Women "get blamed for being raped"

[███]

To view story: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4453820.stm



Originally Posted by Story
A third of people believe a woman is partially or completely responsible for being raped if she has behaved flirtatiously, a survey suggests.

The Amnesty International poll of 1,000 people also found over 25% believe she is at least partly to blame if she has worn revealing clothing or been drunk.

Amnesty said the findings were "truly shocking" and showed the government's policies on tackling rape were failing.

The Home Office says it has changed the law to try to improve conviction rates.

"We have made a number of changes to the legal system and to how the police and Crown Prosecution Service work, to put victims needs first and to make it easier for cases to get to trial and secure convictions," a spokesman said.



Quote:
Originally Posted by A wanker

The results truly were shocking, there were a number of different questions. The most surprising to me is that more WOMEN thought that if a woman was drunk, she was *totally* responsible if she got raped (5% compared to only 3% of men)

A change is needed not only in the law (was it Judge Pickle who said that 'we all know that when a woman says no, she really means yes'?), but also in the attitudes of society in general. Its no wonder that the police believe only 15% of rapes are reported, when a large part of the population would place the blame the woman.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Girlfriend
In alot of cases rape could be prevented by not being drunk off your a** and wearing something that invites attention while turning into a dark alley... but that's just my opinion.

Of course I'm not saying that 100% of rape victims are the type of women you see out on a saturday night in city centre falling over in the gutter with their knickers (or lack there of) flashed about for all the world to see, I know this from experence. However alot of them are now, and if the women in this country would just use COMMON SENSE alot of the time it could be prevented.

I'm, in that 5% of women that think if you're out on this p*** wearing half a skirt and your t*ts are hanging out, it's your own damned fault. At least walk home in a group, get a cab, WEAR A JACKET. Something. Like I said, it's common sense.

I'm the last person to say "you shouldn't wear a short skirt" because I like my legs and I like to show them off. But if you're going to go out wearing something that draws sexual attention to you, at least do it in a responcible way. I never go out in something revealing without someone else with me. And on the off chance I find myself alone, I always ALWAYS carry -something- to defend myself with.

*sigh* I just find it's stupidity that causes most of the crimes in this country. Stupidity and ignorance.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Blasphemous Feind

Load of rubbish, all of it.

If I walk into a biker bar, get blind drunk, and start calling them all a load of fags, am I completely responsibility free if I lose a few teeth?

People should be taught what their limits are, what they can handle, and how to be safe. If you go out with the intention of getting blind drunk wearing less material than the average olympic swimmer, then funnily enough you increase your chances of getting raped.

Am I saying rape is okay? No.
Am I saying all rape is the fault of the woman? No.

What I am saying is that some rapes can be avoided by being bloody responsible instead of whining that nobody protects drunk, half-naked women.

PS - I am also massively against anyone that believes the state should absolve personal responsibility, which goes for stupid lawsuits and all the rest of it





SO, what do you think?

[Acnologia]

Just because a woman acts flirtatious, doesn't mean she deserves to get raped.

[darkcrystalofthebluemoon]

But aren't men usually the ones who make those revealing clothes for women?
And I also agree with SaucyNinja just because a women is acting all flirty she doesn't deserve to be raped.

[Bean Bandit]

Thats ludicrous

[Abstract Me]

Someone might dress skimpy, but it's not an invitation for something like rape. It is absurd to think that.

[███]

I agree entirely with everything that has been said, but I think people have missunderstood what I am trying to say, maybe I should rephrase.

The entire point is that if you go out, get blind drunk, wear next to nothing, and then get raped, you have increased the likelihood that you are going to be raped. In this way, part of the responsibility for getting into the situation is yours. I would not wish that on you, or anyone, and I always have been and will be pro-death penalty for certain rape cases. But the fact still stands, the situation could have been avoided if the actions of the woman involved had been different.

It's not that in a perfect world, a woman should be banned from performing whatever actions; but this is not a perfect world, rape occurs, and precautions should be taken to stop it happening, not going down a path which increases the likelihood.

[Buruku]

I thought women liked being raped? I'm serious 90%+ of romantic fictions that have rape in it are written by women.

But aren't men usually the ones who make those revealing clothes for women?

lawl! Its the girls that choose to wear the clothes, and they ENJOY it, they aren't fooling anyone.

[The Rebel]

I have to agree with Blasphemous on this one. And as far as guys designing the outfits goes, try to remember, alot of them are gay. NOW, I am a guy, but I do understand human nature kinda. I can understand the whole wanting to be noticed by the opposite sex, but do you REALLY want to be noticed for just your looks? Oops, once again, not a perfect world, silly me. In a perfect world, we would actually try to look at the person as a whole, not just outer appearance. I guess for all our so-called advancement, in ways we have actually degressed somewhat.

[Astalle]

I suppose this all depends on perspective. Sure Men make those clothes for women, but women will make them as well. As for the rape part, being drunk is not an invitation to sex/rape.

[Music Fiend]

As anti-PC as it may be (oh noes, offensive!!!), I do believe rape can be partially the woman's fault in a situation where she is drunk, wearing revealing clothing, or in some other selective scenarios where they have abandoned judgment in exchange for looking trashy or tossing responsibility off to the side so they can have "fun". Now, if a guy spikes a lady's drink or drugs her, and she did not desire this, then that is a case where I think it is completely the guys fault. Also, I'm no prude (duh) - I like for a girl/woman to dress sexy - very much so; however, there is a difference between sexy-classy and sexy-"I look like Paris Hilton's twin...screw me already!" Woman want to be equal to men in all aspects of life, and yet, they want to be coddled and double-protected in every instance (of course, I'm generalizing). Take some damn responsibilities for your actions. Saying that all rapes are completely the woman's fault is just plain idiotic. You have to look at it on a case-by-case basis. I'm not saying that it would be all a woman's fault, in the cases above - it wouldn't even be half their fault, in my opinion, since the guy is the one committing the vicious, despicable crime - but it would at least be somewhat their fault.

[███]

It's good to see this topic has stayed civil. It's also good to see that people are actually reading the posts without jumping to conclusions.

It's not to do with sex drive, all men have it, so do women. It's to do with the opportunistic raping of whichever is the most likely target, and one that is clearly too forking drunk to stand up is going to run more risk of being raped than one who is sober and getting in a taxi with five friends. Same goes with easy-access clothing. Both sexes.

It's like walking down an alley with a hundred dollar note hanging out of your pocket, you aren't asking to be mugged nor do you diserve it, but you really are attracting much attention to yourself, would you be surprised if they chose you as a target? With the world we live in you must take precautions. Now you walk down that same alley with no money hanging out and with five friends, you stand a far better chance of getting out safely.

[_CTA_]

Just because a woman acts flirtatious, doesn't mean she deserves to get raped.

exactly. its also the man's problem. he got a chance to rape the woman cuz she was not in a stable moment.

[arthas-old]

reading this article was informative......

A rape of a woman is caused due to innumerable possiblities..wearing revealing clothes is not the only factor...
If we make a detailed study then we can see that a large portion of the rape cases are not caused only due to a man's "failure" of controlling his desires..the woman(victim) maybe the aftereffect of an act of revenge or dominance over her character and actions....

About women getting "blamed" for rape...again its a controversial statement...on one hand we have this view of "revealing clothes" and on the other we have the inability of a man not being able to control his passions.

Like my fellow forum member mentioned above...if we go about inviting trouble then yes we are to be blamed...: if at midnight one walks in an unsafe area when one can avoid that area and remain unhurt..but still foolishly goes in the danger zone then yes its that person's fault.....
and if that person is a victim of uncontrolled desires then..well ..let there be proper justice......

then again not all women wear "revealing clothes" and not all men have the same self control...

[ParaParaJMo]

So it is a victims fault they got robbed regardless that they locked the door to their house or car? Or is because the glass is so easily breakable just in case they can't open the door?

Is it a victims fault when they get murdered in a drive by while minding their own business? Or is it because their income can't get them out of those surroundings?

Is it a victims fault they get their jacket stolen just because they were in an area that's too cold and some guy without a jacket but yet can afford a gun wanted it?

Car accidents is something that happens out of sheer stupidity and something most people can avoid. Wearing provocative clothing is not the same as running a red light or stop sign regardlessness of conciousness or intoxication. Is it the person who ran the green lights fault or had the right away if someone hits them because they ran a red light or ran a stop sign?

Getting drunk is not a reason a person should be taken advantage of. Sure it may be fun to play pranks on each other while drunk, but the individual is still a human being. Sure rape can also be prevented but I don't think it's the victims fault that she can't defend herself from a guy that could be 1.5-5x her size without the conciousness or capability of doing so. It's not the same or as practicial as preventing a car accident.

[Myrra]

Oh, dear me. Are we saying that all women who are raped were underdressed, falling on their arses drunk, raped by a stranger??
From the surveys I recall most rapes are not committed by strangers but by someone the victim knows. Who knows how the victim was dressed as these are the rapes least likely to be reported. People who blame the victim have most obviously never been a victim themselves. And people who think "no" means "yes" need to get out their dictionary and reread the definitions.
I'll admit this is an extremely touchy subject with me and restraining my words is difficult, but some of the comments here are making it difficult.
Apparently, it seems, men are not to be held responsible for their own actions. That controlling one's desires/lusts are not something expected of men. We are not living in the stone age. We have evolved as a species and I don't think it completely out of line to expect that people control their impulses. We have laws and rules of etiquette to help keep order. And it is my opinion that all rapists should suffer a fate worse than death. But as I said, it's my opinion and I think a possible deterrent if implemented immediately.

[miniPhil]

Man I don’t agree with this at all. I would love to see anyone who agrees that its the woman’s fault inform a rape victim of their views.
''Yeah im sorry that you got raped an all but you do know it was your fault, I mean you were drunk when some innocent rapist found you so you’re the one to blame''.

[Eris]

Thats ludicrous

Two words better suited for summarizing it are scarce to be found.

[Music Fiend]

Oh, dear me. Are we saying that all women who are raped we're underdressed, falling on their arses drunk, raped by a stranger??
From the surveys I recall most rapes are not committed by strangers but by someone the victim knows. Who knows how the victim was dressed as these are the rapes least likely to be reported. People who blame the victim have most obviously never been a victim themselves. And people who think "no" means "yes" need to get out their dictionary and reread the definitions.
I'll admit this is an extremely touchy subject with me and restraining my words is difficult, but some of the comments here are making it difficult.
Apparently, it seems, men are not to be held responsible for their own actions. That controlling one's desires/lusts are not something expected of men. We are not living in the stone age. We have evolved as a species and I don't think it completely out of line to expect that people control their impulses. We have laws and rules of etiquette to help keep order. And it is my opinion that all rapists should suffer a fate worse than death. But as I said, it's my opinion and I think a possible deterrent if implemented immediately.

You right in bringing up that point about most of today's rape crime, as inflicted upon women, are committed by people that she knows. I still have no problem with blaming the victim in selective situations, as I mention in my last post, but self-control of the man is a huge factor. If I wasn't clear on that before, than I will be clear on that here - the man who takes the initiative to commit this filthy crime is either all at fault, or mostly at fault. It's never the woman who deserves full-blame or more than half of it.

The self-control thing does come back to one point though - personal responsibility. Having the self-control to not drink yourself silly, having the self-control to be expressive with your clothing, but know the dangers of wearing something too skimpy late at night on the streets, and (for the man) having to self-control to "keep it in your pants" or stop when a woman says "no" - these are all a matter of personal responsibility. If you can't take responsibility for your actions, then why should I pity you?

But like Myrra, I despise all rapists. Just as with child molesters, rapists are scumballs that do not deserve to live - not in MY view of the world. I don't lose a wink of sleep when one is put to death.


Again, IT IS NEVER COMPLETELY THE WOMAN'S FAULT. I figured that all-caps would make that clearer. Oh, and Phil, if the woman was partially at fault, by my standards, I would tell them my views. I am far from a heartless jerk, and it wouldn't be easily, but it would be like a prevention mechanism - a call for them to be more aware of their surroundings and to take care of their bodies. Of course, you CAN'T prevent rape, but maybe it would help. Again, I speak ONLY of the lack-of-personal-responsibility-scenarios I have mentioned throughout this thread. There is nothing that I could to a woman who got raped when she was minding her own business and being responsible. It's not their fault. No one should tell them otherwise. Heck, I would want to strangle the rapist to death myself, in that case.

[Eris]

From a causal perspective, wearing skimpy outfits and flirting with people might put you at risk of rape, so sheerly from a deterministic point of view, yes. However, the flaw of generalizing this argument is that this isn't the main cause. It's like blaming the beer makers for making you an alcoholic. Sure, the beer was around, but you were the one doing the drinking. The same goes with rape, sure the woman was around, but the rapist was the one doing the raping.

[Buruku]

It seems some people have taken me too seriously, let me add a better response.

I thought women liked being raped?

Sarcasm

I'm serious 90%+ of romantic fictions that have rape in it are written by women.

Just an ironic tid-bit I thought I'd add.


Of COURSE I don't think women want to be raped, it's a terrible crime,one that affects a person both physically and mentally. I will admit though that I have a hard time feeling sorry for girls that conduct themselves in a...promiscuous fasion.
why? Because people aren't stupid, today girls are constantly being told about risks involving sexual harrassment and rape. How you dress, how you conduct yourself, where your at and whos around you are all factors, but some girls continually ignore this and choose to get slammed at strange parties around people they barely know dressed like....you know.


Ultimately though, no matter how 'skanky' a girl is it doesn't give anyone an excuss to rape her, I understand this. Also, I'm NOT saying only scandalous girls get rapped, I know it can happen to anyone, even if the girl was innocent in every way.

[Regex]

I would never go so far as to say that it is the woman's fault that she got raped.

HOWEVER.
I will say that there are women who DO put themselves more at risk. If you have an old beater car, where you can't lock the passenger side door, and you have a backpack and other things inside, and you park on the street, you really are putting yourself more at risk for getting your things stolen from your car. No, it's not your FAULT that you got robbed.

But if you are wearing revealing clothing, and acting flirtaciously, in a setting where there is alcohol and strangers, you really are making yourself a target, putting yourself more at risk. There are a lot of precautions that women could take to better protect themselves, and I feel that a great deal of women don't bother.

[Ami~chan]

No one deserves to be raped, no matter how trashy they look or how drunk they are. Rape violates a person on pretty much every level: sexual, emotional, physical... And what's bad is a whole bunch of women/men do believe it's their fault that they got raped, and it never is.

This is like saying that woman walking in Central Park at night was responsible for being murdered. It's completely ludacrious.

[arthas-old]

So it is a victims fault they got robbed regardless that they locked the door to their house or car? Or is because the glass is so easily breakable just in case they can't open the door?

Is it a victims fault when they get murdered in a drive by while minding their own business? Or is it because their income can't get them out of those surroundings?

Is it a victims fault they get their jacket stolen just because they were in an area that's too cold and some guy without a jacket but yet can afford a gun wanted it?

Car accidents is something that happens out of sheer stupidity and something most people can avoid. Wearing provocative clothing is not the same as running a red light or stop sign regardlessness of conciousness or intoxication. Is it the person who ran the green lights fault or had the right away if someone hits them because they ran a red light or ran a stop sign?

Getting drunk is not a reason a person should be taken advantage of. Sure it may be fun to play pranks on each other while drunk, but the individual is still a human being. Sure rape can also be prevented but I don't think it's the victims fault that she can't defend herself from a guy that could be 1.5-5x her size without the conciousness or capability of doing so. It's not the same or as practicial as preventing a car accident.

look what I mean is that if you go about inviting trouble your going to get into trouble....I am not supporting the rapists for committing their heinous acts neither am I blaming any women.....but yes if your not careful then you are going to get hurt.....

again I say...I 'm supporting no one....

[Rageling]

Please what's it matter whether or not she's drunk. If a guy is the type to rape a girl then he'll rape her. The woman has no responsibility for his actions and shouldn't. Maybe she should have used some common sense but it does not make him any less of a rapist and should face just as severe of punishment.

[Idea Nuked]

I say when it comes to crime, fault is always with the criminal and not the victim.

Morally, you *should* be able to leave your front door unlocked at night, you *should* be able to leave valuables on display in your car and you *should* be able to wander alone in a park at 1am wearing skimpy clothes if you wish.

When you begin to put blame on victims of crime, you are saying that crime in our society is inevitable and normal instead of "crime is wrong". Is that really the best view to take?

On a side note, I accidentally left some money out in a hotel room once instead of putting it in the safe. It got stolen and everyone said it was my fault. Did i deserve to get my money stolen because i forgot to put it in the safe? Are people completely without self control thesedays? That got me so angry, I can't imagine how it must feel to be told the same thing as a rape victim.