Marital Abuse, and Violence Against Women

[karasu13]

I think this is something that EVERYONE should be very much aware of.

Since the beginning of time, men have thought that women are below them, and should be kept pregnant, and barefoot, not allowed to work, and beaten everytime they disagree w/their husbands. The statistics aren't as bad as before, cuz more ppl are becoming aware of it, but little is being done to really stop it. Sure, there are shelters, but what about the women who aren't so lucky??
If a man beats his wife and children, and gets sent to jail, he only stays there for a while, and then goes back home, where he probably beats them much worse than he did before. However, if a woman kills her husband, to stop the beating from happening, then she gets thrown in jail for a sentence of 15 to life. Of course, I'm not saying it's right, but the man usually has it coming, cuz he makes her believe that there's no other way out, or that he'll kill her first.
A good example is the June Briand case of 1987. She killed her husband, because he found out that she was going to leave him, and she was convinced that he was going to kill her. She was convicted, and sentenced to jail for 15 to life, but only served 10, cuz she proved thet she was no threat to society. For more info on this case, there's a book by Robert Davidson, called Fighting Back. It's pretty-much just a biography on June, telling what led up to the killing, and what happened after.

[En Svensk Tiger]

Since the beginning of time, men have thought that women are below them, and should be kept pregnant, and barefoot, not allowed to work, and beaten everytime they disagree w/their husbands.

Source please? For the record:the beginning of time is a long time ago. Actually, the beginning of time is said to be at the beginning of the universe, when humans did not exist -.-

A good example is the June Briand case of 1987. She killed her husband, because he found out that she was going to leave him, and she was convinced that he was going to kill her. She was convicted, and sentenced to jail for 15 to life, but only served 10, cuz she proved thet she was no threat to society. For more info on this case, there's a book by Robert Davidson, called Fighting Back. It's pretty-much just a biography on June, telling what led up to the killing, and what happened after.

so every time a woman gets convinced that her husband is going to hurt her, she could kill him and get away with it?

Note that I think Violence against women is horrible, and should never occur, but I just have to go for the critical stance here, or else no discussion will come. I mean, no one actually likes beating up women? At least not at this forum. hopefully.

[Essex]

karasu13: These situations you speak of only accure (mostly) in the middle east and around the Missisipi-area... of course others do it elsewhere, but the way you derscribe it, every man does. That is not the fact.

I'm a very peacefull being and hitting anyone at all shouldn't be done. I don't know anyone who even would think of hitting their friends and never their girlfriend/boyfriend.

I'm more worried about the foreigners who bring their culture of female supressing to other countries. That's whats happening here in Norway... and if they get arrested for it, they call it racism...

[karasu13]

Source: My mother went through abuse from her father, and 2 of her husbands. Later in life (last year) she decided to take a Family Violence class, along with the other classes she was taking. During my vactions, she took me with her to these classes, and I learned quite a bit from it. I have also looked in my mother's text books for the class, and the June Briand book was their assigned reading.

I'm not saying that it's right to kill your husband for abusing you, but these women are convinced that they have no othe choice......

[Essex]

I my opinion child-abuse (either gender) is way worse than a man beating a woman (or the other way around for that sake). The adults have ways to defend them self. Children aren't always big enough to understand what happening to them. Adults are bigger than the children too

[karasu13]

I'm not saying that every man does it, I'm just saying that everyone should be informed about it, especially women. Also, it doesn't only happen in the Middle Eastern Nations, and Mississipi area. The June Briand case was in New Jersey, and my mother was born in Alaska, before her father decided to go to Texas.
There are also cases of ppl abusing their siblings, while they're growing up. My brother used to do the same to me, everyday. He said that he was teaching me how to defend myself, and while it has taught me how to fight, it has left more emotional scars than any other type of wounds. It has left me with a strong distrust of humans, even though I possess a strong need for affection.
I have also aquired my spontaineous homicidal and suicidal feelings from it. However, I would never want anyone to go through what my mother and myself had to go through. I would never harm another being without a really good reason, never without a warning first, and hardly ever for myself.

[Gil]

Marital abuse is bad, but I know many women that abuse their husbands, basically using them as work horses. I certainly see your point about how horrible it is. It really is. I couldn't live with myself if I ever laid a hand on a woman. Most men couldn't. The situation is unfair most certainly, but couldn't it be considered sexist that you are angry at men? You are right that it is unfair, but I feel like I'm being attacked just for being male. Whats worse is when parents (both men and abuse their children no less) take out their anger on their children, the group that truly has no chance to defend themselves.

[*Nosferatu-Adore]

Abuse isn't about genders; it's about people with different personalities who believe in different rights and wrongs. This thread is, though I agree people should be aware of violence, a tad sexist.
Note: Now there is women's movement; the majority of men no longer think we should be kept pregnant, et cetera. It's the 21st Century.

[aiko_chan]

Speaking from experience, in this regard, our legal system is VERY messed up. In a divorce case, if a father beats his children, or is emotionally abusive with them, they put the father though therepy to see if he can change. I don't have a problem with this except that children under the age of 14(in my state at least) are forced to go over to their fathers house WHILE he is undergoing therapy and still has an abusive nature. It's disgustingly ironic, since we teach our kids from the time they can walk and talk that if a grownup hurts them in any way, that adult will be punished of and the child won't have to deal with them anymore. This goes for teachers, coaches, and strangers; however, if a parent is abusive, the court system still forces the child to have visitation time (sometimes overnight) with the toxic parent. It makes me sick.

This goes for abusive mothers as well as fathers; I used fathers as an example, but I am well aware that mothers can be abusive, too.

[Jakiao]

Without reading any replies:

1. The idea of male superiority stems back to the age of Christ and even further. Most religions state in their contexts that men are superior to women. In the Muslim religion, it is stated that women should hide their faces and not bare their skin. One reason is because men are superior in that religion. The other reason often goes ignored: women are to hide their skin, hair, etc from other men to not be looked up as desired. My Muslim friends tell me that is to protect the women from rape.
2. When a man is beating his wife and child, no matter how badly beaten, the wife may never kill him unless he is about to kill her. People claim that a woman may kill her abuse husband in self-defense. Good luck with that. The laws of countries generally state that if a person is assaulting you, then you may have them arrested and tried. If a woman kills her abusive husband just because he is brutally abusing her, then she did not even consider the other options. In the US, if you could have called the police and had the person put in jail, but instead you kill that person, you cannot possibly plead self-defense.

Personally, I believe in equality. I have never looked at any one woman as being lower than me. Women scare me, so that gives them some form of power over me (as they have over most men). When I say they scare me, I'm scared because of the countless times I've been mauled by some friends of mine that are women (oh the pain x_X.

That's all I have to say! Nope, didn't read a single reply.

You always have a chance to get help before it gets to the point of killing to stay alive.

[Zedekiah]

Great.

Well, I agree with you on the part of informing, but as this is clearly biased by your fear and opinion of bad experience that leads to your premature conclusion and somewhat offending statement that hints to "men" in general, including every member of the male sex, as possible volatile beings that only seem to think of women as a piece of meat, boxing bag and what-not.

So it's kind of like the rascism thingy we have these days.
It shouldn't be accepted. Ever. And we should clearly inform those who's not "aware" of it. BUT there are limits. There is no reason to enforce fear by repeating the same message, even if it hurts the same when it once happened to you, to the point where prejudice takes the effect of instantly hating everything regarding the opposite sex out of fear and prejudice.
Like a woman hating men 'cause she's heard about how many men that beat, rape and abuse women. (Btw, thanks media. "A black was last night arrested for the [insert random crime]. Thus boosting fear. And love, let's not forget love)

Funny thing is, just a week ago or so, here in Norway, there was a case of a woman raping a man, second time so far in a span of 3 years here in Norway, and it got quite the attention, I'll tell you.

Now what's your opinion of that? Should I brand women as possible rapists due to what I heard?

I'm sorry to hear that you and those close to you have experienced such horrors. And I wish I somehow could make it all go away.
But is igniting "fear" in others the best way to make sure things like this won't happen again? After all, some take "information" a bit too serious and hardly reflects it themselves at all.

[Zingo]

Well, I don't look down on women. I think it's bad for the women. But many women doesn't tell anyone about their abuse. It's not their fault, but it can help them. There are women that is abusive too. But that's just how it is. Forget the gender issue, some people are cruel and enjoy seeing people suffer or feeling ill. And hitting or beating people makes them feel good. It's just sick.

I myself don't like violence in real life. I haven't been in a real fight in a long time. And I
hope I'll never hit or abuse my girlfriend, wife in the future. Violence doesn't solve anything, it just makes more conflicts.

And verbal abuse it just as bad. And people hitting/beating children is also bad.

[Yamcha]

I don't have any kind of vast knowledge on wife beating our child abuse. However what I do know is that it is usually passed on from parent to child. Not like hereditary; more like if a son watches his father beat his mother subconsciously the son picks it up. There are times where it is sporadic; but those cases are rare and few. However men aren't the only ones who "...have thought that women are below them..." Women mentally lower themselves also. To blame men entirely for this feeling of submitance is ignorant; especially in the time we're living in now. I'm not speaking on behalf of all women, or men. I'm voicing my own opinion, which is if u want change; you work for it. Don't rely on other people to change who you are and how you want to be treated for you. Every person is held acountable for their own decisions, weather they're right or wrong ones. Murder gets you no where, your husband, boyfriend, fiance is hitting you? Call the police, get a restraining order; don't go take your 45 and shot em. Men hit women and degrade them because they have little or no respect for themselves. They are insecure, and the only way they can make them feel good about themselves is to make someone else feel bad.

[gadgetgirl16]

I'm not saying that it's right to kill your husband for abusing you, but these women are convinced that they have no othe choice......

its called, get up and leave....leave the person who is abusing you and never turn back.....dont kill him b/c of that b/c u will be the one who will be charged with merder and you dont want that....call the police get everything to keep him away.......it dose help....instead going crazy after u kill him....

[Moved_to_new_account]

yeah, its called witness protection, or leave and go somewhere else.
but seroiously, I do believe its wrong

[Kyoto00]

I think that threw life that no women or child should be harmed in anyway!! I mean who dose that is just... bad mean and crul to take any person in to grant like that is just not right!

[Pakachu]

I think this is something that EVERYONE should be very much aware of.

Since the beginning of time, men have thought that women are below them, and should be kept pregnant, and barefoot, not allowed to work, and beaten everytime they disagree w/their husbands. The statistics aren't as bad as before, cuz more ppl are becoming aware of it, but little is being done to really stop it. Sure, there are shelters, but what about the women who aren't so lucky??

Gee... thanks. -_-#
whether you ment it or not that first paragraph sounds pretty condemming against all men.

If a man beats his wife and children, and gets sent to jail, he only stays there for a while, and then goes back home, where he probably beats them much worse than he did before. However, if a woman kills her husband, to stop the beating from happening, then she gets thrown in jail for a sentence of 15 to life. Of course, I'm not saying it's right, but the man usually has it coming, cuz he makes her believe that there's no other way out, or that he'll kill her first.
A good example is the June Briand case of 1987. She killed her husband, because he found out that she was going to leave him, and she was convinced that he was going to kill her. She was convicted, and sentenced to jail for 15 to life, but only served 10, cuz she proved thet she was no threat to society. For more info on this case, there's a book by Robert Davidson, called Fighting Back. It's pretty-much just a biography on June, telling what led up to the killing, and what happened after.

here however, i agree. Well... for the most part.
True its in self defense, but still as far as the law is concerned we're still talking about homicide here.
you have to prove that it was in self defense. thats the hard part

[Jakiao]

Just to restate: it is only self-defense if your life was in immediate danger. If you could have called the police, it isn't self-defense unless he is about to kill you. In most cases of abuse, the abuse lasts for months or years. There are plenty of chances to call the police.

[Pakachu]

the main problem with this kind of stuff is the mental abuse more so that the physical.
physical would be easy to run from but with the mental... the abuser useually makes the victim feel like its thier fault, that they deserve the abuse. therefore quite often they stay dispite all the crap.

That is the main reason most of my friends need never worry about going to jail for defending themselves from this crap. i'd gladly do it for them.
(Note: i've gotten very close to doing so already.)

[Janus Silverlock]

My love and I at one point had a running joke going that I was going to be abusive and an alcoholic and just this mean horrible husband... Just because of how I am, that would never be me. Ever. I can barely find it in me to hurt anything. I love her so much, I wouldn't ever dream of hitting her, or ever abusing her emotionally or mentally or whatever, I can't stand that kind of stuff, because for 7 years, from when I was 9 until I was 16, I had to deal with this guy... ARGH he sucked so much... He would keep us up all night every night just screaming at us for some bull that wasn't even that important, (he never physically abused us, but the mental and emotional abuse was HORRIBLE) I would never do that to someone I care about. I hate the idea that anyone out there can even consider hurting someone of the opposite sex... ever... It's not right. And let's not even get into rape... anyone who does that deserves to be castrated and allowed to live with the knowledge that they'll never have sex again. there's my 2 cents.

[Himura Enishi]

1. The idea of male superiority stems back to the age of Christ and even further. Most religions state in their contexts that men are superior to women. In the Muslim religion, it is stated that women should hide their faces and not bare their skin. One reason is because men are superior in that religion. The other reason often goes ignored: women are to hide their skin, hair, etc from other men to not be looked up as desired. My Muslim friends tell me that is to protect the women from rape.

Actually I believe the idea of male superiority is embedded in every man, like it or not. Women don't play in the NFL, NBA, etc., but instead have their own sports leagues, why? Let's face it, physically, men were created superior to woman. Men would hunt, woman would birth and watch after children, this was a basic structure of society at one point or another. We were both physiologically suited for these two differnt tasks and cannot deny it. Male's also (mostly) have a higher level of testosterone (sp?) which can cause elevated aggresive behavior. Women also have more an emotional attachement to relationship, again because of very old primal instincts. Women have a limited number of eggs that they can have children with, so psychilogically they want to find a mate that they feel will be able to support the family they're creating. Men on the other hand don't have that limitation, and need less a dependable relationship but more a healthy mate. Alright, I kinda segued there, but hopefully someone gets what I was trying to say.

[karasu13]

its called, get up and leave....leave the person who is abusing you and never turn back.....dont kill him b/c of that b/c u will be the one who will be charged with merder and you dont want that....call the police get everything to keep him away.......it dose help....instead going crazy after u kill him....

Three words :Battered Woman Syndrome.

[Yamcha]

Actually I believe the idea of male superiority is embedded in every man, like it or not. Women don't play in the NFL, NBA, etc., but instead have their own sports leagues, why? Let's face it, physically, men were created superior to woman. Men would hunt, woman would birth and watch after children, this was a basic structure of society at one point or another. We were both physiologically suited for these two differnt tasks and cannot deny it. Male's also (mostly) have a higher level of testosterone (sp?) which can cause elevated aggresive behavior. Women also have more an emotional attachement to relationship, again because of very old primal instincts. Women have a limited number of eggs that they can have children with, so psychilogically they want to find a mate that they feel will be able to support the family they're creating. Men on the other hand don't have that limitation, and need less a dependable relationship but more a healthy mate. Alright, I kinda segued there, but hopefully someone gets what I was trying to say.

Man you are all over the board here...but I'm only gonna focus on some of what u said. Yes men and women are built differently, but I don't think that we're too far physically. The only thing that is dividing us there is estrogen. Which is natrually abundant in men. But its also in women as well. But anyways, I still I'm not quite sure what your stance is. Or even what ur trying to say. So if u could please clarify. I'm not trying to make u angry or anything, I'm just interested on ur view point on the subject.

[karasu13]

Actually I believe the idea of male superiority is embedded in every man, like it or not. Women don't play in the NFL, NBA, etc., but instead have their own sports leagues, why? Let's face it, physically, men were created superior to woman. Men would hunt, woman would birth and watch after children, this was a basic structure of society at one point or another. We were both physiologically suited for these two differnt tasks and cannot deny it. Male's also (mostly) have a higher level of testosterone (sp?) which can cause elevated aggresive behavior. Women also have more an emotional attachement to relationship, again because of very old primal instincts. Women have a limited number of eggs that they can have children with, so psychilogically they want to find a mate that they feel will be able to support the family they're creating. Men on the other hand don't have that limitation, and need less a dependable relationship but more a healthy mate. Alright, I kinda segued there, but hopefully someone gets what I was trying to say.

NO, women DO play in the NBA, haven't you heard of the WNBA???
In Ancient China, women were the most feared and respected soldiers, and they were used because of their agile bodies. Because women are naturally smaller and more flexible than men, they made great soldiers. In the Celtic realigion, as well as Wicca (which I obviously know ALOT about), "women are highly respected, having many rights of property, person and status."
Also, I would like to see a man even TRY to go through monthly cramps and periods, as well as having a child.......A word of truth, you wouldn't last 2 seconds.


And Yamcha......
Woman=Estrogen
Man=Testosterone
That why men always want sex, and women can live longer w/o it.....

[Janus Silverlock]

Women don't play in the NFL, NBA, etc., but instead have their own sports leagues

Himura knew about the WNBA. He was stating that women do not play in the same league as men. I personally agree that women and men are not that different physically, and that the main difference is the testosterone/estrogen levels. A man can become more feminine by taking an estrogen supplement... same as a woman can become more masculine by taking testosterone. Our bodies are basically governed by our hormones. Men and women are not that different. And women do not deserve to be treated in abusive and hateful manners because of the fact that they are women.