plot armor, Tomino is the person who removed it all along causing a good deal of relationships to end with someone dying, the whole shrike team getting killed, etc. a lot of Gundam Protagonists other than Amuro/Char who made a large difference died:

    Yuu Kajima (Main Character)
    Lalah Sune (Beloved one of a Main Character)
    Four Murasame (same as above)
    Hathaway Noah (Main Character)
    Every member of Shrike Team (including insignificant ways of death)
    Chen Agi (Beloved one of main character)
    Lots of awesome wingmen (Apolly/Roberto/Phillipe/Samana/Bilbeet/etc.)
    Garma Zabi (though he doesn't count, think of his situation, he would have gotten a happy end like in a fairy tale but dies instead)
    Puru and her clone (both relations with a Main Character)


    As for Amuro not getting hit, it is NOT luck, even a primitive copy of his most basic dodge routines caused a heavily outnumbered Federation Force (fodder has no plot armor under any circumstances) to become a major threat for experienced aces:
    Tomino added plot armor to Gundam because he learned he could make money off of it. Originally, Amuro died like he should have died. Shot by one of Char's Wingmen. Not even char himself, just a guy doing his job. But then people liked it and a nice shiny beam coat was added.



    Things to know about plot armor.

    1. Plot Armor works up until it's favorable to kill off a character.

    2. Plot Armor does work in reverse. Killing off a favorite character to prove
    a point; Things just got real, no more playing around, etc etc etc. Keeping a hated villian alive to continue the story arc, a character is introduced just to be killed almost as quickly and the rest of the main characters are shocked and forced into woe, etc.

    3. Plot Armor cannot be removed period, it can wear off though. Think of it as a Magic Carton of Milk. That milk will -never- go bad. No matter what kind of punishment you inflict on it. Sunlight, water, acid, gasoline, anything you can think of. But the moment it's expriation date arrives. It turns black and becomes worthless.



    4. If you have a known name. You're not fodder.

    5. Not all plot armor is " HEY I JUST GOT VAPORIZED 2 EPISODES AGO AND I'M BACK COMPLETE WITH PSYCHIC POWERS" or James Bond, "I'mma gonna walk through a sea of bullets and kill you with a whet stone." Plot Armor can be either small or huge, or in the case of Gundam, integrated directly into the storyline to reduce the accuasations ( but never do work in the end) of plot armor.( Newtype/Gundanium Alloy/Dolls/Luck/Destiny/ Etc.)

    Every character listed who got killed, were plot armored up until their deaths. PA'Ed Character Suicides are either exactly that or Suicide Shields/Heroic Death!!!! . Suicidal Character dies in the place of another PA'ed character and paves the way for either sadness, revenge or irony.

    Yuu Kajima (Main Character) Prime Example of Plot Armor Expiration Date.
    Unkillable, up until the final dramatic moment.

    Lalah Sune (Beloved one of a Main Character)
    Suicide Shield. Far more useful dead as well.

    Four Murasame (same as above)
    Unkillable, Suicide Shields.

    Hathaway Noah (Main Character)
    Plot armor in his eariler exploits.
    Expired armor in his latter ones.

    Every member of Shrike Team (including insignificant ways of death)
    Lol.

    Chen Agi (Beloved one of main character)
    Girlfriend =/= Beloved. Also, did not fight back so it counts as a suicide.

    Lots of awesome wingmen (Apolly/Roberto/Phillipe/Samana/Bilbeet/etc.)
    You said it yourself, Wingmen.
    Excellent plot armor against other lesser wingmen, but when it comes to killing them off for dramatic effect. They work wonders for sadness and inducing RAGE AND REVENGE story arcs.


    Garma Zabi (though he doesn't count, think of his situation, he would have gotten a happy end like in a fairy tale but dies instead)
    Sucides/Kamakize Runs, always for dramatic effect. For what followed, actually lead to a rage and revenge story arc.

    Puru and her clone (both relations with a Main Character):
    Clone and Clone Suicide. Nothing too cry over.

    Gundam is littered with all kinds of trops and idoms ranging from Plot Armor and Unobtainum, more or less feels like D&D with robots and one lazy GM. Rock on Tomino.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Nineteenth View Post
    Tomino added plot armor to Gundam because he learned he could make money off of it. Originally, Amuro died like he should have died. Shot by one of Char's Wingmen. Not even char himself, just a guy doing his job. But then people liked it and a nice shiny beam coat was added.
    Nu Gundam has no beam coat, he just didn't get hit.


    Things to know about plot armor.

    1. Plot Armor works up until it's favorable to kill off a character.

    2. Plot Armor does work in reverse. Killing off a favorite character to prove
    a point; Things just got real, no more playing around, etc etc etc. Keeping a hated villian alive to continue the story arc, a character is introduced just to be killed almost as quickly and the rest of the main characters are shocked and forced into woe, etc.
    as for "rest of the main characters", Yuu Kajima and Hathaway Noah are the Major main characters of their stories as in total protagonist.

    4. If you have a known name. You're not fodder.
    First this only proves my point right, the feddie guys have no known name, but survive against major aces with dodge movements copied from Amuro.

    Second, people with known name in Gundam CAN be fodder, a great deal of Amuro's kills are firstly introduced, and I don't mean the major people, even the Zaku pilots. Char Aznable for example lost the following people just by fighting the Gundam until Atmospheric entry:

    Ash
    Jeen
    Denim
    Slender
    Crown
    Kom
    Jeique
    Gadem (Technically not "his" person, but an old friend)
    Some people I forgot but were mentioned

    3. Plot Armor cannot be removed period, it can wear off though. Think of it as a Magic Carton of Milk. That milk will -never- go bad. No matter what kind of punishment you inflict on it. Sunlight, water, acid, gasoline, anything you can think of. But the moment it's expriation date arrives. It turns black and becomes worthless.

    5. Not all plot armor is " HEY I JUST GOT VAPORIZED 2 EPISODES AGO AND I'M BACK COMPLETE WITH PSYCHIC POWERS" or James Bond, "I'mma gonna walk through a sea of bullets and kill you with a whet stone." Plot Armor can be either small or huge, or in the case of Gundam, integrated directly into the storyline to reduce the accuasations ( but never do work in the end) of plot armor.( Newtype/Gundanium Alloy/Dolls/Luck/Destiny/ Etc.).
    However, you can't just declare everything thats alive as "plot armor", of course the story should go on with certain people, but they can also survive by skill or luck. Its not like we have plot armor just because we didn't get hit by a car yet after crossing the streets so many times. Plot armor integrated directly in the story line is only plot armor if it suddenly stops working, for example if Wingzero can survive a giant IMMA FIRIN TEH LAZORZ moment because of its awesome armor and then gets ripped to shreds by simple gunfire later on, or that Strike Rouge has been continuously deflecting attacks but snapped like a twig in around the end. Amuro however, simply didn't get hit by anthing big except for a main cannon of the Zeong, and what happened? BAM, head off. If he would have taken a similiarly powerful attack unharmed earlier on, THEN it would be plot armor, otherwise its simply armor.

    Every character listed who got killed, were plot armored up until their deaths. PA'Ed Character Suicides are either exactly that or Suicide Shields/Heroic Death!!!! . Suicidal Character dies in the place of another PA'ed character and paves the way for either sadness, revenge or irony.
    As mentioned, a lot of them die insiginificantly. You see shrikes sortie, fighting takes place, they return and you suddenly count a few less.

    Yuu Kajima (Main Character) Prime Example of Plot Armor Expiration Date.
    Unkillable, up until the final dramatic moment.
    Didn't get hit until then => plausible

    Lalah Sune (Beloved one of a Main Character)
    Suicide Shield. Far more useful dead as well.

    Four Murasame (same as above)
    Unkillable, Suicide Shields.
    You rather want a living suicide shield?

    Hathaway Noah (Main Character)
    Plot armor in his eariler exploits.
    Expired armor in his latter ones.
    Which early exploits? He never was all too involved in combat in CCA and is simply executed in Hathaway's Flash.

    Chen Agi (Beloved one of main character)
    Girlfriend =/= Beloved. Also, did not fight back so it counts as a suicide.
    Not fighting back is not equal to suicide, besides, if you don't love someone you're dating and kissing, wth are you doing that for?

    Lots of awesome wingmen (Apolly/Roberto/Phillipe/Samana/Bilbeet/etc.)
    You said it yourself, Wingmen.
    Excellent plot armor against other lesser wingmen, but when it comes to killing them off for dramatic effect. They work wonders for sadness and inducing RAGE AND REVENGE story arcs.
    Then your theory holds no water, noone ever cared to go RAGE AND REVENGE because of any of them except maybe Bilbeet.

    Garma Zabi (though he doesn't count, think of his situation, he would have gotten a happy end like in a fairy tale but dies instead)
    Sucides/Kamakize Runs, always for dramatic effect. For what followed, actually lead to a rage and revenge story arc.

    Puru and her clone (both relations with a Main Character):
    Clone and Clone Suicide. Nothing too cry over.
    But they died, no plot armor, end.

    Gundam is littered with all kinds of trops and idoms ranging from Plot Armor and Unobtainum, more or less feels like D&D with robots and one lazy GM. Rock on Tomino.
    No, its littered with Dom Tropen, according to you, a story should have no survivors, or no danger, then it would be good. Because everything that lives through a battle has imba plot armor.

    Also, SRT is a crossover where they sit around and create wacky combination plots, not exactly good evidence.
    En contraire, it is good evidence BECAUSE of that, as usually the pilots never would meet, in SRT they can and can be compared by stats and/or directly fight eachother.



    Plot Armor counts as occuring when:

    1. Characters survive something that they evidently shouldn't (machine disintegrated).

    This never happends to Amuro.

    2. The Character is unexplicably lucky and goes through very dangerous situations where others most likely die. (War)

    This is true for Amuro, but is rather explained by skill than luck. He actively dodged fusilades and does it planned, not randomly jumping around hoping nothing hits (Kayra Su method). As shown, even fodder survives very well if his dodge routines are applied on them. Newtype are always exempt from this rule as long as they actively dodge. It is also explicitely stated that his skill will meet its limits if a suffiscient amount of skilled Newtypes attack him simultaniously. If Roger Federer plays a tennis match and wins, it was skill, not because he's the protagonist.

    3. The Character is able to shield off something under explained circumstances, but the explanation fails under similiar circumstances later (Gundanium armor)

    Also never applies to him.

    4. The Character has something ridiculous magically blocking anything lethal unexpectedly (Hollow Mask returning).

    This is true for Amuro in Beltorchicka's children, he also survives there, but thats non-canonical.

    5. The Character seemingly dies, but returns with a giddy explanation (I caught a ledge when I was falling off that building/pillow pile below), or completely unexplained.

    This wouldn't even be true for Amuro if he returns after the Axis, because its totally unclear how he'd die like that to begin with, but its just stated that he died so you don't even need to explain it. This did however, hold true for Char who was in an exploding debris with a damaged Hyaku Shiki. Both arms and legs were destroyed, the torso somehow survived.
    Last edited by B Gundam; 06-30-2008 at 05:47 AM.
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  11. #36
    Senior Member Banana OG has a reputation beyond repute Banana OG has a reputation beyond repute Banana OG has a reputation beyond repute Banana OG has a reputation beyond repute Banana OG has a reputation beyond repute Banana OG has a reputation beyond repute Banana OG has a reputation beyond repute Banana OG has a reputation beyond repute Banana OG has a reputation beyond repute Banana OG has a reputation beyond repute Banana OG has a reputation beyond repute Banana OG's Avatar
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    (I'm on either side) Just throwing it out there.... A good example of the "Plot armor" is the ZGMF-X10A Freedom in SEED DESTINY.... It was near untaouchable up until Shinn Asuka appeared out of know where with a sword in the their battle. This sword defied the logistics of the Freedom's armor.... The tip of that sword Was a physical object, which the PS Armor of the Freedom would stop. And as for the other part of the sword being a beam..... Freedom's shield has an Anti-beam coating on it.... So.... even if the tip of that blade were part beam, it wouldn't have gotten through the shield in the first place.... And if the main beam part of the balde was what penatrated the Shield, would the physical tip of the blade be stopped by PS armor?

    And Also, B Gundam.... That little comic you posted... Are there Alternate Universes for Gundam Wing? =\
    Last edited by Banana OG; 06-30-2008 at 11:31 AM.

  12. #37
    Senior Member Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth's Avatar
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    By Beam Coat, I ment they kept him alive.
    Also, I was not referring to Nu Gundam. ( I have to post that comic of Devil Satan 6 telling Amuro where to stick his funnels.) I was referring to the original Gundam. You know, the original one where he just happened to find and used to defeat countless enemies because of his juggernaut mobile suit without skill? That one.

    Also, Super Robot Wars is FAR from Canonical.
    The spoiler tag regards SRW and it's use outside of SRW topics. Which this forum needs more of, dear God. Any thread about it gets buried under "How deep Evangelion is" or "how great gundam *" is.

     

    I love the game personally, but it does no justice to any one franchise. Dunbine( under powered) , Zeroymer ( overpowered and worthless at the same time. Hi strongest attack in the game with lowest move rate period.) , Dendoh ( great when you don't have Daimos.. What am I saying? You ALWAYS have Daimos.) ,Ideon ( Bastard isn't even funny anymore. ) L-Gaim ( Same boat as Zeroymer) , Nadesisco ( Underpowered and overpowered at the same time) and Gundam ( the biggest mixed bag of them all) , all -cannot- possibly exist in the same universe for each of them to be measured fairly. The amount of Unobtainum and Toxic Nonsensium that they all run on is TRUELY mind boggling and deserves it's own thread. Also, dunbine does not run on pixie dust. The last time I talked about dunbine on my mech forum, someone said pixie dust.

    If the moon is one of the few sources of Gundanium in SRW, how is that almost every evil leader located in space,is NOT BUILDING THEIR GIANT ROBOTS OUT OF IT?! Also, 9 kinds of ultra rare materials found in Mt. Fuji?
    Add up all the negative side effects of each and every robot in SRT and you'll wonder why the planet hasn't exploded from all of them being in the same place at once.



    It's also a moot point when you consider that most of the pilots -never- fight each other unless they're on the opposing teams. Char/Quatto has not been an enemy since 3, and those guys from Dragonar and Machine Robo aren't exactly made from Gundam Alloy but they can apparently shrug off nuclear explosions from a N2 Mine.. Hell, three of them are damned TRANSFORMERS/GOBOTS.
    It's flip-flopping finanaced fanfiction. Using it as evidence is laughable outside of any VS threads and SRW threads.

    Now if you wanted to use a game, use Another Century's Episode. No super robots, excluding Getter Robo which is Hybrid. Gauge them from that game, please. You'll avoid all the "lol.. What?" headaces.



    The greatest pilot in Gundam.Period is Miss Noin.
    Never had a gundam, nor wanted one.
    Faced gundams in battle. Weakest plot armor in the Gundam Wing Series, next to those sand dudes Quatre worked with. ( I personally feel she should have had her own spin -off dealing with the tratiors and her own missions, etc. ) she could have died at any point and nothing would be affected. Except for "getting a three rank promotion".
    Although, in terms of PA nothing can beat Heero's self destruct and head dive in Wing.
    She was an known underpreformer ( referrecened several times) and teacher , also a pacifist.
    Defeated Mobile Dolls, those annoying things that pretty much raped everything in space( from grunts to tactical commanders) that was not a gundam.. Without a gundam.

    If you want to bring SRW into it. She remains useful far after you get Domon and Amuro. You get her EARLY on in chapter 2 , with excellent skills, beats chapter 10 / chapter 7 / 9 and 15 for the wing , Z, ZZ and Char's Counter Attack Pilots.

    Second Greatest Noah.
    He punches people and tells people what to do.
    What else could you possibly want?
    Also. Has a dedicated strip to punching out kira. +10000000 points in my book.




    He's also a pretty cool guy. Executes his son and is'nt afraid of anything.
    Also, without him in SRW. It would'nt be SRW.

    Anyway.

    I will say it again. Plot armor will expire.
    Just because a character dies, does not mean they never had the armor to begin with.It's what kept them alive, in a warzone, where thousands upon thousands are dying in seconds from even getting their paint job scratched, just to die at a later time in a less amazing , but story progressing fashion.



    When you don't fight back, you're giving up. When you give up in a situation, you intentionally lose. When that situation is intentionally losing your life, it's a suicide. See suicide by cop.

    Gundam is filled with God Mode Characters.
    Bullets bounce off them and into lesser characters.
    Most of them start with little to no training at all, killing off seasoned vets with ease and you don't see the problem with that at all?

    From Amuro ranging to Kira, various pilots have managed to pull it off.
    It's painfully obvious, which is why I tend to dislike them. It turns a rather entertaining story from interesting to "Roy Fokker, 200000 Kills, Never Lost a Plane, Dies From Food Poisoning."

    That the villians only die when it's convient? Or that the heroes only die when it's conviently sad or if they need a reason to fight harder?

    Normally Fodder typically don't have names, but in few cases where it's used as a plot device they're given. Example? I won't go all out. I'm doing something else right now. Take Gundam Wing. Treize was reading off a list of fodder characters in order to bolster his appearance as a person of compassion. Decent writing admist the sea of cheese, it happens.

    Also, you're comparing plot armor to real life. Walk out into the street, without looking, at night, on a freeway, blindfolded. See if you don't get hit. If you don't. Do it again. If you live. Do it again. When you do die, your luck has run out.
    Keyword, luck. Maybe you picked a time at random when there were very few drivers? Maybe the driver swerved and avoided you, or went around you? Who knows? But these things can be avoided by using realism. You're not going to do that. I am not going to do that. Little Billy might fall in the well every week and not break anything or drown, but he's not going to do that.


    Point is, you're trying to prove who's right and who's wrong. And you're taking this faaaaaarrrrr too seriously.

    You will never be right no matter how much proof you provide.
    I will never be right no matter how much proof I provide.
    The only person who will -ever- be right in this discussion is Tomino and I think he's busy counting something, so I can "guess" the best gundam pilot ever would belong to the franchise that made him the most money in the long run. Aside from that, it's all just our opinions in the end.


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  13. #38
    Senior Member B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nineteenth View Post
    By Beam Coat, I ment they kept him alive.
    Also, I was not referring to Nu Gundam. ( I have to post that comic of Devil Satan 6 telling Amuro where to stick his funnels.) I was referring to the original Gundam. You know, the original one where he just happened to find and used to defeat countless enemies because of his juggernaut mobile suit without skill? That one.
    Without skill only applies to:

    Char (newb Amuro vs Char)
    Jeen (Jeen shot the Gundam first and Amuro literally had no skill yet)
    Crown (atmospheric entry)
    Gadem (Zaku I)
    Ramba Rall (NOT REALLY, but his machine was the turning point of the battle)

    The Gundam didn't stand there, take endless beatings like a super robot and then come up with the super-power-ranjuru-finisher, even in the battle against Rall where it is stated that he only wins because his machine is better (confirmed by the fact that Rall wins when using a Dom in Gihren no Yabou) he used technique to face Rall for the 2nd half.

    Also, Super Robot Wars is FAR from Canonical.
    The spoiler tag regards SRW and it's use outside of SRW topics. Which this forum needs more of, dear God. Any thread about it gets buried under "How deep Evangelion is" or "how great gundam *" is.

    *Insert long spoiler here*
    Who the heck cares if its story is canonical? Who the heck cares if you have a problem with game balancing? It has Gundam pilots meeting eachother from different universes so you can compare. Thats better than nothing happening. Besides, we're not comparing the power of machines and we're not comparing something from Getter Robo with something from Macross, its just about Gundam pilots like the topic says.

    More SRT/ACE rants that have nothing to do with what we're talking about

    I bet you often try to put yourself above everything by ranting about stuff, let me guess, all heroes are self rightious, everything near protagonist sucks because of plot armor etc. etc., this topic was never about plot armor and SRT was only mentioned on the sidelines and you just butt in as if the term plot armor was first discovered by you just to create a controversy.

    The greatest pilot in Gundam.Period is Miss Noin.
    Never had a gundam, nor wanted one.
    Faced gundams in battle. Weakest plot armor in the Gundam Wing Series, next to those sand dudes Quatre worked with. ( I personally feel she should have had her own spin -off dealing with the tratiors and her own missions, etc. ) she could have died at any point and nothing would be affected. Except for "getting a three rank promotion".
    Although, in terms of PA nothing can beat Heero's self destruct and head dive in Wing.
    She was an known underpreformer ( referrecened several times) and teacher , also a pacifist.
    Defeated Mobile Dolls, those annoying things that pretty much raped everything in space( from grunts to tactical commanders) that was not a gundam.. Without a gundam.
    If you prefer her by personal opinion its none of my business to change that and none of your business to force that opinion onto everyone. But ranting about plot armor and then preferring a wedge type, smaaaaart. Not that I'd have the right to dictate wether you should like Noin but people like Lydo Wolf and Matt Piria did it better all along.

    Second Greatest Noah.
    Noah is also awesome, wake me when your done with the profiling yourself part.

    *insert more plot armor rant*
    If you have a problem with plot armor happening, thats not my problem, if you really have some sort of obligation to put down anything you come along to with something thats obviously there anyways, tough luck for you, this isn't the plot armor rant topic, go make one in the general thread or maybe a how-balancing-failed-in-SRT-thread or how-GGeneration-always-has-an-abusable-part-making-the-game-too-easy-thread.

    When you don't fight back, you're giving up. When you give up in a situation, you intentionally lose. When that situation is intentionally losing your life, it's a suicide. See suicide by cop.
    Somebody didn't watch CCA.

    Gundam is filled with God Mode Characters.
    Bullets bounce off them and into lesser characters.
    Most of them start with little to no training at all, killing off seasoned vets with ease and you don't see the problem with that at all?
    The seasoned vets weren't Newtypes with exception of Char, who had to get along in a Zaku at first until Chalia Bull and then Lalah Sune come along. The only real vets were Gadem (in a Zaku I) Ramba Rall (would have won with a Dom or better) and maybe the Black Tri-Stars (Midea interfered), but Amuro's rapidly increasing skill and talent catches up symbolized by Char's repeatedly increasing powerful MS, at first his experience made up for the difference of the Gundam and a Zaku, but towards the end Amuro keeps up with the Zeong.

    From Amuro ranging to Kira, various pilots have managed to pull it off.
    It's painfully obvious, which is why I tend to dislike them. It turns a rather entertaining story from interesting to "Roy Fokker, 200000 Kills, Never Lost a Plane, Dies From Food Poisoning."
    Amuro's achievement is backed by the fact that other insignificant pilotes have achieved similiar kill counts in larger battles (except they weren't newbs). Take, lets say Auggs, survivng through the OYW in a Zaku cannon and scoring more kills than anyone else? Well it just happened, although he isn't a main character or something. Amuro has the federation's 2nd most kills in the OYW, #1 doesn't get his own story and is reserved for use in G Gens. Its not impossible to be an ace and being one doesn't automatically make you fail as character. If you have a problem with skilled pilots, tough luck for you.

    That the villians only die when it's convient? Or that the heroes only die when it's conviently sad or if they need a reason to fight harder?
    Wrong for UC:

    -Dom trio dies vs Yuu, Nimbus doesn't give a dam
    -Chen Agi dies, Amuro doesn't do anything towards avenging her
    -Lydo Wolf dies, period. Nothing happens
    -Flanagan Boone: "Its not like I'm out for revenge"
    -Rueben Karcs dies...

    Normally Fodder typically don't have names, but in few cases where it's used as a plot device they're given. Example? I won't go all out. I'm doing something else right now. Take Gundam Wing. Treize was reading off a list of fodder characters in order to bolster his appearance as a person of compassion. Decent writing admist the sea of cheese, it happens.
    Gundam Wing is a World's difference to other Gundam series. The rest is just mindless profile neurotic rant and doesn't counter the point in any way. I can't blame you for not seeing other posts with me saying treize is probably the only well done character in W in my opinion but that irrelevant. Hey, I can have profile neurotic moments too.

    Also, you're comparing plot armor to real life. Walk out into the street, without looking, at night, on a freeway, blindfolded. See if you don't get hit. If you don't. Do it again. If you live. Do it again. When you do die, your luck has run out.
    Keyword, luck. Maybe you picked a time at random when there were very few drivers? Maybe the driver swerved and avoided you, or went around you? Who knows? But these things can be avoided by using realism. You're not going to do that. I am not going to do that. Little Billy might fall in the well every week and not break anything or drown, but he's not going to do that.
    Just like Amuro won't just stand and get hit when he has the senses to avoid anything, its not even as vague as just the instincts of a veteran. A skilled Newtype on the battlefield is like a person crossing a normal road without anything that blocks sight and at full awareness, the only way for something to happen is a mass carambolage from all sides with no escape.

    Point is, you're trying to prove who's right and who's wrong. And you're taking this faaaaaarrrrr too seriously.
    You're right, I took it a bit too serious, because you're the type who just comes here to throw up some dust and then instantly retreat with comments on other people taking it serious despite taking part in the argument in the first place.

    You will never be right no matter how much proof you provide.
    I will never be right no matter how much proof I provide.
    The only person who will -ever- be right in this discussion is Tomino and I think he's busy counting something, so I can "guess" the best gundam pilot ever would belong to the franchise that made him the most money in the long run. Aside from that, it's all just our opinions in the end.
    Bingo, now its official, you did just come along to stir things up because if you had such a conclusion you don't go ranting at people in the first place. If it were just opinion, what is the point in ridiculing other people's conclusions? I don't even force anyone to like Amuro just as less as Lucion forces us all to worship Heero, this thread is just counting up their achievements in given information and forming a comparison out of it, but *someone* had to take factors beyond that too serious, like plot armor or money, as if someone would get disillusioned as soon as those words fall. All you wanted to do (or at least all you can really achieve) was to show everybody you know what plot armor is and maybe cause some sort of argument with me that you can retreat from with yet another classic way of chickening out, which is pretty much causing people to talk a lot saying nothing (Not that I would know but I get the feeling you have the 0 rep at +700 posts for a reason...). But fine, you had what you wanted, you had the chance to be cynical (though real cynists don't butt in just to show it) and profiled yourself as Bright and Noin fan and everyone's happy. To make things easier I'll just say plot armor exists in Gundam for who jolly cares about it and authors can use typical threatralic patterns, now we can get back to the topic unless you also have a knack for the last word.
    Last edited by B Gundam; 07-01-2008 at 07:06 AM.
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  14. #39
    Senior Member Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth is infamous around these parts Nineteenth's Avatar
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    Again, you missed the crucial point. This time, it's as simple as possible.

    You went out of your way. To state some of the amazingly obvious things about the show.

    A comparison thread with the ultimate winner being the show's creator's favorite character, IE the best character ever of the show.

    Then you opt out to ignore the other gundam series that don't feature him.
    "Gundam Wing is a World's difference to other Gundam series"
    But you yourself used it on the first page as a comparison, but when I use it. It's not proof.
    So is G-Gundam, but wait. That was ignored on the first page as well.


    Pretty much, on most mech forums "Best Gundam Pilot Ever" threads are the essence of trolling and are designed to incite flame wars. You -cannot- no matter how hard you try cross-compare and provide factual evidence ( each characters exploits in this case) that one is better than the other.

    Each show operates on it's own set of rules. There's no set standard across every "GUNDAM" . this is a GUNDAM thread that only mentions HALF of the gundam adventures

    Do you think the RX-79 can out maneuver the Deijih?
    Or that the Zeong can engage Burning Gundam in hand to hand combat?
    No. There's no established universe outside of MS Saga, SRW and ACE where it's possible and two out of the three are utterly broken and "dont count" because they're videogames.

    If I wanted to troll this thread , I would have simply replied with AMURO IS THE WORST PILOT EVER, SHINJI AND HEERO BOTH WIPE THE FLOOR WITH HIM.

    I came to this thread assuming it was going to be about -all- the gundam universes in general. No. It wasn't and I'm expressing my disbelief at the hypocrisy going on.

    Notice two more things.
    1. I never questioned who you picked.
    I questioned everything about him, still on topic.

    2. I kinda love how you take things you said, that I rebutted and say that -I- brought it up. Once again on the first page, you brought up the videogames. Then criticized me when I brought up the videogames.

    As I said before, don't use the tactical games, they're pure fantasy.
    Use A.C.E. or A.C.E 3, the only cross over that focuses only on Real Robots. Domon or Heero can close ground on Amuro far faster than Kira, who expends excessive amounts of energy but all 3 of them pale in comparison to Dunbine's ability to catch up.

    Hell, you brought up the BROKEN card game as proof. The first expansion was utterly cheap.


    Also, since you brought it up. I'm going to start calling you a newbie.Why?
    You weren't even PART of the forum when I stole from brit Queen of Wolves a countless number times to reduce my Rep to negative levels ( -20,000 rep for stealing from a chat admin. At one point, my rep was at -9999999999999999999999 the maximum.). Simply because I did not feel like participating in an utterly stupid system that newbies would use to judge each other and circle-rep themselves to popularity. The badge and point system we had back in 02-01 was nowhere near as bad as this.

    This thread is bad and you should feel bad about it and I should feel bad for actually assuming this wasn't a trolling thread.


    WARNING





    POSTS BY NINETEENTH CONTAIN OFFENSIVE, DISPICIBLE, AND ABSURD CONTENT THAT IS TOO CONTROVERSIAL AND TOO AWESOME FOR ACTUAL MESSAGEBOARDS. KEEP NINETEENTH OUT OF THE REACH OF CHILDREN. PROLONGED EXPOSURE TO NINETEENTH MAY CAUSE CANCER
    HEY LOOK I FINALLY UPDATED THIS AFTER 5 YEARS. DO NOT ASK ABOUT MY REP. YOU WERE NOT HERE WHEN DID THAT AND IT'S A LONG STORY.
    IF SWALLOWED CONTACT A MORTICIAN.



  15. #40
    Senior Member B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam has a reputation beyond repute B Gundam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nineteenth View Post
    Again, you missed the crucial point. This time, it's as simple as possible.

    You went out of your way. To state some of the amazingly obvious things about the show.

    A comparison thread with the ultimate winner being the show's creator's favorite character, IE the best character ever of the show.

    Then you opt out to ignore the other gundam series that don't feature him.
    "Gundam Wing is a World's difference to other Gundam series"
    That was quoted because you keep comparing the plot to Gundam Wing and seem to apply rules of Gundam Wing to all universes, it is a world of difference plotwise.

    But you yourself used it on the first page as a comparison, but when I use it. It's not proof.
    So is G-Gundam, but wait. That was ignored on the first page as well.
    Someone posted Domon and I didn't say anything against it, he's probably more powerful if you count what he does as piloting. Some would consider it while other wouldn't. Though its not written anywhere you can still deduct its among the classical piloting, otherwise Musha Gundam obviously gets lots of win.

    Pretty much, on most mech forums "Best Gundam Pilot Ever" threads are the essence of trolling and are designed to incite flame wars. You -cannot- no matter how hard you try cross-compare and provide factual evidence ( each characters exploits in this case) that one is better than the other.
    I just did. If you got a problem with the thread, don't post in the thread.

    Each show operates on it's own set of rules. There's no set standard across every "GUNDAM" . this is a GUNDAM thread that only mentions HALF of the gundam adventures
    Actually it only mentioned 3 pilotes in the 1st post, thats pretty much less than 1%. Sorry for not archiving everything about gundam in a single thread but I'm not everyone's archive slave so tough luck for you.

    Do you think the RX-79 can out maneuver the Deijih?
    Or that the Zeong can engage Burning Gundam in hand to hand combat?
    No. There's no established universe outside of MS Saga, SRW and ACE where it's possible and two out of the three are utterly broken and "dont count" because they're videogames.
    As mentioned, we're not comparing machines, only pilotes and that only among Gundam ones.

    If I wanted to troll this thread , I would have simply replied with AMURO IS THE WORST PILOT EVER, SHINJI AND HEERO BOTH WIPE THE FLOOR WITH HIM.
    No,you're not like that because its the ultimate primitive troll type that doesn't care about what others think of him, you're more the type who is concerned with the own ego and holds it clear by justifying disturbing deeds with wise-*ss comments and being vague and coarse in expression and, due to the nature of rather being concerned with proving oneself's knowledge rather than actually bringing a conclusion or reacting to what others say only understand half of what people answer and end up talking past them or ridiculing anyone's intellect with condescendant comments while doing so. For example somehow deducting I complained about you bringing up SRT or video games out of the blue, you either just misunderstood me, or coarsely removed the details to make it that way in your imagination.

    I came to this thread assuming it was going to be about -all- the gundam universes in general. No. It wasn't and I'm expressing my disbelief at the hypocrisy going on.
    As in just ranting about it, we had that already.

    Notice two more things.
    1. I never questioned who you picked.
    I questioned everything about him, still on topic.
    This is not the Amuro thread, even if it kinda looks it. You are questioning him beyond the borders of the happenings and his actions, that is, including things like plot armor.

    2. I kinda love how you take things you said, that I rebutted and say that -I- brought it up. Once again on the first page, you brought up the videogames. Then criticized me when I brought up the videogames.
    Where did I complain about you bringing up video games? If you take things coarsely you'll talk past people, I said SRT was mentioned on the sidelines and focussed on the interaction between Gundam pilotes, you however are writing essays on how strong/useful Zeorymer and Dendoh are. Furthermore the original argument about SRT was because you said it was a bad example because they mixed plots of multiple series, which is actually rather an argument for it being a good way of indication as you can have a direct comparison between gundam pilotes as they now show up in the same universe. Sure, not perfectly accurate but its evidence, and even if evidence is not absolute proof, its better than nil or blatant opinion.

    As I said before, don't use the tactical games, they're pure fantasy.
    Use A.C.E. or A.C.E 3, the only cross over that focuses only on Real Robots. Domon or Heero can close ground on Amuro far faster than Kira, who expends excessive amounts of energy but all 3 of them pale in comparison to Dunbine's ability to catch up.
    Oh yeah, because Getter is obviously a real robot and RX-78's obscene firepower is of course a good indication of how balanced ACE is. Not to mention that you are *yet again* focussing on the machine rather than the pilot, who's performance gets no actual display in ACE as you are controlling them. I apologise in advance if I get this wrong but you seem to keep thinking I'm trying to compare the machines, as indicated by you talking about how the many mecha get mixed up in SRT and then start focussing on the machines. Its also the main reason why I kinda get the feeling you've mainly just watched Gundam W.

    Hell, you brought up the BROKEN card game as proof. The first expansion was utterly cheap.
    Yeah lol, there are ones just for the laughs like Kira bangin Fllay and... Wait weren't you just complaining about me taking things too serious? And calling the card game broken just because of the 1st expansion is about just as cheap, but since you condemn everything beforehand anyways you couldn't care less about details huh?

    Also, since you brought it up. I'm going to start calling you a newbie.Why?
    You weren't even PART of the forum when I stole from brit Queen of Wolves a countless number times to reduce my Rep to negative levels ( -20,000 rep for stealing from a chat admin. At one point, my rep was at -9999999999999999999999 the maximum.). Simply because I did not feel like participating in an utterly stupid system that newbies would use to judge each other and circle-rep themselves to popularity. The badge and point system we had back in 02-01 was nowhere near as bad as this.
    Oh yeah I could have thought a profile neurotic would like to openly display his non-conformism. Alright fair enough, go ahead and judge people by the order and time they join because thats so much more sophisticated than a stupid point system.

    This thread is bad and you should feel bad about it and I should feel bad for actually assuming this wasn't a trolling thread.
    If you feel like you have to get condescending at me, okay. But if you don't like the thread you just don't post in it. I even agree with you that this thread is bad because the whole message consists of "Amuro rocks" at least up to now (though its technically not main theme), so you can't call it something with awesome niveau, but guess what? Nobody cares. There are threads about which favourite relationship, which favourite gundam, best looking gundam, most powerful gundam, etc. etc. etc. and I for my part also don't feel the absolute necessity of every one of them, but just because of that you won't be seeing me dissing the thread comparing wether Lacus or Meer are better singers (despite having the same voice actor) or the who knows how many ones about which couple is most awesome. Why? I have no right to dictate what everyone should be talking about, I have no right to decide over the existance of a thread and what level of sophistication everything should have, this just happens to be the level of this forum, I mean take a look at what happened in this thread before you came, there are W fans 00 fans and more but we all get along and have a good talk. Given that, I couldn't care less for the opinion of his majesty Nineteenth, the walking guideline for how sophisticated the world must be in all his self rightiousness (and I jolly bet that someone like you should have called fictional characters self rightious at least once just to pull the story down). What you're doing makes about as much sense as logging into an online game for the sole purpose of saying how bad it is and how everyone on it has no life.
    Last edited by B Gundam; 07-01-2008 at 04:34 PM.
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  16. #41
    Junior Member Saitoh is on a distinguished road Saitoh's Avatar
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    If you got a problem with the thread, don't post in the thread.
    Amen.

    I started with F90 (kind of a rare case as it seems) and as I took a look at the ending of the original I was like "WTF" and then understood why the F90 saved Def so much.

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