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View Poll Results: Your opinion on Cowboy Bebop?

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  • (Americans) Best Show Ever

    1 16.67%
  • (Americans) Good but nothing Special

    2 33.33%
  • (Americans) Oridinary or Bad

    1 16.67%
  • ( Non- Americans) Best Show Ever

    0 0%
  • (Non-Americans) Good but nothing Special

    1 16.67%
  • (Non Americans) Ordinary or bad

    1 16.67%
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Thread: So whats the hipe with Cowboy Bebop

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    Default So whats the hipe with Cowboy Bebop

    So after rewatching the series - now I saw it two or three times - I still cant find any sign of its "greatness" or this "best anime of all time" feeling many anime fans keep to bable about.

    1. In my opinion it only became so popular because it was the first anime of its kind (space western) aimed exclusively for an American audience - In Japan the anime was a flop and in Europe it wasnt very popular either.

    2. What makes it so epic?? Its episodic without a plot, it doesnt really have a main villain, the characters dont have any special abilities , nor are they anything special themselves. They just experience random adventures - defeating the enemy of the week.

    For a 26 episode anime theres just to few character - if I count the dog and vicious then theres 6 or so. And since I hate blues and jazz I found the soundtrack to be most painfull for my ears.

    Theres allmost no comedy ( the cowboy episode beeing perhaps an exception) and no drama - just some action - other animes like Code geass make you cry and laugh regulary - while CB manages this not at all (in my case) or rarely

    The english dub is good - granted - But the animation didnt strike me as superb either.
    Blue submarine No 6 came out roughly at the same time and had WAY better animation.

    IMO CB really cant compare to Death Note, Code Geass, Clannad, Steins gate or the other top tier animes which came out recently.

    In terms of suspence, entertainment, soundtrack, action, story, drama and character development there are animes which are way better than CB - so please enlighten me - what do CB fans see in this series which would justify the often used title of "best anime of all times"???

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    Default Re: So whats the hipe with Cowboy Bebop

    I liked it, it had great characters and some cool action scenes the story was good.

    I share the same opinion as in it's not one of the "top anime of all times" but it's still an amazing anime and a classic.

    but it may be a "best anime" to some so you should always respect their opinions too.
    Last edited by SkyKyz; 09-03-2012 at 08:13 PM.

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    Default Re: So whats the hipe with Cowboy Bebop

    Quote Originally Posted by Reviewer03 View Post
    1. In my opinion it only became so popular because it was the first anime of its kind (space western) aimed exclusively for an American audience - In Japan the anime was a flop and in Europe it wasnt very popular either.
    Just because it wasn't popular in Japan or in Europe, doesn't mean it isn't great. Different cultures have difference sensibilities. Big O and FLCL flopped in Japan, Cowboy Bebop was regarded as average.

    Cowboy Bebop is set in a world different from most other anime, with callbacks to old noir and western films, and filled with older styles of American music such as jazz, bebop, and big band. These sort of things are going to appeal far more to a more Western audience than to a Japanese one. The Japanese audience at the time was also caught up in the craze of high sci-fi modern-setting series that followed in the wake of Evangelion, and really set the stage for the next decade of anime. Cowboy Bebop was really the tail-end of 90s-styled anime.

    2. What makes it so epic?? Its episodic without a plot, it doesnt really have a main villain, the characters dont have any special abilities , nor are they anything special themselves. They just experience random adventures - defeating the enemy of the week.
    It's epic in the sense that it is a great story, spanning the solar system, about a few down on their luck individuals facing up to their pasts. The story is, at its core, about their pasts, not about defeating some enemy-of-the-week. Each episode - each "enemy of the week" being a plot device within the episode - reveals something new about a character; their pasts, their character traits, their likes and dislikes, and their interactions with one another. In this sense, it doesn't need a main villain, they don't need special abilities, and they don't really need to be special. It isn't a shounen series, and it's made to get you thinking about the show as much as it is about entertainment through action or some great conflict. Jet has to deal with betrayal and with not being the man he wants to be. Faye must deal with not knowing who she is; not having a sense of self. Spike must deal with the wrongs he committed and the life and responsibilities he had left behind.

    For a 26 episode anime theres just to few character - if I count the dog and vicious then theres 6 or so. And since I hate blues and jazz I found the soundtrack to be most painfull for my ears.
    A 26 episode series doesn't need a lot of characters; this is a flaw with a lot of modern anime, shoehorning in characters instead of creating and developing a good few that aren't complete archetypes. Each primary and secondary character is well developed and fully realized, and it is less about the drama in the lives of these characters (as in the series you have listed), and more about introspection. It's a story of people, not of events. Your dislike of the soundtrack is completely subjective - of course you wouldn't like it if you don't like blues or jazz. That being said, as examples of blues, jazz, gospel, and big band go, the music of Cowboy Bebop is incredible.

    Theres allmost no comedy ( the cowboy episode beeing perhaps an exception) and no drama - just some action - other animes like Code geass make you cry and laugh regulary - while CB manages this not at all (in my case) or rarely
    There's a great deal of comedy. It's just not slapstick. It's not handed to you. It's often through situational dialogue, or through irony - it isn't forced on the viewer, but it's there. And, you're right. There's very little drama. Drama-packed anime were more of a rarity until the angst and drama of Evangelion caught on at the end of the 90s, resulting in most modern anime being more like soap operas. It doesn't need to make the viewer cry, it doesn't need to make them laugh out loud. It's made to appeal to an older, more mature audience than a show like Code Geass - an audience that can feel sadness and happiness without melodrama, without the need for a shocking ending every episode; thing start and are concluded, bringing with it the bittersweetness of things coming to an end. That being said, Cowboy Bebop isn't a comedy series. It isn't trying to be. It's more along the lines of film noir. Light on the surface, but heavy underneath, relying heavily on setting and atmosphere and tone to convey its meaning to the viewer over character drama.

    The english dub is good - granted - But the animation didnt strike me as superb either.
    Blue submarine No 6 came out roughly at the same time and had WAY better animation.
    The english dub is one of the better english dubs to have ever been produced, alongside the likes of the various entries in the Ghost in the Shell series and Studio Ghibli films.

    IMO CB really cant compare to Death Note, Code Geass, Clannad, Steins gate or the other top tier animes which came out recently.
    Anime directed at a much different audience. Cowboy Bebop was made for adults. Not adults who watch anime; adults. Death Note, Code Geass, Clannad, and Stein's Gate were made for an anime-centric audience. They're made for and pander to otaku. Death Note is a standard shounen series, designed to appeal to males in their mid teen years. It supplies high drama, suspense, the threat of impending doom, etc. It's meant to keep the viewer on their edge of their seat. Code Geass was made strictly for an otaku audience; it tries to include everything in order to do so. Mecha? fanservice? Slapstick? Mountains of melodrama? Angsty teenagers? Lolis? Rebellion? The feeling of being vilified, being special and better than everyone else around you? It strictly panders to anime-viewers in their mid-to-late teens. The animation was good, but only because of its phenomenal budget and in-show marketing - the character designs were poor (see: CLAMP Noodle People), and while the direction was dramatic and made to entertain, it often forget itself and the "reality" of the show. Clannad is pure, unadulterated melodrama for otaku. Nothing more. It hinges entirely on a late-teen, early-adult male that will latch onto the female characters of the show, and without that, the show loses any value it had - it simple can't appeal en masse to an audience other than that which it targeted. Stein's Gate is similar; it targets the same audience - late-teens and young adult anime-viewers (otaku) that want to be they are special and apart of something larger than themselves - the suspenseful mystery, the beautiful women, etc. The lead character is essentially a Mary Sue figure for the otaku viewers to project themselves onto. If you fall outside that demographic, the show loses its value. These aren't "great" anime. They're good anime, they're popular anime. But they're perceived this way because of how far they go out of their way to pander to their audience. Think of it this way - The Expendables is not a good film. But to it's target demographic - men who want to be macho, manly men - it's viewed as good or great.

    Cowboy Bebop on the other hand, has mass appeal. Anyone, a regular anime viewer or not, can sit down to watch it, and enjoy it for exactly what it is. It doesn't take particularly special interest, or a particular gender, or a particular lifestyle, or even a particular age to enjoy.

    In terms of suspence, entertainment, soundtrack, action, story, drama and character development there are animes which are way better than CB - so please enlighten me - what do CB fans see in this series which would justify the often used title of "best anime of all times"???
    You'd be hard pressed to find an anime with a better story than Cowboy Bebop. Ghost in the Shell? Grave of the Fireflies? Some Ghibli film? Yeah. It ranks among the best. But it doesn't need suspense. It doesn't need over the top action. It doesn't need melodrama. It doesn't even need substantial character development, as it's characters are full grown adults. They aren't dealing with a present conflict that requires them to grow, they aren't coming of age. They're dealing with who they were previously, with their past selves.

    I wouldn't say Cowboy Bebop is the "best anime of all time". But it should certainly be in consideration for it.



    You're trying to judge a show not by what it wants to be or by what it tries to be, but by what other shows what themselves to be. You are a poor reviewer.
    Last edited by Gjallarhorn; 09-03-2012 at 04:49 PM.

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    Default Re: So whats the hipe with Cowboy Bebop

    I have never watched Cowboy Bebop. The genre doesn't appeal to me in
    the first place. Space Western sounds even worst. Sorry if I kind of stupid
    for not even trying to watch it but, it just doesn't sound appealing.
    Also I agree with you Gjallhorn. There doesn't need to be tons of
    characters in a 26 episode anime. If it is that short there doesn't
    need to be a million characters.
    Last edited by ~Travis; 09-03-2012 at 05:09 PM.

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    Default Re: So whats the hipe with Cowboy Bebop

    y u censor me, kyky?

    I've seen several episodes of the show by accident. It's uh.. Got a lot of jazz in it. Jazz is weird. I like the style of the show (but not in particular the art style) and think it might have been a cool show if they'd made a live action version of the show.

    Oh wait, they did. //2

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    Default Re: So whats the hipe with Cowboy Bebop

    Quote Originally Posted by Gjallarhorn View Post

    Just because it wasn't popular in Japan or in Europe, doesn't mean it isn't great.

    Cowboy Bebop was made for adults.

    You'd be hard pressed to find an anime with a better story than Cowboy Bebop.

    You're trying to judge a show not by what it wants to be or by what it tries to be, but by what other shows what themselves to be. You are a poor reviewer.
    1. Just because it was popular in America doesnt mean it is great.

    2. Since you argue that all the animes listed are made for otakus or teenagers - I could argue that CB was made for Western loving American kids
    Winnetou is a movie made for adults - yet most viewers were kids.
    And there are a lot of animes made for Adults out there who appeared bouth before and after CB with a great story - yet they didnt become so famous.

    3. Not at all - pretty much EVERY anime out there has a better story than CB - since CB doesnt have a story at all - just random episodeic episodes like the Simpsons, or sponge bob.

    4. Oh cant even stay civil - your a poor admin/moderator. And BTW You can only judge a show by comparison - and fact is that CB cant reach the level of some other series - be it animes for adults or otakus as you claim.
    Last edited by Reviewer03; 09-03-2012 at 05:15 PM.

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    Default Re: So whats the hipe with Cowboy Bebop

    Well I first saw Cowboy Bebop waaaaaaaaayyyyy after it's original release date being as I first saw it last year in like June. I only happened to catch it one night on AS.

    I happen to really like the characters, they're likable and there aren't any whiny girls crying about how they want to help but are utterly useless (I'm looking at you Orihime)

    I also happen to really love jazz and blues music so the soundtrack to me is amazing!

    I don't think it's the greatest anime ever made but I do think it's very well done and enjoyable to watch

    oh! and you spelled hype wrong lol
    Last edited by AshureeChan; 09-03-2012 at 08:14 PM.


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    Default Re: So whats the hipe with Cowboy Bebop

    Quote Originally Posted by Reviewer03 View Post
    1. Just because it was popular in America doesnt mean it is great.
    Are you looking for an objective definition of "great"? Americans thinks it's great. The Japanese think it's average.

    Quote Originally Posted by Reviewer03 View Post
    And there are a lot of animes made for Adults out there who appeared bouth before and after CB with a great story - yet they didnt become so famous.
    Because they weren't as good. People didn't connect with them as much; they didn't find the same meaning in these other series as in Bebop. Perhaps they didn't withstand the test of time, or they lacked in other areas in which Cowboy Bebop didn't. Cowboy Bebop had a fantastic soundtrack, great, handdrawn animation, great direction, great art direction, and meaning. All of these elements together are what make it great; it wasn't lacking in anything. Perhaps something had a better story, but poor dialogue and poor characterization - it's going to be more forgettable.

    Quote Originally Posted by Reviewer03 View Post
    since CB doesnt have a story at all - just random episodeic episodes like the Simpsons, or sponge bob.
    The story is each of the primary characters, Spike, Jet, and Faye, dealing with their pasts. Jet deals with his old cop buddies and comes to terms with his life as an adult, alluded to in his continuing bonzai tree trimmings. Faye learns about her past, and by the end realizes it wasn't that important to who she was as she thought - alluded to during her final conversation with Spike as he leaves the Bebop. Spike has to settle things with Vicious and pacify the Red Dragon Syndicate. Each of these stories are told in parts contained within the episodic episodes, usually with an episode at the end of each of their story arcs that brings it to a conclusion. Faye's video from her childhood and her run-in with the con artist. Jet helping his friend's daughter, and dealing with the assassin and rogue cop that betrayed him. Spikes is the most apparent, being the prologue to the series, The Ballad of Fallen Angels, Waltz for Venus, Jupiter Jazz, and The Real Folk Blues parts 1 and 2. Even in the seemingly random episodes, there's minor references to the on-goings of the Red Dragon syndicate.

    4. Oh cant even stay civil - your a poor admin/moderator. And BTW You can only judge a show by comparison - and fact is that CB cant reach the level of some other series - be it animes for adults or otakus as you claim.
    I'm typing serious replies to your very obvious baiting, so yeah, poor me. And I am being perfectly civil; and perfectly honest. You're a poor reviewer. You couldn't even identify the plot of Cowboy Bebop. It's aim, it's meaning. You said it was about nothing. You said the soundtrack is bad because you don't like jazz or blues. It would appear you never even tried to analyze it, or to seriously review it. But, of course you didn't, given that you're trolling. As for judging it by comparison, you can say "Code Geass was more melodramatic than Cowbop Bebop." You can't say "Cowboy Bebop isn't good because it isn't as melodramatic as Code Geass." They're different series with different goals. What was the aim of each series? How did it attempt to reach its goals? Did it reach its goals? These are the questions reviewer must ask about the series. "Did Cowboy Bebop meet the goals Code Geass set in emphasizing the relationships between its characters with over-the-top melodrama?" is meaningless. You can make a comparison for reference, and to highlight what something did right or wrong, but you are comparing subjective qualities of one series with the subjective qualities of another with a different point and with a different target audience.

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    Default Re: So whats the hipe with Cowboy Bebop

    Personally, I'm rather fond of Bepop. I love the characters, and the fact that they actually develop as the story progresses. There's a subtlety to the overall story, sadly not everyone can appreciate that. I can also identify with them on some levels. There are things I've done that I'm not proud of, I'm nowhere near where I want to be in my life, and currently I'm living paycheck to paycheck. It's no wonder Bepop has faired so well with American audiences.
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    Default Re: So whats the hipe with Cowboy Bebop

    Well, it doesn't have to be popular here or there. Just being popular overall, does that make that great? Does that make Naruto the best anime of all time them because of its mass appeal? Most certainly not. It just has a big audience.

    Jojo's Bizarre Adventure doesn't have a following outside of Japan, and yet it is huge in Japan. Does that make it great? No.

    Certain things appeal to different people. Maybe in the end, Cowboy Bebop wasn't for you like how it was for someone else.

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    Default Re: So whats the hipe with Cowboy Bebop

    the poll doesn't have enough options lol
    its not the best show ever, but there is something special about it
    Hmmm... Been a while
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    Default Re: So whats the hipe with Cowboy Bebop

    Quote Originally Posted by ParaParaJMo2 View Post
    Certain things appeal to different people. Maybe in the end, Cowboy Bebop wasn't for you like how it was for someone else.
    Not really - I am attacking and criticising the series - But I loved the movie.

    Bouth are CB - yet the Movie is so much better than the Series because it has a plot and/or a main villain.

    If the entire series would have been like the movie I could understand all the praise.

    But since the Series is lacking bouth a main villain/plot and is episodic with a collection of random episodes - and everything else that made the movie great - I ask why it is considered so great?

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    Default Re: So whats the hipe with Cowboy Bebop

    Quote Originally Posted by Reviewer03 View Post
    ...I am attacking and criticising the series...

    But since the Series is lacking bouth a main villain/plot and is episodic with a collection of random episodes - and everything else that made the movie great - I ask why it is considered so great?
    Okay sir, I'm siding with Gjallerhorn on this one because now you are just being a troll. You are not even debating with people. You are just forcing your opinion down our throats and trying to brow-beat into complying with your 'opinion'. Now kindly go be a troll elsewhere. Like your own blog so you can control other peoples comments so they look like everyone sides with you.
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  17. #14
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    Default Re: So whats the hipe with Cowboy Bebop

    Quote Originally Posted by marvel_phoenix View Post
    You are just forcing your opinion down our throats and trying to brow-beat into complying with your 'opinion'........ Now kindly go be a troll elsewhere. Like your own blog so you can control other peoples comments so they look like everyone sides with you.
    Better an accused troll then a would like to be dictator who wants to ban and get rid of people with a different opinion!

  18. #15
    Senior Member marvel_phoenix has a reputation beyond repute marvel_phoenix has a reputation beyond repute marvel_phoenix has a reputation beyond repute marvel_phoenix has a reputation beyond repute marvel_phoenix has a reputation beyond repute marvel_phoenix has a reputation beyond repute marvel_phoenix has a reputation beyond repute marvel_phoenix has a reputation beyond repute marvel_phoenix has a reputation beyond repute marvel_phoenix has a reputation beyond repute marvel_phoenix has a reputation beyond repute marvel_phoenix's Avatar
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    Default Re: So whats the hipe with Cowboy Bebop

    Quote Originally Posted by Reviewer03 View Post
    Better an accused troll then a would like to be dictator who wants to ban and get rid of people with a different opinion!
    I never once said that you should be banned. I'm just saying that you are trying to provoke people and that I have grown tired of you. So go, shoo.
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  19. #16
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    Default Re: So whats the hipe with Cowboy Bebop

    Quote Originally Posted by marvel_phoenix View Post
    I never once said that you should be banned. I'm just saying that you are trying to provoke people and that I have grown tired of you. So go, shoo.
    Well if you grown tired of this thread and accuse me of trolling - stay away from this thread- shoo, shoo!

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