Feels before Reals collides on college campus.

[Anoleis]

A language warning, the sounds made are vulgar, loud, and highly obnoxious.

An Arizona State student get's a little too physical with a fire and brimstone preacher. Preacher's bodyguard\acquainted bystander\dude in the red shirt tosses kid to the ground. Kid then freaks out; blood curdling screams as he goes after dude in the red shirt. A small tussle later, and the kid settle for screaming "Your sign is offensive!" "It's hate speech, you're provoking assault!" [paraphrased a little] As far as I can figure out the sign read somethings about judgement day, thieves, masturbation, liars, drunkards, fornicators, and homosexuals; the usual things that get you acquainted with God's fiery wrath.

Apparently, some of ASU's other students who are seeing this on the web are hopeful that this will get the fire and brimstone preachers off campus. So, the college gets to trek the fun grey area of free speech and what is deemed too offensive for their campus.

[Qoco]

First of all, school is not the place for these protests and secondly, that kid is a moron. Both parties deserve to wear the dunce hat.

[Anoleis]

First of all, school is not the place for these protests

Technically, campus is the place for these protests. He does have a legal right to be there.

When I want someone off the campus, I just make their life on campus a miserable hell.

It's lucky for Joe Banshee that this preacher wasn't a litigious money vacuum like the WBC.

[Qoco]

Technically, campus is the place for these protests. He does have a legal right to be there.

You go to school to study and to prepare for the future, not to protest about whatever the guy was protesting about. I wanted to go back and look but the video got removed. I will just assume that it was about the things you mentioned in the OP, which do not fall in accordance with the place that it is being done.

As far as I can figure out the sign read somethings about judgement day, thieves, masturbation, liars, drunkards, fornicators, and homosexuals; the usual things that get you acquainted with God's fiery wrath.

It may or may not be legal, but what matters is that it is socially unsatisfactory and will bring controversy in a place like a school campus, where young and ignorant people go to. As a matter of fact, if I were there studying, doing my school work and minding my own business, and I saw some fat guy swinging signs at me with content on the signs like the ones that you mentioned, I would say that he is disturbing my peace, as a student that is there to follow the purpose of the school and not for other reasons like being selfish by trying to force my personal beliefs into other people who do not care about them, as they are not there for that. There is a time and place for everything.

[.:neuko:.]

You go to school to study and to prepare for the future, not to protest about whatever the guy was protesting about. I wanted to go back and look but the video got removed. I will just assume that it was about the things you mentioned in the OP, which do not fall in accordance with the place that it is being done.

It may or may not be legal, but what matters is that it is socially unsatisfactory and will bring controversy in a place like a school campus, where young and ignorant people go to. As a matter of fact, if I were there studying, doing my school work and minding my own business, and I saw some fat guy swinging signs at me with content on the signs like the ones that you mentioned, I would say that he is disturbing my peace, as a student that is there to follow the purpose of the school and not for other reasons like being selfish by trying to force my personal beliefs into other people who do not care about them, as they are not there for that. There is a time and place for everything.

Unfortunately, it seems that YouTube has removed the video, so I can only base my comment on the OP's text.

Anyway, I totally agree with you. Normally I would champion anyone's right to freedom of speech, but not like this. And I loathe the idea of any adult purposely taking advantage of some kid who simply isn't mature enough to have the fear of God put into them. Sure, the kid could have handled the situation better and the physical attack on the priest was completely unnecessary. That said, I can hardly feel sorry for the priest who had no relevant reason to be on the campus in the first place, legally permitted or not. So what if his actions were technically within the law? Doesn't change the fact that his actions were also breaching one's entitlement to a decent education. Suppose I went to his church, hung around his premises, and then started waving signs of anti-religious messages encouraging spiritism and the summoning of demons--and then used the legal system as a crutch by playing the right-to-freedom-of-speech card? Yeah... highly doubt that excuse would have sailed with flying colours there. Nope, as far as I'm concerned that was effectively restricted property he was on and he crossed the line when he started intruding on one's real opportunity for study, however lawful and maybe peripheral his actions may have been. While I don't condone the student's handling of the situation (as I said, he could have handled it better), he has at least one defense, he's an inexperienced kid; it's the adult who should have known better. To me this whole situation is barely any different to someone kicking a ball into someone's else's back yard, and then complaining because they got savagely mauled by the property owner's guard dog as they hopped over the fence to retrieve their ball. The problem with that complaint is, they had other less intrusive options and no real reason to be there in the first place.

[Anoleis]

I wanted to go back and look but the video got removed. I will just assume that it was about the things you mentioned in the OP, which do not fall in accordance with the place that it is being done.

Unfortunately, it seems that YouTube has removed the video, so I can only base my comment on the OP's text.

Here's the video.

You go to school to study and to prepare for the future, not to protest about whatever the guy was protesting about.

College is not just about the classes. College campuses are not limited to strict study. How is this any different than kids with Green Peace other than their message is less "offensive." What about all the research and activism that happens at college? Not all of that is "to study and prepare for the future."

It may or may not be legal, but what matters is that it is socially unsatisfactory and will bring controversy in a place like a school campus, where young and ignorant people go to.

Wait what? It's legal, but it shouldn't be because there are stupid people who can't control themselves? You do realize that's a "valid" argument to banning just about anything from knives to booze?

As a matter of fact, if I were there studying, doing my school work and minding my own business, and I saw some fat guy swinging signs at me with content on the signs like the ones that you mentioned, I would say that he is disturbing my peace, as a student that is there to follow the purpose of the school and not for other reasons like being selfish by trying to force my personal beliefs into other people who do not care about them, as they are not there for that.

This guy isn't swinging his sign at anyone. He has the legal right to be there, where as you do not have the right to decide that your offended state is an excuse to act like a toddler.

Anyway, I totally agree with you. Normally I would champion anyone's right to freedom of speech, but not like this.

Holding signs is some new heinous form of speech?

And I loathe the idea of any adult purposely taking advantage of some kid who simply isn't mature enough to have the fear of God put into them.

Okay, you haven't watched the video, so I'm going to overlook some of your post that the video might clear up.

Doesn't change the fact that his actions were also breaching one's entitlement to a decent education.

A preacher holding a sign does not breach his entitlement to a decent education. His inability to cope with differing opinions is his problem, not the preacher's.

Suppose I went to his church, hung around his premises, and then started waving signs of anti-religious messages encouraging spiritism and the summoning of demons--and then used the legal system as a crutch by playing the right-to-freedom-of-speech card?

Church premises are private property; your analogy is flawed. Atheists on campus happen often.

Nope, as far as I'm concerned that was effectively restricted property he was on and he crossed the line when he started intruding on one's real opportunity for study

Too bad as far as you are concerned you are wrong. The guy is outside in an actually public area, there's nothing effectively restricted about it.

he has at least one defense, he's an inexperienced kid; it's the adult who should have known better.

Known better than to what; exercise his right to speak? The kid is not inexperienced. He's childish to a degree that he can't properly control his actions.

[DeathBlade/13.666]

Technically, campus is the place for these protests. He does have a legal right to be there.


It's lucky for Joe Banshee that this preacher wasn't a litigious money vacuum like the WBC.

Just have the college marching band practice around him, so all that is heard is sweet music instead of preaching. The Band Director won't mind, because it's extra practicing for the band members.

[Wio]

Just have the college marching band practice around him, so all that is heard is sweet music instead of preaching. The Band Director won't mind, because it's extra practicing for the band members.

Well, it's an upgrade from using violence, but it still is childish. It sounds as though you are afraid of other people hearing his message because you don't like it. Are you scared that some people will hear his ideas and agree with them?

[Anoleis]

Just have the college marching band practice around him, so all that is heard is sweet music instead of preaching. The Band Director won't mind, because it's extra practicing for the band members.

You'll have to forgive my negligence, but it is my understanding that some colleges have "fixed" this by providing Free Speech areas. Of course, then you get to this story. The source is just what I pulled up on google, you'll find a similar story just about everywhere.

[sunnyside]

While I'll grant they're technically assault, those cases are barely so. At least it sounds like the teacher is being charged.

That said you do rather expect that sort of thing to happen around protests. Actually I take it as a point of pride that reports on protests generally aren't followed by a "killed and injured count" as they are in much of the world.

It's only worth bringing up in these cases because of the possible hypocrisy of the stereotype of the sorts of people who would oppose those signs. (Though for all we know those individuals follow a violent strain of anarchism and are internally consistent.) Engaging in violence against people saying things you don't like is historically pretty much "normal" for humanity.

It may or may not be legal, but what matters is that it is socially unsatisfactory and will bring controversy in a place like a school campus, where young and ignorant people go to.

as far as I'm concerned that was effectively restricted property he was on and he crossed the line when he started intruding on one's real opportunity for study, however lawful and maybe peripheral his actions may have been. While I don't condone the student's handling of the situation (as I said, he could have handled it better), he has at least one defense, he's an inexperienced kid; it's the adult who should have known better.

Just because an area is public that does not mean it can't be restricted. It is restricted in the sense that it is part of a vital educational institution, not some casual public environment like a town square (and even in the latter, depending on the country, you can't just publicly convey the wrath of God).

I commend your studiousness.

However (at least in the US) college are places of controversy. In the sense that to graduate you are almost certainly going to be required to take some classes along the lines of "diversity" and also "international perspectives". Those courses will often have "challenge students thinking" or "controversy" in their titles or descriptions. I don't know if they're just common or required for accreditation these days.

The university probably also has a "diversity statement" or somesuch that will include something about exposing students to and respecting all differences or something like that.

Now most universities are actually private property, I think even the roads. They can ask you to leave. But to a limited extent that want to facilitate a measure of protest or people doing odd stuff and so will have free speech zones, a permitting system, or some mechanism. Presumably the protesters are availing themselves of those opportunities.

[DeathBlade/13.666]

Well, it's an upgrade from using violence, but it still is childish. It sounds as though you are afraid of other people hearing his message because you don't like it. Are you scared that some people will hear his ideas and agree with them?

Yes it's absolutely childish, but it's not because I'm afraid of hearing or others hearing the message. It's because I've heard it all before. It's Fire and Brimstone. The message hasn't changed since the 1800's. And those that typically preach and follow it have a serious lack of understanding of the bible.

You'll have to forgive my negligence, but it is my understanding that some colleges have "fixed" this by providing Free Speech areas. Of course, then you get to this story. The source is just what I pulled up on google, you'll find a similar story just about everywhere.

>.>; Sorry your statement has been lost due to me now hearing that there's a professor in porn... Which means there's a PhD in porn... Which means I'm gonna go get me a doctorate. XD J/K. That is true, but there's nothing against a marching band drowning out speech in free speech areas. Or people can take note from the Native Hawaiians and put pennies in their ears. All else fails, use a "Wrap-it-Up" box.

[DeathBlade/13.666]

When I want someone off the campus, I just make their life on campus a miserable hell.

[International 4-8818]

I mean, technically the guy has the right to say whatever he wants but the student did not uhhh "play it cool" and just looks like an donkey.

[Nervous]

If people could protest on a campus then, why not now? In my opinion a campus is a great place to protest. So long as its nowhere near the Ohio National Guard.

[Wio]

There was a time in progressives abhorred censorship and championed freedom of speech, but these days they just cannot stand it.

[Animedude5555]

Video removed. Please repost the video, preferably on a different video site. Youtube's rules suck a$$.

[AllHopeInEclipse]

An Arizona State student...

Found your problem. It's not just because I'm a fan and former University of Arizona student. They had a student body president a few years back who said they needed to work on the image of the school, and within the same month appeared in a porn flick online.

Link for reference, was a student VP.

http://wc.arizona.edu/papers/96/1/01_5.html