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Robin Sena
09-24-2009, 05:37 PM
I didn't know where to put it but.......if a Shinigami is a death god, what would a life god be in Nihongo?

fatalReflex77
09-24-2009, 05:40 PM
ahh...I think it would be ...kamisama........*GOD*

Aku no Hikari
09-24-2009, 06:16 PM
I'm not really sure. But I think it's most likely seigami 生神 or ikigami 生き神.

Datenshi
09-24-2009, 06:16 PM
The term Shinigami isn't a word native to the Japanese dialect, but a translation of the Western concept of Death personified (i.e. The Grim Reaper (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_(personification))). The word "Shinigami" is relatively new to the Japanese vocabulary, and since the figure of the Shinigami itself doesn't appear in Japanese mythology, there is no word for it's counterpart.

The closest figure is probably Izanami, the god(ess) of death (who rules the underworld, much like the Greek Hades), and Izanagi, the deity of life and birth.

*edit* Damn, I swear I typed Izanagi. Thanks for pointing that out.

Ryusui
09-26-2009, 02:11 AM
You mean Izanami and Izanagi. Trust me, they'll become second nature once you've played Persona 4. :3

But yeah, "Shinigami" is an imported concept; they didn't hit upon the idea of anthropomorphizing death until Westerners introduced it to them.

Robin Sena
09-29-2009, 03:12 AM
Could be the first new introduction in centuries......

Ryusui
09-30-2009, 10:38 PM
The Portuguese had quite an impact. Hell, they were the ones who invented tempura.

Vagrere
10-04-2009, 06:05 PM
The things we learn by reading curry manga...
Or was that just me? >_>

But if you just wanted to make a fictional concept that would be the opposite of the concept of a shinigami, then I'd go with the "生き神" (ikigami) suggested previously. But there's no personified concept of life in any culture that I'm aware of.

Which is a little weird.

Haru no Megumi
10-11-2009, 12:26 AM
shinigami is the god of death i think,but people would mosty always call god 'kami' in japanese.'sama' is for people you respect so thats why you put 'sama' at the end of 'kami'.

ArtemisA
10-11-2009, 01:15 AM
I think it would be confusing if it was 生き神 [ikigami], since that seems to be an actual term. My 和英 gives it as "living god", and goo's 国語辞典 clarifies/confirms it as like a god incarnate or virtuous/revered/godly person (entry here (http://dictionary.goo.ne.jp/leaf/jn/8056/m0u/生き神/)).

So, maybe 生神 [seigami]? (Though I hate when on and kun'yomi are mixed, dang kanji... xD)

...Actually, would 命神 [inochigami] make sense? Literally being "life god" I'd think it would, kedo...
(Or is it "inochikami"...? Where is my Japanese linguistics text... Maybe I should just sleep now...)

Haru no Megumi
10-11-2009, 12:21 PM
people call god 'kami' in japanese. but if you want it to be life god then it would be 'ikigami'.
inochigami. . .it sounds pretty good. . .but puting it together. . .sounds a bit strange. . .

Bibi of the Blue Sea
10-11-2009, 01:44 PM
I thought the term "shinigami" was the translation for the Western concept of Grim Reaper or Angel of Death. If that's the case, then the Western equivalent for a life god would just be the normal God (since He is creator of life, but He sends the Angel of Death to reclaim His souls). Hmm, I guess I did learn something sort of useful at bible school.

ArtemisA
10-11-2009, 05:01 PM
@Bibi: Well, technically, but that's no fun. xD

Vagrere
10-12-2009, 11:34 PM
I think it would be confusing if it was 生き神 [ikigami], since that seems to be an actual term. My 和英 gives it as "living god", and goo's 国語辞典 clarifies/confirms it as like a god incarnate or virtuous/revered/godly person (entry here (http://dictionary.goo.ne.jp/leaf/jn/8056/m0u/%E7%94%9F%E3%81%8D%E7%A5%9E/)).

So, maybe 生神 [seigami]? (Though I hate when on and kun'yomi are mixed, dang kanji... xD)

...Actually, would 命神 [inochigami] make sense? Literally being "life god" I'd think it would, kedo...
(Or is it "inochikami"...? Where is my Japanese linguistics text... Maybe I should just sleep now...)

Aha, I was just thinking of parallel construction. In that case, perhaps Seishin or Shoushin would be more palatable readings for 生神? Though I think Seijin would be the more appropriate pronunciation in the former case; but shoujin just sounds kind of weird to me.

@Bibi: Death personified isn't really a biblical concept, but rather goes back to the Greeks, who had Thanatos, who the Romans later reinterpreted as Mors. Both words simply mean "death," as do the names for Death personified in every Indo-European language I've seen it in (la Mort, der Tod, etc.). However, the concept of a Grim Reaper had probably become crystalized enough, in Western society, as a personification not necessarily meaning the same thing as the actual word, that by the time the Japanese adopted it, "Death God" seemed more appropriate to them. The appellation of the word god is entirely incidental to both the concept and the linguistic and mythological origins, therefore, which would make the true opposite to Death personified Life personified; and even if we wanted to take a more Judeo-Christian approach to it, as you said yourself, in that tradition we see an "angel of death" rather than any kind of deific entity, and that angel, as an angel, works on behalf of God, making God not death's opposite, but its origin. Or we could go with Revelations, where Death is one of the four horsemen of the apocalypse, though, as the conquest of Death by God is inevitable in Revelations, we can't really call God Death's opposite—that would be ascribing far more power to Death than a religion with a single, omnipotent God really allows.

This has been your boring weekly lecture by Vagrere.

ArtemisA
10-13-2009, 12:07 AM
Aha, I was just thinking of parallel construction. In that case, perhaps Seishin or Shoushin would be more palatable readings for 生神? Though I think Seijin would be the more appropriate pronunciation in the former case; but shoujin just sounds kind of weird to me.
Hm yeah. I sort of like Seishin (and would you actually morph the consonant there?).

And, good lecture, not boring at all.

Vagrere
10-13-2009, 04:32 PM
I'm only going with my intuition here (since I'm self-taught and have no authorities to turn to), but that seems to be right more often than it's wrong about this kind of thing. Not that it isn't wrong plenty of times.

But I guess if I had to come up with a justification for it, it would be a comparison to 雷神 (Raijin), which seems like a similar situation as far as consonant morphology goes.