AnimeGalleries [dot] NetAnimeWallpapers [dot] ComAnimeLyrics [dot] ComAnimePedia [dot] ComAnimeGlobe [dot] Com

User Tag List

Closed Thread
Results 1 to 19 of 19

Thread: One hour more...

  1. #1
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit's Avatar
    Gil
    6,220.00
    Gender
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    12-07-2008 05:25 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    The Land That Public Transport Forgot, Great Britain :)
    Age
    32
    Threads
    19
    Posts
    311
    AL Lyrics
    14
    Rep Power
    105

    Default One hour more...

    Ok this is something of a mental blindspot for me - with the exception of people and small animals, I have issues with all the Japanese counters and get very easily confused about what fits in where. And sometimes, which counter to use when, especially for something like time.

    So this is my question...(Please note I can't type in kanji or kana on this PC, bear with me, sorry for that :S)

    Where time is concerned, ichi-ji is one o' clock and ichi-jikan is one hour, right?

    I understand that without any problems.

    Equally I know that half past one can be ichi-ji-sanjuppun or it can be ichi-ji-han.

    What I'm stuck with (and I'm sure the answer is glaringly obvious) is how to say one hour MORE...or half an hour MORE.

    I'm wondering if it's correct to say mou hitotsu no jikan (one more hour) or mou hitotsu no sanjuppun (30 minutes more)...somehow that seems clumsy but I can't think how else to say it :S

    Help?

    I'm sure I'm being very stupid but my idiot brain can't figure it out...

    Vraie
    Vraie's Tenchi Muyou & Fushigi Yuugi Fanfiction at FFnet
    ----------------------------
    遥かなる時空の中で
    Reasons why the Hachiyou should never come to the Miko's world #1

    泰明:問題ない。神子の世界では和歌ではなくカラオケなるものをするそうだ。
    永泉:空の。。。
    頼久:桶?!
    -----------------------------
    Avatar: Nakamoto Shou from Sotsugyou M.


  2. #2
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi's Avatar
    Gil
    8,391.96
    Gender
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    03-11-2013 03:51 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Nishitokyo-shi, Tokyo
    Age
    25
    Threads
    3
    Posts
    1,475
    Blog Entries
    9
    Rep Power
    2248

    Default

    The phrase you are looking for is, ta da:

    ato ichijikan / ato sanjuppun

    ato = after
    ato ichijikan = one hour [is left] after

    I hope that helps.

    'mou hitotsu ichijikan' does not make sense, as it would translate to 'one more of a one hour' or even 'another different one hour' which would start to delve into nearly metaphysical realms of thought.

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87's Avatar
    Gil
    8,380.00
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    05-26-2010 08:18 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Threads
    23
    Posts
    419
    AL Lyrics
    2
    Rep Power
    107

    Default

    In my Japanese class we learned that "mae" and "ato" ("before" and "after") come after the word they're modifying, so it would be ichi-jikan mae/ato.
    日本語をならっている。 まちがえれば、おねがい知らせてください~!

    Quote Originally Posted by Paraphrased from LavaBug
    I remember that day 'cause it's Sailor Mercury's birthday...or is it my mom's?

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit's Avatar
    Gil
    6,220.00
    Gender
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    12-07-2008 05:25 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    The Land That Public Transport Forgot, Great Britain :)
    Age
    32
    Threads
    19
    Posts
    311
    AL Lyrics
    14
    Rep Power
    105

    Default

    Ahhh!

    Thank you muchly

    *installs factoids into slow, stupid brain*

    Although the metaphysical isn't always a bad place to be...

    mae and ato after the words they're modifying mean before and after...I didn't think of putting ato before the noun to imply another hour...(I am reading you right on that, yes? I have just got in from work, so the brain's a little fried...)

    Is it the same kanji?

    Vraie
    Last edited by VraieEsprit; 09-08-2007 at 12:05 PM.
    Vraie's Tenchi Muyou & Fushigi Yuugi Fanfiction at FFnet
    ----------------------------
    遥かなる時空の中で
    Reasons why the Hachiyou should never come to the Miko's world #1

    泰明:問題ない。神子の世界では和歌ではなくカラオケなるものをするそうだ。
    永泉:空の。。。
    頼久:桶?!
    -----------------------------
    Avatar: Nakamoto Shou from Sotsugyou M.


  5. #5
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87's Avatar
    Gil
    8,380.00
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    05-26-2010 08:18 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Threads
    23
    Posts
    419
    AL Lyrics
    2
    Rep Power
    107

    Default

    Actually "ichi-jikan ato" means "after an hour", or "in an hour", as in the phrase "ichi jikan ato benkyou wo hajimemasu" (I will study in an hour), and, similarly, "ichi jikan mae benkyou wo hajimemashita" (I started studying an hour ago).

    As far as kanji goes, I don't know for sure, but I'd guess it would be the same since the exact definitions of kanji are very loose (e.g. 日 can mean both "sun" and "day"). It's not much of a stretch to say that this case is similar.
    日本語をならっている。 まちがえれば、おねがい知らせてください~!

    Quote Originally Posted by Paraphrased from LavaBug
    I remember that day 'cause it's Sailor Mercury's birthday...or is it my mom's?

  6. #6
    Is A Girl ;)
    AnimeLyrics Admin
    LavaBug has a reputation beyond repute LavaBug has a reputation beyond repute LavaBug has a reputation beyond repute LavaBug has a reputation beyond repute LavaBug has a reputation beyond repute LavaBug has a reputation beyond repute LavaBug has a reputation beyond repute LavaBug has a reputation beyond repute LavaBug has a reputation beyond repute LavaBug has a reputation beyond repute LavaBug has a reputation beyond repute LavaBug's Avatar
    Gil
    100,357,064.80
    Gender
    Gifts Cake Fuuko Starfish
    Mentioned
    24 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    02-14-2014 10:22 AM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    西中島南方
    Age
    33
    Threads
    39
    Posts
    628
    Blog Entries
    29
    AW Wallpapers
    31
    Rep Power
    811

    Default

    you COULD say purasu (plus) ichi jikan ...
    because i can't think of something better now...

    ___________________________________________
    Spammers busted:

  7. #7
    ☃ Snowmen! ☃
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan's Avatar
    Gil
    122,099.29
    Gender
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    08-13-2009 08:17 AM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    The 'burbs of Tokyo
    Age
    33
    Threads
    383
    Posts
    5,732
    AW Wallpapers
    13
    Rep Power
    1444

    Default

    一時間後 いちじかんあと 

    後 (ato) and 前 (mae) are most commonly used. Same kanji, too! There *could* be a keigo/polite way of saying it, but I never hear it.
    Last edited by MistressPookyChan; 09-08-2007 at 10:51 PM.

    Pink is the new Pooky
    Party it up in Wallpapers
    | join the AF Gaia guild!
    "Spilt coffee has a sad remembrance of old"- from a plastic bag seen on the train

    musing of a mod : Illuminated Spirits : Theme: uber_pink


  8. #8
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi's Avatar
    Gil
    8,391.96
    Gender
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    03-11-2013 03:51 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Nishitokyo-shi, Tokyo
    Age
    25
    Threads
    3
    Posts
    1,475
    Blog Entries
    9
    Rep Power
    2248

    Default

    Let me clarify.

    Ichijikan ato -> An hour later
    Ato ichijikan -> One hour left

    The latter is not necessarily incorrect, simply a difference in nuance.

    Ichijikan ato ni benyou wo hajimemasu -> I will start studying in an hour
    Ato ichijikan benyou wo shimasu -> I will study for one more hour

    前 = mae
    後 = ato (<- when this is at the end of a counter, e.g. 一時間+後, it is often read as 'go', as in 一時間後 = ichijikango.)

    A related word: 前後 (zengo) = before and after, in front of and behind

    There is really no keigo form of the words, but if you really want to go out of your way to be polite, '前 = saki', '後 = nochi' is a possible alternative.

    Also, just for the sake of correctness.
    ichi jikan mae benkyou wo hajimemashita
    -> ichijikan mae ni benkyou wo hajimemashita.
    Last edited by Datenshi; 09-09-2007 at 04:53 AM.

  9. #9
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87's Avatar
    Gil
    8,380.00
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    05-26-2010 08:18 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Threads
    23
    Posts
    419
    AL Lyrics
    2
    Rep Power
    107

    Default

    My Japanese prof said the "ni" was optional...I usually use it anyway though...
    日本語をならっている。 まちがえれば、おねがい知らせてください~!

    Quote Originally Posted by Paraphrased from LavaBug
    I remember that day 'cause it's Sailor Mercury's birthday...or is it my mom's?

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit's Avatar
    Gil
    6,220.00
    Gender
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    12-07-2008 05:25 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    The Land That Public Transport Forgot, Great Britain :)
    Age
    32
    Threads
    19
    Posts
    311
    AL Lyrics
    14
    Rep Power
    105

    Default

    Ok...having slept (wow, yes, I do that sometimes...bleh...) and gone back to my dictionary...I need to clarify.

    I'm asking how to say one hour more...right? Not one hour left, or in an hour, or any of those things. Having re read over the posts I'm confusing myself again.

    My dictionary says that "another" is "mou hitotsu no" which is what I originally said (note, I said mou hitotsu no jikan, not mou hitotsu no ichijikan in my original post, which may be the cause of the confusion...or it might just be me being really stupid and slow.)

    I know that you can say "mou hitotsu no sekai" (for example) to mean "another world". However...I wasn't sure if you can use it to say "another hour".

    To put it into context, I work in a library (this is the easiest example I could think of) and people there book computers for half an hour, an hour, whatever.

    So if someone was to come to the desk and say "I'd like one more hour/another hour on PC number 6 please" how would they say it?

    Is "ato ichijikan" still correct in that context?

    Thanks in advance

    Vraie
    Last edited by VraieEsprit; 09-09-2007 at 10:42 AM.
    Vraie's Tenchi Muyou & Fushigi Yuugi Fanfiction at FFnet
    ----------------------------
    遥かなる時空の中で
    Reasons why the Hachiyou should never come to the Miko's world #1

    泰明:問題ない。神子の世界では和歌ではなくカラオケなるものをするそうだ。
    永泉:空の。。。
    頼久:桶?!
    -----------------------------
    Avatar: Nakamoto Shou from Sotsugyou M.


  11. #11
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi's Avatar
    Gil
    8,391.96
    Gender
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    03-11-2013 03:51 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Nishitokyo-shi, Tokyo
    Age
    25
    Threads
    3
    Posts
    1,475
    Blog Entries
    9
    Rep Power
    2248

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ertai87 View Post
    My Japanese prof said the "ni" was optional...I usually use it anyway though...
    Yeah, you're right. I'm just somewhat of a grammar nazi :P Sorry for nitpicking.

  12. #12
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi's Avatar
    Gil
    8,391.96
    Gender
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    03-11-2013 03:51 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Nishitokyo-shi, Tokyo
    Age
    25
    Threads
    3
    Posts
    1,475
    Blog Entries
    9
    Rep Power
    2248

    Default

    I'm asking how to say one hour more...right? Not one hour left, or in an hour, or any of those things. Having re read over the posts I'm confusing myself again.
    The thing you need to get is that, as is often the case when translating, the 'range', if you will, of the definitions of the phrases in both the languages do not concisely overlap. For example, 'ato ichijikan' can mean both 'one hour more' and 'one hour left', depending on the context it is said, even though the latter two phrases mean distinctly different things from each other in English.

    My dictionary says that "another" is "mou hitotsu no" which is what I originally said (note, I said mou hitotsu no jikan, not mou hitotsu no ichijikan in my original post, which may be the cause of the confusion...or it might just be me being really stupid and slow.)

    I know that you can say "mou hitotsu no sekai" (for example) to mean "another world". However...I wasn't sure if you can use it to say "another hour".
    Again, you need to give up looking for direct equivalents of definitions. English and Japanese are entirely different languages and a direct word by word translation seldom works.

    Now how do I explain this case? Let me try.

    Think about the word 'another'. Since you are obviously a native English speaker, you may not be actively conscious of this, but when you think about it, there are two distinctly different nuances within the English word 'another'. They are:

    1. another as in 'one more'. ex. Another hour = one more hour.
    2. another as in 'different'. ex. Another world = a different world.

    Have you ever thought of that? Now, in Japanese, 'mou hitotsu no' does indeed mean 'another', but mostly in the second example I gave above (different), and seldom if never in the vein of the first example (one more).

    Therefore, you can say:
    Mou hitotsu no sekai = Another (different) world

    but you cannot say:
    Mou hitotsu no jikan = Another, different time*

    because when you think of it, what the heck is 'another, different time'? As long as we live by the phyics of this universe time is uniformly alike, so referring to 'another, different, or alternative time' sounds almost surreal (i.e. 'with this time, an hour is thirty minutes long, and with this time, a hour is ninety minutes long...' It makes no sense!). That was what I was referring to when I mentioned metaphyics in my previous post.

    However, most dictionaries gloss over this and simply state 'mou hitotsu no = another', which is misleading as you see. Technicalities such as these are countless, and are the trap in placing too much importance on your dictionary. It's a great idea to use the tool as a handy reference, but when learning the language it is best to ask a teacher or consult your textbook.

    *I'm aware there is a usage in English where "a different time = in the past or future", but in this case I mean it literally, as in "not the same", and not in that sense.

    So if someone was to come to the desk and say "I'd like one more hour/another hour on PC number 6 please" how would they say it?

    Is "ato ichijikan" still correct in that context?
    Yes.

    Strictly speaking of this case, 'mou ichijikan' will also work as well.
    Last edited by Datenshi; 09-09-2007 at 04:33 PM.

  13. #13
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87 has a reputation beyond repute Ertai87's Avatar
    Gil
    8,380.00
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    05-26-2010 08:18 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Threads
    23
    Posts
    419
    AL Lyrics
    2
    Rep Power
    107

    Default

    @Datenshi: 'sok, I'm a spelling nazi (except for certain words which I spell badly myself :P). Also, in my Japanese studies so far, I've found that a lot of words do overlap. One particular word I didn't expect to overlap was toru (to take, as in "to take a penny and leave a penny" (sorry, I can't think of anything better) but also "to take a class")

    [edit] Another word that has a neat overlap is "daijoubu", which literally translates to the English "ok", which doesn't really have a meaning, but can be used as "are you ok?" (as in physically) or "everything's ok" (as in "everything is in order") or when the teacher says "ok?" (as in "do you understand?"). The only place you would use the English "ok" where you would not use the Japanese "daijoubu" is when somebody asks you to do something and you say "ok". Or at least that's what I've found.
    Last edited by Ertai87; 09-09-2007 at 10:29 PM.
    日本語をならっている。 まちがえれば、おねがい知らせてください~!

    Quote Originally Posted by Paraphrased from LavaBug
    I remember that day 'cause it's Sailor Mercury's birthday...or is it my mom's?

  14. #14
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit's Avatar
    Gil
    6,220.00
    Gender
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    12-07-2008 05:25 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    The Land That Public Transport Forgot, Great Britain :)
    Age
    32
    Threads
    19
    Posts
    311
    AL Lyrics
    14
    Rep Power
    105

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Datenshi View Post
    The thing you need to get is that, as is often the case when translating, the 'range', if you will, of the definitions of the phrases in both the languages do not concisely overlap.
    I understand this. THis is actually my reason for asking in such exact detail. Even if I think I understand something, I would prefer to get it right, which is why the clarification...

    I know Japanese is quite good at this repeat meaning thing, so I wanted to be sure.

    Now how do I explain this case? Let me try.

    Think about the word 'another'. Since you are obviously a native English speaker, you may not be actively conscious of this, but when you think about it, there are two distinctly different nuances within the English word 'another'. They are:

    1. another as in 'one more'. ex. Another hour = one more hour.
    2. another as in 'different'. ex. Another world = a different world.
    I'm actually not a languages rookie, and lexis and vocabulary has always been my extreme strong point (not to mention the fact my mother is an English/TEFL teacher which means I wouldn't be able to avoid that if I wanted to). I'm fairly fluent in French and I've A Level Spanish and GCSE German. Being a native English speaker doesn't make me a monoglot. ^_^. Common misapprehension, I realise, but Japanese is actually the fourth language I've taken up studying.

    The problem is not that I don't understand "different nuances". It's that I understand too many nuances. This is a byproduct of being Aspie - in that I read all the posts that were left on the thread and saw a number of different answers and interpretations to questions asked and answered. This is confusing to an Aspie brain because we already look for multiple meanings/readings in sentences without even thinking about it. So although you answered my question, you answered it in too many ways for me to know if you answered it at all.

    (Apologies for that)

    As for resorting to the dictionary, I actually hate my Japanese dictionary and find my Kanji one much more helpful. Which again was why I was asking for clarification. I don't wholeheartedly trust my dictionary's perspective. I'd rather have it from someone who speaks the language fluently. When my mother was teaching English to Japanese businesspeople, she'd say that they'd often comment on the poor quality of E-J/J-E dictionaries available in this country. So I've a tendency to be wary, and to doublecheck things over and over.

    Unfortunately my mother is no longer teaching (she retired a year or two ago) and my Japanese is actually better than hers is (she taught intermediate English). So while it taught me kana, it means I don't currently have anyone native on hand to ask these annoying questions I have. ^_^.


    but you cannot say:
    Mou hitotsu no jikan = Another, different time*
    I suppose that would imply "era" which would be "jidai" rather than "jikan"...right?

    I only re-emphasised this because you misquoted me in the original post though. I had to clarify that what I wrote was actually wrong...not just that you'd read it wrong. *sorry if that was confusing*.

    Technicalities such as these are countless, and are the trap in placing too much importance on your dictionary. It's a great idea to use the tool as a handy reference, but when learning the language it is best to ask a teacher or consult your textbook.
    Yeah, as I said, I don't trust my dictionary anyway. That was why I came here (lol) since I won't see my teacher till the 20th and it's a fairly casual arrangement as it is (most of my Japanese is self-taught since my mother gave up teaching!)

    Strictly speaking of this case, 'mou ichijikan' will also work as well.
    That was all I needed to know

    Doumo arigatou

    Vraie
    Vraie's Tenchi Muyou & Fushigi Yuugi Fanfiction at FFnet
    ----------------------------
    遥かなる時空の中で
    Reasons why the Hachiyou should never come to the Miko's world #1

    泰明:問題ない。神子の世界では和歌ではなくカラオケなるものをするそうだ。
    永泉:空の。。。
    頼久:桶?!
    -----------------------------
    Avatar: Nakamoto Shou from Sotsugyou M.


  15. #15
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi's Avatar
    Gil
    8,391.96
    Gender
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    03-11-2013 03:51 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Nishitokyo-shi, Tokyo
    Age
    25
    Threads
    3
    Posts
    1,475
    Blog Entries
    9
    Rep Power
    2248

    Default

    When I answer a question, I think through it for a bit and try to answer cover all the important points to make it sound the least confusing, but in this case it seems I tried too hard and my method did not turn out to be the best. I apologize for that.

    Think about the word 'another'. Since you are obviously a native English speaker, you may not be actively conscious of this
    Being a native English speaker doesn't make me a monoglot. ^_^. Common misapprehension, I realise, but Japanese is actually the fourth language I've taken up studying.
    Funny, I wasn't aware I ever stated anything implying that you were. I simply said that, while you are often aware of the semantical technicalities of a language learned second hand (or third, or fourth, or fifth, which may be in your case), you tend to take that of your native language for granted.

    If that is not the case for you, that is just as well. But I'm simply quite curious where you got the impression that I was assuming you only speak English, as polygots are by no means anything uncommon by the Internet's global standards.

    I only re-emphasised this because you misquoted me in the original post though. I had to clarify that what I wrote was actually wrong...not just that you'd read it wrong. *sorry if that was confusing*.
    It wasn't a misquotation more than an automatic correction, but in either case I am sorry if I caused any confusion.
    In your original post you said:
    mou hitotsu no jikan (one more hour)
    However, 'jikan' by itself does not mean 'hour', but simply 'time'. Only when you put the 'one' before it and say 'ichijikan' does the word take on the meaning of 'an hour'.

    ichijikan = one hour
    jikan =/= one hour

    From the contents of the parenthesis directly after your statement, I concluded that what you meant to say was 'ichijikan =hour' and not 'jikan = time' and quoted you accordingly. Again, I aplogize if I didn't provide enough explanation.


    Learning a language by yourself is a very hard task, one I wouldn't have the courage to embark upon myself, so I wish you only the best. Although, having such a rich background in a variety of other languages is sure to be an advantage, is it not?
    Last edited by Datenshi; 09-10-2007 at 08:47 PM.

  16. #16
    ☃ Snowmen! ☃
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan's Avatar
    Gil
    122,099.29
    Gender
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    08-13-2009 08:17 AM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    The 'burbs of Tokyo
    Age
    33
    Threads
    383
    Posts
    5,732
    AW Wallpapers
    13
    Rep Power
    1444

    Default

    Thank you all for keeping the personal jabs to a minimum. Remember, this forum is for learning, not for showing off and criticizing others.

    Pink is the new Pooky
    Party it up in Wallpapers
    | join the AF Gaia guild!
    "Spilt coffee has a sad remembrance of old"- from a plastic bag seen on the train

    musing of a mod : Illuminated Spirits : Theme: uber_pink


  17. #17
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit has a reputation beyond repute VraieEsprit's Avatar
    Gil
    6,220.00
    Gender
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    12-07-2008 05:25 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    The Land That Public Transport Forgot, Great Britain :)
    Age
    32
    Threads
    19
    Posts
    311
    AL Lyrics
    14
    Rep Power
    105

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Datenshi View Post
    When I answer a question, I think through it for a bit and try to answer cover all the important points to make it sound the least confusing, but in this case it seems I tried too hard and my method did not turn out to be the best. I apologize for that.
    I suspect to a large degree the fault is with me and my overly complicated brain :S

    Funny, I wasn't aware I ever stated anything implying that you were. I simply said that, while you are often aware of the semantical technicalities of a language learned second hand (or third, or fourth, or fifth, which may be in your case), you tend to take that of your native language for granted.
    Ack. In that case I apologise. I did tell you I have a bad habit of reading too many interpretations, didn't I? I guess that just bears it out. Apologies for putting implications into your words that you did not infer.


    However, 'jikan' by itself does not mean 'hour', but simply 'time'. Only when you put the 'one' before it and say 'ichijikan' does the word take on the meaning of 'an hour'.

    ichijikan = one hour
    jikan =/= one hour
    That makes sense. It's been a while since I revised time and so on, so I suppose that didn't occur to me. (You realise at this point we've reached a correction that was a misquotation of an original error...LOL!)

    Learning a language by yourself is a very hard task, one I wouldn't have the courage to embark upon myself, so I wish you only the best. Although, having such a rich background in a variety of other languages is sure to be an advantage, is it not?
    Yeah, well, I hope so. I'm not entirely on my own, just the main thrust of my learning has been. It means that some things pass me by and other things I absorb probably more quickly...I have no doubt that I can read all the wrong Kanji for my study level and my vocabulary is probably somewhat bizarre...

    In any case, thank you for your patience in helping me and I'm sorry if I put you to any trouble/confusion I'll go away now and revise all the time things and then I'll know for sure the next time the question arises

    hontou ni arigatou

    Vraie
    Vraie's Tenchi Muyou & Fushigi Yuugi Fanfiction at FFnet
    ----------------------------
    遥かなる時空の中で
    Reasons why the Hachiyou should never come to the Miko's world #1

    泰明:問題ない。神子の世界では和歌ではなくカラオケなるものをするそうだ。
    永泉:空の。。。
    頼久:桶?!
    -----------------------------
    Avatar: Nakamoto Shou from Sotsugyou M.


  18. #18
    Senior Member
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi has a reputation beyond repute Datenshi's Avatar
    Gil
    8,391.96
    Gender
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    03-11-2013 03:51 PM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Nishitokyo-shi, Tokyo
    Age
    25
    Threads
    3
    Posts
    1,475
    Blog Entries
    9
    Rep Power
    2248

    Default

    Thank you all for keeping the personal jabs to a minimum. Remember, this forum is for learning, not for showing off and criticizing others.
    Did it really come off like I was? Feh.

    You realise at this point we've reached a correction that was a misquotation of an original error...LOL!
    Yeah, it seems to be a lapse on my part as well. It's weird, my mind kind of unconciously filled in the blank and I didn't even notice. Funny how these things happen, ne.

    I have no doubt that I can read all the wrong Kanji for my study level and my vocabulary is probably somewhat bizarre...
    I sorta sympathize myself, as my Japanese/English education has been sporadic to say the least, travelling so often to and fro my native land as I have. I can know somewhat obscure kanji/words on one hand and have a first-grader's knowledge of some of the most basic things on the other. It's rather frustrating at times.

    Oh, and to answer I question I missed in my previous post:
    I suppose that would imply "era" which would be "jidai" rather than "jikan"...right?
    You're absolutely right.

    Douitashimashite.
    Last edited by Datenshi; 09-11-2007 at 07:06 AM.

  19. #19
    ☃ Snowmen! ☃
    AnimeLyrics Submitter Lv 2
    MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan has a reputation beyond repute MistressPookyChan's Avatar
    Gil
    122,099.29
    Gender
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Latest Post
    08-13-2009 08:17 AM
    User Info Thanks / Tagging Info Gifts / Achievements / Awards vBActivity Stats
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    The 'burbs of Tokyo
    Age
    33
    Threads
    383
    Posts
    5,732
    AW Wallpapers
    13
    Rep Power
    1444

    Default

    My warning wasn't aimed at just one person. Just keep the learning positive. Thanks!

    Pink is the new Pooky
    Party it up in Wallpapers
    | join the AF Gaia guild!
    "Spilt coffee has a sad remembrance of old"- from a plastic bag seen on the train

    musing of a mod : Illuminated Spirits : Theme: uber_pink


Closed Thread

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

     

Similar Threads

  1. Sephiroth Vs. Ganondorf
    By Shizzy in forum Video Games
    Replies: 133
    Last Post: 02-18-2006, 11:43 AM
  2. Disgaea Hour of Darkness
    By Ryu Kazuhiro in forum Video Games
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 09-25-2005, 02:38 AM
  3. who wants a all 24 hour anime channel?
    By Trash_gordon in forum General Anime & Manga
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: 08-26-2005, 10:34 PM
  4. Anime Episode Lenghts: More than 1/2 hour?
    By Dunne in forum General Anime & Manga
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 07-01-2005, 06:10 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts