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Thread: Should The Punishment fit the Crime?

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    Default Should The Punishment fit the Crime?

    I want to ask what you people think about the justice system.

    The issue is that we have people who run from the police at 90 mph weaving through traffic and running cars off the road putting hundreds of people's health at risk and the cops are going through hell to stop him and the chase takes up to 2 hours until the suspect jumps out and runs into a house and hides.

    His sentance is 2 years in prison for evading arrest and a $700 dollar fine.

    Someone walks into a convieant store and looks around, grabs a bottle of soda and walks out, he stole something meaningless and incredibly lame, a soda. Now he's being sued for thousonds of dollars and faces 5 years jail time for theft.

    Does this make sense to you people?

  2. #2
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    I'm re-posting my response from a really old thread:

    I believe in two ways of dealing with crime, in the first way you look at the offender as a victim of society or mental illness. The bankrobber was driven to robbing the bank because society did not properly educate him so that he could get an ordinary job. The serial-killer is mentally ill, and needs help. Currently we treat the symptom, not the disease. These people need help, and all we do is sweep them under the rug (put them in jail). So essentially, you stop locking people up, and find what's causing people to commit crime, whether it is mental illness or a flawed education system and do something about that.

    The other way is inhuman draconian punishments for all offenses. Think middle ages: Cut the hands off the robber, castrate the rapist, burn the murderer at a stake. You get the picture. Even though some people would be innocent, the punishment isn't really as much a punishment, but a clear message to others not to commit crime. Punishments so inhuman that nobody, no matter how deranged would ever even think of committing a crime.



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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dieselmannen
    I'm re-posting my response from a really old thread:

    I believe in two ways of dealing with crime, in the first way you look at the offender as a victim of society or mental illness. The bankrobber was driven to robbing the bank because society did not properly educate him so that he could get an ordinary job. The serial-killer is mentally ill, and needs help. Currently we treat the symptom, not the disease. These people need help, and all we do is sweep them under the rug (put them in jail). So essentially, you stop locking people up, and find what's causing people to commit crime, whether it is mental illness or a flawed education system and do something about that.

    The other way is inhuman draconian punishments for all offenses. Think middle ages: Cut the hands off the robber, castrate the rapist, burn the murderer at a stake. You get the picture. Even though some people would be innocent, the punishment isn't really as much a punishment, but a clear message to others not to commit crime. Punishments so inhuman that nobody, no matter how deranged would ever even think of committing a crime.
    I guess you forgot that there are actual crinimals out there. Like the bank robber driven by greed or the serial killer that isn't mentally ill, but does it for the hell of it. Gacy wasn't mentally ill.

    And, as society has already seen, deterrence doesn't really work. It doesn't do a good job at stopping those really committed to doing the crimes.

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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faceless111
    I guess you forgot that there are actual crinimals out there. Like the bank robber driven by greed or the serial killer that isn't mentally ill, but does it for the hell of it. Gacy wasn't mentally ill.

    And, as society has already seen, deterrence doesn't really work. It doesn't do a good job at stopping those really committed to doing the crimes.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisoc...ality_disorder

    That's because there is no deterrence. For most crimes short of Terrorism/Mass-murder, you get sent to prison, where you watch TV and trade stories with other criminals. Some times you get beat-up or killed, but the former is temporary and the latter is fairly uncommon. You start surgically removing limbs for crimes; you'll see people start behaving.
    Ehhh, I dunno if I'll stick around. We'll see.

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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dieselmannen
    I believe in two ways of dealing with crime, in the first way you look at the offender as a victim of society or mental illness. The bankrobber was driven to robbing the bank because society did not properly educate him so that he could get an ordinary job. The serial-killer is mentally ill, and needs help. Currently we treat the symptom, not the disease. These people need help, and all we do is sweep them under the rug (put them in jail). So essentially, you stop locking people up, and find what's causing people to commit crime, whether it is mental illness or a flawed education system and do something about that.

    The other way is inhuman draconian punishments for all offenses. Think middle ages: Cut the hands off the robber, castrate the rapist, burn the murderer at a stake. You get the picture. Even though some people would be innocent, the punishment isn't really as much a punishment, but a clear message to others not to commit crime. Punishments so inhuman that nobody, no matter how deranged would ever even think of committing a crime.
    I vote for B.



  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by bakakame
    I vote for B.
    Hell it works in Saudi Arabia and Iran. Friend of mine who was a Cpl at the time he was in Kuwait was stationed in SA for a week while waiting deployment. Left his 500 dollar camera on a table in a outside restaurant thing. Came back two days later to search for it and couldn't believe his eyes when he saw it sitting in the same spot.

    Saudi Arabians know the punishment for stealing very well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sagat
    Hell it works in Saudi Arabia and Iran. Friend of mine who was a Cpl at the time he was in Kuwait was stationed in SA for a week while waiting deployment. Left his 500 dollar camera on a table in a outside restaurant thing. Came back two days later to search for it and couldn't believe his eyes when he saw it sitting in the same spot.

    Saudi Arabians know the punishment for stealing very well.
    What do they do torcher them and cut their heads off when finished? Thats amazing Sagat...

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riku_
    What do they do torcher them and cut their heads off when finished? Thats amazing Sagat...
    Choppity chop chop goes the right hand if I recall correctly.

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    Edit: Never mind. Sagat beat me to it.
    Ehhh, I dunno if I'll stick around. We'll see.

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    Yes, Yes it should.

    I hate when someone commits a horrendus crime and gets let off the hoom by a horrible judge that gives them just a slap on the hand and sets them back into society.
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    YES... THE PUNISHMENT SHOULD FIT THE CRIME... AT LEAST AFTER A SPEEDY COURT MARSHAL-THINGY-THING...
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  12. #12
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    it depends what is going on in the situation...

    i think that the guy who stole the soda should have to jsut do some sort of community service and pay a fine...5 years seems totally ridiculous in my opinion unless it was during a robbery that made him look like he was part of it or some dangerous situation

    as for the guy who was speeding and running away from the cops is pathetic because he shouldn't of run from the cops unless he was drunk(shouldn't of been in the 1st place), influenced with having or under drugs(shouldn't of happened in the 1st place), or this was some sort of emergency
    if he wasn't under those influences he shouldv'e been able to stop for the cops without causing any sort of trouble, a person who foolishly drives should get their license taken away for some amount of time and even longer if they have had recent law problems relating to locomotives

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    yes it should!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinnaku
    I want to ask what you people think about the justice system.

    The issue is that we have people who run from the police at 90 mph weaving through traffic and running cars off the road putting hundreds of people's health at risk and the cops are going through hell to stop him and the chase takes up to 2 hours until the suspect jumps out and runs into a house and hides.

    His sentance is 2 years in prison for evading arrest and a $700 dollar fine.

    Someone walks into a convieant store and looks around, grabs a bottle of soda and walks out, he stole something meaningless and incredibly lame, a soda. Now he's being sued for thousonds of dollars and faces 5 years jail time for theft.

    Does this make sense to you people?
    No to be honest, if you are going to steal a soda, you are either to poor to pay for one, or to lazy to take the money out your pocket.

    for the person who was weaving through traffic and resisting arrest..he should get i think 5 years at miminum, maybe 7 since he endangered lives.

  15. #15
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    Hmm...I see a few things going on in the justice system but as always these are just my observations and opinions. First of all, to fit the punishment to the crime someone must judge which crimes are worse and in life so few agree on such issues. Perhaps major issues like murder is worse than stealing a candy bar, but the finer points will cause a lot of uproar to those who have been personally effected by the crimes.

    Second, although I by no means wish to advocate crime, it is not appropriate to de-humanize the criminal when sentencing. It doesn't mean punishment should be avoided, but it does mean that that person is still a human being and to think of them otherwise is just as much a crime as the ones that were committed.

    Also, this mandatory sentencing is ridiculous. If there's a problem fix the problem, not slap a half baked bandaid over it and call it good. If the problem is the judges and inconsistant sentencing, then perhaps that means either judges, election of judges or the sentences need to be re-evaluated. Instead we now have required sentences that a judge cannot rule over to sentence people--half of which are guilty of a far lesser crime than the one they are being sentenced for because the laws are written so poorly and are so vague that half the population might fit into it.

    Lastly, when making a sentence they should consider what happens after the person is released. Rather than make it so the person cannot get a job, cannot support themselves thus becoming a burden on their family or soceity or both--why not actually help those who are not repeat offenders and who honestly are trying to turn their life around. Instead, we throw them back out on the street with nothing, unable to get a job, unable to find a place to stay in some cases, unable to support themselves or their families...so then they turn back to the life of crime be it in making money or coping with their newly wrecked life. Then we point the finger and complain that they are bad people when really we are the ones that took away their chance to be successful and go on from their mistake.

    Nothing excuses what a criminal does, even if it is understandable how s/he came to the crime. However, if we are going to issue sentences that have such profound effects upon not just the criminal but the families of the criminal and any victim and his/her families, then we should take responsibility for our own actions and make sure we don't just throw them back out to make it even easier to fall further down in life and more difficult to live a normal life. There are two sides to every story and so often it is the side of the criminal that is never heard for people seem to only be interested in the crime and punishment. When the laws are so black and white for such a colorful world, it isn't really condusive to have such close minded perspectives when creating and issuing sentences.

    So from this perspective, no that sentence does not make sense in comparison to the other. Everything is connected and what happens after the theif is released from jail and wants to try to make an honest living? S/he may not be a felon, but going to prison for any reason usually makes an employer find a reason not to hire you or a neighborhood to not have space available.
    Last edited by akiko_kalla; 06-23-2006 at 01:09 AM.
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  16. #16
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    You shoud just kill them then ther will be no crime now will there.
    Don't rep me I am only a product of my environment.

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  17. #17
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    yeah totally because your just going to sit in a jail for the rest of your life and not doing anything if you killed someone you should be killed one last person to think about

  18. #18
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    Eye for an eye!!

    Thanks BD15...you rule!!!

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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by sasuke is god
    Eye for an eye!!
    Err, that's why we invented the legal system in the first place: To avoid the vendettas eye for an eye caused, as they could last for generations. This is because no man is an island, there are always vindictive relatives ready to pass on the torch.

     
    How's that for a mixed metaphor?



    Hey look, Japan made a movie about me!

  20. #20
    LP fan Sasuke is God is infamous around these parts Sasuke is God is infamous around these parts Sasuke is God is infamous around these parts Sasuke is God is infamous around these parts Sasuke is God is infamous around these parts Sasuke is God is infamous around these parts Sasuke is God is infamous around these parts Sasuke is God is infamous around these parts Sasuke is God is infamous around these parts Sasuke is God is infamous around these parts Sasuke is God is infamous around these parts Sasuke is God's Avatar
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    true i never thought of it that way but still i vote for an eye for an eye policy!!

    Thanks BD15...you rule!!!

    To help those in need and to be a true friend! That is my nindo, my ninja way!

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  21. #21
    4: [Classified brah] Eris has a reputation beyond repute Eris has a reputation beyond repute Eris has a reputation beyond repute Eris has a reputation beyond repute Eris has a reputation beyond repute Eris has a reputation beyond repute Eris has a reputation beyond repute Eris has a reputation beyond repute Eris has a reputation beyond repute Eris has a reputation beyond repute Eris has a reputation beyond repute Eris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sasuke is god
    true i never thought of it that way but still i vote for an eye for an eye policy!!
    Well, that is your loss.



    Hey look, Japan made a movie about me!

  22. #22
    Hooker Boots yoko....... is infamous around these parts yoko....... is infamous around these parts yoko....... is infamous around these parts yoko....... is infamous around these parts yoko....... is infamous around these parts yoko....... is infamous around these parts yoko....... is infamous around these parts yoko....... is infamous around these parts yoko....... is infamous around these parts yoko....... is infamous around these parts yoko....... is infamous around these parts yoko.......'s Avatar
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    __________________________________________________ __________ I think they shouldn't go to prison for both cause first off ,my freind did the first one well the cop was his freind and he got off easy ,second i did the second one for a freind but it was a beer ! ^^

    __________________________________________________ __________

  23. #23
    SMEGMA!!!! Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku's Avatar
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    -Rep is a pathetic way for nerdy outcasted teens wearing hot topic clothes and pull thier dyed black hair over thier face to have a way to feel superior to someone. When in reality, they've already lost the battle just by going to the local hot topic in the first place.

    Now back on track.
    I think they shouldn't go to prison for both
    So you're saying that the person who drives 60 miles through 2 states and runs well over 2 dozen drivers off the road should not go to prison? Okay, let's all go see how many minivans we can cut off all day! What a jolly idea.

  24. #24
    Senior Member Ollie has a reputation beyond repute Ollie has a reputation beyond repute Ollie has a reputation beyond repute Ollie has a reputation beyond repute Ollie has a reputation beyond repute Ollie has a reputation beyond repute Ollie has a reputation beyond repute Ollie has a reputation beyond repute Ollie has a reputation beyond repute Ollie has a reputation beyond repute Ollie has a reputation beyond repute Ollie's Avatar
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    For the same reason why I think that the US states' governments needs to try being more liberal with use of the death sentence [and kinda why I also think assisted suicide should be legalized]. Sending someone to jail for so many years is not the most effective thing in terms of teaching good behavior, especially to others who think, "What the hell, I don't have much going for me right now and a few years in prison won't hurt me" and go ahead and do whatever illegal things they want to do and risk said jail time. However, thinking they'll lose a limb or their life suddenly makes the illegal thing or the desired outcome much less desireable.

    And personally, I think I'd rather die than live handicapped, although it depends on what kind of handicap. Today I saw some old pass-around type of chainmail with pictures of a girl who was in a car accident that caused her body to be covered 60% by severe burns. Now she has no fingers on her hands, no hair, she has to use eyedrops every day just so she doesn't go completely blind...she doesn't even look remotely human anymore. It's a revolting and pitiful sight.

    I don't think ^that^ type of punishment could ever be used, because that IS cruel and unusual punishment. Cutting off a hand or a finger would suck suck SUCK (to say the least), but a person can live through it. To be burned or attacked or anything so badly that you look like a lump of flesh with holes here and there to serve as eyes, mouth, nose, etc. is just...no, that could never happen. It's too horrid.

    I'm going off on a tangent now, so I'll stop. e_e;; *traumatized by those pictures of that girl*
    This post has been approved by Dancing Alec™



  25. #25
    SMEGMA!!!! Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku is infamous around these parts Sinnaku's Avatar
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    If you die then others suffer. If you live, then others are happy but you suffer. That's the lose - lose situations with horrid events like that. Depending on who you are, you'd want someone else to make up your mind for you. Giving them the decision to pull the plug or not (If you live but are mortally wounded).

    I would live in handicap so that I can stay with the people who can't bare to see me go. I know there's a lot, and it's far too much for me to demolish by a decision to pull the plug.

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